scorpius_malfoy

My phone is also subsidized by my career, at a 900 min a month plan; all-in, with internet and the all important text messaging packages the bill comes to around $100 a month - which I pay about $20 of. Glancing at past statements, I averaged around 650-800 min a month, not one of those minutes poorly used.

I do not have a land line in my house, and ignore my office phone, so that obviously inflates my wireless minutes. I'll totally concur there are cell phone abusers out there, who just call people to call (waiting in line, driving home, etc), and are a bane on civilization. (How annoying is the call, "hey, what you doing?")

Consider this topic official dead.

bedofnails

I have a decent phone, so if I lose it I'm out ~$150 between the replacement cost and the potentially used up minutes. If I'd bummed it and used one of the many decent $20 nokias and whatnot on ebay (new) I'd be out $70 maximum. If you're foolish enough to lose a cellphone, $70 is a small price to pay, and there's no reason why you need that many minutes on your phone. Also, who knows what the replacement cost is for these women and what contract breaking fines they may get hit with.

As a previous commenter said, lock your phones and turn them off when not on your person. Commonsense.

EtherealStrife

She didn't say that she knew the phone was gone before she left on the trip - you didn't read all the posts. She didn't know it was gone until the trip was almost over. She figured ot when it was stolen when the bill came after she called it in. Also, you are mistaken about the credit card analogy. The credit card company would refund all the fraudulent charges no matter what the circumstances were.

I love how everyone is so perfect here - I'm sure you all lock your phones, read your contracts word for word, and keep an eagle eye on your phone at all times no matter what. Pluuuh-eeeze. You'd be whining just as loud if it was you.

And, you sound like you work for AT&T and are an ass as well.

monkey_mania

Those of you with prepay accounts, do you have an alternate phone; like a house phone, business cell, etc? I cannot fathom being charged .10 a minute for normal usage.

bedofnails

I find it hard to believe she didn't have time to do any of those things. Fine she was leaving on a sailboat, but if someone broke into your house would you wait to call the police, or do it right away? This may be a bad example but you get my point.

The policy does state that you must report the loss immediately and you won't be responsible if the phone somehow does incur charges.

As for AT&T selling porn, they don't. But that doesn't mean you can't go to some other site on the web and purchase the material. AT&T just bills what the phone buys.

One final piece of advice: Activate parental controls on your phone. If you would have done that, the thief would have had to enter a password to access the web and to call internationally.

mikecolione

Theyre one in the same. Its the customers responsibility to report the theft in a timely manner. She did not do so, which I say because I have used a cellphone on a boat in the BVI and know it to be possible. The boat captains arent scurvy pirates from an old novel, they are regular people who, very often, are talking on their cellphones while navigating. The BVI has a 21st century infrastructure in place. It isnt like youre on Gilligans Island or something... phone service is there, access to phones, be they land line or cell phone, is there. In this case, the customer was negligent.

Dr.Ph0bius

I was going to say the same thing. I think people are under the impression that "sailing" somehow involves technology from the early 1900's. These boats have cell phone, satellite phones, ship to shore radios... you name it.

I hate AT&T. I mean, I seriously LOATHE them! But I get the impression that this girls phone was stolen and she didnt want to deal with it till the trip was over.

Just my opinion.

Dr.Ph0bius

fallenone

It's not our fault you don't find it convenient to use 5 minutes to have your phone suspended before your sail. Then you expect us to look the other way and get rid of the charges when you find it convenient to call up? You call the person who stole the phone an ass, but you had just a big of a part Jennifer. You waited. You incurred those charges yourself.

fallenone

If the bigger cellular service providers will not take care of their customers, then screw them. No more contracts. Dump them the next time they raise their rates.

kbarrett

Meg Marco

Shaun

fallenone

Now a lot of the responses above aren't looking at the legal or practical situation. They're blaming AT&T for bad policies. Well, yeah, but that's outside the scope of things. Ideally they'd do for everyone exactly what Citibank does for me, i.e., monitor usage behavior and prevent these things from happening in the first place. However that's the subject of another story.

balthisar

Yes, I would say the same thing, if someone (a) knew that someone who looked just like him had stolen his ID and safe deposit box key and (b) did nothing about it.

JustAGuy2

bedofnails

So, did your charter trip start from St. John? If so, which island in the BVI's did you choose to clear customs? Because any customs house in the BVI's would have a phone. You said "I didn't even realize it was missing until two days before we got off the boat, but even if I had, the cell service in the BVIs for US carriers is non-existent where we were..." So hightail it back to the nearest anchorage with a phone and call.

If you are savvