Reader Chris writes:
Awhile back, I sold a ton of video games on Craigslist here in San Francisco. A buyer contacted me and agreed to purchase them and I was delighted. I didn’t have the time to post everything on eBay separately and I wanted to get the transaction over as quickly as possible. A week later, I received a Wal-mart money order in the mail and shipped off the packages.
Little did I know that money orders are just as easily faked as any other form of payment, so after a day or so after depositing the bogus money order into my Wells Fargo account, I got notice that my ATM card had been put on hold, as well as my checking and savings account funds. Confused, I stopped by my local Wells Fargo, who alerted me that the money order was fraudulent and that more than likely, their Security and Fraud department would be permanently closing my accounts. Frustrated, I tried to ask them why I would be the one getting the punishment when I was an unknowing victim of fraud. Unfortunately, the on-location staff had no answer and suggested I give the actual department a call on the phone. But first, they would fill out a fraud report and forward it to their Security and Fraud department.
So, I did, and got even more frustrating results. The man I spoke to was disinterested and dismissive, telling me that I should probably just prepare for my accounts to be closed. When I asked if there was any sort of recourse or action I could undertake to try to keep my accounts open, he simply said, “that’s not going to do you any good.” Even more insane was the fact that they claimed not to have received the fraud report I had personally filled out at the Wells Fargo location near my place of work.
Frustrated, out of the items I had sold, out of the money I had been scammed out of, and staring at the bleak possibility of having my credit or bank accounts ruined, I decided to do what I think most people out there don’t do – file a police report.
I’m not overly cautious person, but I was glad that I had saved every single email from the scammer, from the first email where he contacted me to the last. As expected, emailing the scammer didn’t do much good, as he wouldn’t response, despite the fact that I had put read-receipts on the emails I sent him and had gotten confirmation that they had been open. But, I did noticed that the scammer apparently was using an AOL account to access the Internet. And, if he was using AOL, he was probably also using AOL Instant Messenger. So, I added his AOL name to my AIM buddy list and voila, there he was.
Our exchange went down pretty much as I figured it was. I confronted him about the fake money order, he tried to defend himself by saying he had purchased them off eBay. I laid out to him exactly all the steps I was going through to protect myself (filing a police report in San Francisco, filing a police report in Pennsylvania where the scammer resided, filing a report with the State Attorney General’s Office, etc). At that point he got extremely defensive, threatened me, and referred me to his legal counsel, which conveniently enough had a Yahoo email address (go figure).
After filing reports for what seemed like forever, I expected nothing to come of my claims. I was ready to cut my losses and learn a valuable lesson at the same time. Well, I learned my lesson, but was entirely surprised when I was contacted by a computer crimes officer in Pennsylvania who was investigating the scammer and needed my help. Luckily, I had saved all of my emails with him, including the AIM chat logs. Needless to say, this ended up being enough to get this guy arrested. Here is the link to the newspaper article that ran when the guy was arrested:It seems like he had been scamming folks for some time, but I’m happy to see that maybe, in some sort of way, my case was the straw that broke the camel’s back.
Although it looks like I won’t be getting back either the money I was scammed out of or the items I sent the scammer, this whole situation does give me some renewed faith in the police and the fact that reporting a crime, even one originating on the seemingly lawless Internet, can result in some justice.
Oh, and to give you an update on Wells Fargo, both the investigating officer and myself tried repeatedly to get them to fax us a copy of the fake money order for use in the criminal investigation. And, both times, Wells Fargo actually faxed both of us the wrong money order (and at that, money order’s that are obviously from someone else’s account). Needless to say, I think I’ll be changing banks very soon.
But for those folks out there who’ve gotten scammed, I hope my story gives you a bit of hope that scammers do get punished.
Thanks,
Chris
Here’s the newspaper article that Chris mentioned. Turns out the guy was already on parole for sexual assault! Chris is like Batman!
Known Internet scammer in county prison for fake money orders
——————————————————————————–
CENTER TWP — A reputed Internet scam artist is in the Butler County Prison today following his arrest Thursday for allegedly sending a counterfeit money order to a California man for more than 200 video games.The case, according to state police Cpl. John Stepansky, a computer crime investigator at the Butler barracks, should serve as a reminder: let the online buyer beware.
Federal authorities already suspected Justin M. Castilyn, 28, of Holyoke Road, Center Township of scamming eight victims when the state police arrested him in the latest case.
Police said Castilyn by way of Craigslist.com, an online classified ads site, agreed in August to buy 212 video games from a San Francisco man.
The seller told police he shipped the games to Castilyn’s home after receiving a money order for $1,950. But then learned the money order was fake.
Stepansky said that during his investigation he learned of the defendant’s past victims after contacting the Internet Crime Complaint Center, a partnership of the FBI and the nonprofit National White Collar Crime Center.
Castilyn in those other cases failed to either provide merchandise or pay for products from online transactions.
Police got a search warrant on Thursday and seized two computers as well as 12 other suspected counterfeit money orders from the defendant’s house, documents said.District Judge Lewis Stoughton arraigned Castilyn on charges of forgery, access device fraud, receiving stolen property and unlawful use of a computer.
Already on parole for a 2000 conviction in a sexual assault case in Butler County, Castilyn remains in the county jail on $75,000 bond.
Police reminded computer users to be alert when buying products online. Stepansky recommended dealing with reputable businesses.
Known Internet scammer in county prison for fake money orders [Butler Eagle]
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Another resource to remember is the Postal Inspection Service. If the mail is involved, you can submit a complaint online at [postalinspectors.uspis.gov] The more prolific the thief is, the larger the chance of a federal investigation.
You won’t see them mentioned much, since they actually do work instead of holding press conferences.
i feel really bad for this guy’s situation with the scammer and worse for his situation with his bank. what an jerk of a bank.
@Skeptic: Erm, being a victim doesnt make it your fault. I fail to see the logic in this statement.
I agree with Darkened, TRUJUNGLIST, etc. Get rid of all the cops! That’ll make the world much better. They never do anything good and only cause harm!
Seriously, I wish there was a place in this country where no local or state law enforcement agencies had any jurisdiction. That way all these cop-bashers would have a utopia for themselves, free of the police who menace them so. I’m sure it would prove to be a real paradise. More importantly, it’d shut these idiots up.
@CumaeanSibyl: Wow.
@trujunglist: Not going to go into the rest of this, but the car in your driveway … I would have pushed it out into the street. Not my problem then, is it? It’ll get hauled off right quick when it’s on public property blocking the right of way.
@trujunglist: LOLZ at the thought that you actually think people would read that whole thing. I stopped at “Another time…” because I realized I didn’t give a crap.
I think this guy and Darkened watched Training Day too many times. Yes, some cops are dirty, but that’s a small percentage compared to the total number of police in this country. Most cops do their jobs decently and well, and considering the things they deal with on a regular basis, I admire that. Sure, a lot of them have attitudes and act like jerk-offs, but wouldn’t you if your days and/or nights were spent dealing with junkies, rapists, thieves, drunks, murderers, etc?
“@public enemy #1:
“I think you need to change the title of the post. It makes it sound like the guy who filed the police report got arrested.”
Agreed. The title would make more sense if it was something like, “Reader Files A Police Report On Craigslist Scammer Leading To Scammer’s Arrest”
Much props to Chris for getting the scammer arrested.
@Buran: Woopsy, forgot this wasn’t Wonkette. Though, apparently, I’m not the only one who mistook this for a shouty political blog.
@Bay State Darren: Many internet-style libertarians — not all, but a lot — are convinced that the real obstacle to their success in life is those damn nannies in Washington.
I, too, would love to give them the chance to prove it.
A good uplifting story. I am always happy to hear when scammers and thieves get caught and put behind bars. The best part of this story would be if the person who reported this crime finally gets paid.
@CumaeanSibyl: Thanks. And thanks to all other people defending the police in this thread. [I've been on my own for previous "discussions" of law enforcement on this site. It feels nice to not be the lone voice of sanity.] Although I must retract my previous statement that my proposal would shut such idiots up, no amount of reality ever will.
I like how the article says “let the online buyer beware.”
Sound advice, for sure, but in this particular case, the buyer was the con-artist. Are they suggesting he should have been more careful so as to avoid getting caught?
I love that a poster was all, “Yeah, Ron Paul all the way!” Um, no.
People like darkened and trujunglist care me.
If you are stupid enough to accept a money order sent to you through somebody on the internet, you deserve what you get.
I prefer Paypal over money orders, but it’s still awesome that the police report led to his arrest. Plus, that newspaper is from my hometown, though I’m now in California
Snitching… Lucky it was San Francisco and Pennsylvania instead of Los Angeles and New York…
Oh well. You live, your learn. Take Paypal or Cash…
Wells Fargo should be nicer…
@discounteggroll: Yeah, but would turn down the buyer just because they weren’t in San Jose?
@Buran: Most have a Napoleon Complex.
@Skeptic: Wasn’t the electronics banking bit from ’06 supposed to fix this? Of course, I just got a notice from one bank that ACH transfer will now on only be reported on the monthly statements.
@miran: Hmm, do you bank with Chase, the bank that won’t process a check because they haven’t heard of the bank it was written on?
“Odd. I have never done anything to even warrant being questioned.
I have never had a taser aimed at me.
Seems if you just keep your nose clean, you need not worry about anything you describe.”
And your point is what now?
Yes, most people will never deal with the police for anything more than a traffic violation. That, however, does NOT mean that some people aren’t jerked around.
A local guy was arrested recently for allegedly robbing several banks. While he did slightly resemble the guy on the video taken in the banks, he was completely innocent. It cost him $20,000 in lawyers’ fees to straighten things out. The FBI didn’t even apologize to him.
The fact that shit hasn’t happened to YOU is not proof that it doesn’t happen.
Chris, It is not hard to contact the court or the probation department and have, as a condition of his probation, reimbursement to you.
I have little sympathy for people who are dumb enough to take money orders for Craigslist transactions and ship items to buyers; they only have about 20 warnings all over the website to NOT do exactly that.
About waiting for checks or money orders to clear: wait until they REALLY clear, not until your bank frees the money.
Actual clearing time is 7 to 10 days (think about how long it takes to process the check at the receiver’s bank, ship it physically to the writer’s bank, and then process it)… not the 2-3 days that most banks claims is the “clearing” time. You’re actually on the hook for a bounced check if it ends up being bogus, even if you waited until your bank gave the initial OK.
Another common scam is someone writes you a money order or check for more htan the amount of the item. Then they politely ask you to return the difference, letting you keep a little for yourself. Same scam, basically — but in that case, the goods are never actually exchanged.
Craigslist rocks… but people, deal with someone you can meet face-to-face. eBay works because of the supervision and feedback they provide. I’m sure there are more than enough horror stories about both services, but those are usually because people forgot to turn their brains on and use common sense.
Don’t accept money orders, personal checks, Western Union, wire transfers, etc. on craigslist. Deal face-to-face with someone and in cold, hard cash. It’s easier, and a whole lot safer.
BTW, I’ve had over a dozen transactions on craigslist without a hitch (and a few more up there right now).
@junkmail: His presumed hatred of all cops may be due to a personal incidence, which doesn’t excuse it but makes it more understandable. Unfortunately, many cops out there are people who didn’t go to college, have a gun and a nearly free licence to use it (there have been many well described cases where cops fired first when they should have asked questions instead), and finally we have many evidences that there is a good deal of corruption amongst police and their depts. Sooooooo, perhaps we shouldn’t hate the symptoms of the disease, but hate the disease itself and do our best to treat it effectively. We have the ability to place systems of checks and balances into any existing systems/systems, then step back and see if that makes it better or worse. It’s systems theory 101. Our government needs to take that class. Our police depts need to take that class. EVERYONE needs to take that class, and start taking personal responsibility for themselves and for their country.
eofm.
People, if you have to accept a money order, make sure you ONLY accept USPS postal money orders. They can only be purchased at a post office, and you can cash them on the spot at the post office right before you ship the item. If it’s a fake money order it will be caught then, you won’t ship the items, and you won’t have fees and issues with your bank.
Occasionally I have to take money orders when I sell on eBay, and I tell the customer I will return any money order that isn’t a USPS money order. Honest customers have no problem with that and send the correct money order, but the scammers never contact you again.
So, poor “Chris” didn’t have time to deal with Ebay, but now it’s costing him much more time to deal with his bank etc. Moral or this story, stay with Ebay for something like this, you’re protected that way. And remember, cashiers checks can be easily faked too. PayPal my friend!
@rg: Paypal and Ebay are in no way guarantees of a successful (read:non-scammer) transactions.
Kudos, Chris wat to fight the good fight and stick with it!
@Buran:
Why do people dislike cops? You mean, aside from their power tripping and the number of instances of brutality, corruption and laziness? It may only be a small number of police (about….oh, 30%, I’d guess) who are unethical and corrupt, but one thing all police are is arrogant.
Never forget: that police are NOT the law, they do NOT decide the law, and most imporantly, they are NOT *above* the law, those most police think they are all three. The police are only there to enforce the law, that’s it. Those who criticize the critics of police seem to have forgotten that.
That should have read, “though most police think…”, not “those”. I missed the word on a re-edit.
As for the article, kudos to Chris. It’s another example of the golden rule: keep receipts and document everything. (The golden rule being, “Protect your gold, because no one else will”.)
I also try to keep the original packaging: store the boxes flat (to save space) and the foam packing in a bag or box (use a marker to write the product’s name on the foam) if you think you might need it again.
It wouldn’t surprise me if the scum – er, scammer – bought the games because he was branching out into molesting children because women were too strong.
Hi everyone, it’s Chris, the guy who wrote this tip in to Consumerist. Just wanted to update everyone that on Friday, I received a letter in the mail from the scammer, sent from the Butler County Jail. As I expected it would, it was an attempt to try to butter me up, humanize his situation, and get me to drop the charges against him.
Just a few summaries of the sprawling, hand-written letter:
1. Justin claims he was also ripped off in that he had a “dropshipper” of his rip me off, and then sell him the stolen games.
2. Justin has a child on the way and is the sole bread winner of his family.
3. He’s tried hard to make something of himself since he got out of prison.
4. He’s willing to settle out of court.
I guess he didn’t think I’d ever look this story up on the Internet and realize that his dropshipper story was BS. Sorry, but it’s going to be hard to convince me that one of your buddies set you up, when the cops seize 12 fake money orders at your apartment. Sigh. Thanks for the kind comments and I’ll keep updating as soon as I have more details on what’s going on!
chris
Actually drop shippers happen all the time. I’m surprised he even knew the term. I don’t want to be the one sappy person here, but I’ve dealt with a lot of scammers and most of them usually are a pretty sad case. They are smart enough to think of something other than physical crimes (robbing a store) to feed their families but have trouble keeping jobs.
Do you think the guy is really going to do this again after actually going to jail? No. Probably not, my guess is this a a semi-computer person who did it to get some money in a hurry one time, and it just kept getting out of hand…
I don’t know what to say..
You know, it’s possible that the FBI and other police agencies actually haven’t acted on this and that the officer who contacted the OP was actually the scammer and a friend. Adding an article of this nature with assumed names to a web-based local newspaper was probably icing on the cake. OP goes away happy, criminal continues conducting business.
It’s a possibility, anyway.
@lincolnparadox:
LOL, banks look after themselves, silly human!
@mariospants:
All he would have to do is get a copy of the police report. Technically he could also report the guy for mail fraud as well.
no, no, no…
It’s RuPaul in 08!
She’ll work it, work it to the left, work it, work it to the right! Sashay, sashay, Chante’! See? Bi-partisan!
We are trying to catch a Craigslist airline ticket, limo, and Subway
catering scammer and crook out of the Los Angeles area…
http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4SUNA_enUS233US233&q=soutthwest+prolific+scammer+craigslist
http://freespeechstore.com/Qresults.asp?Search_Keyword=craigslist&btnSearch2=Find+Speech
The most frustrating part of this whole story was the way you were treated by your bank! There should be some recourse for the little person to force banks to treat them reasonably. Also, I can’t believe even the police couldn’t get results from the bank.
There is a website that allows you to post the email address and a description of a scam if you are approached by a scammer on Craigslist. It is called craigslistofscammers – just Google it.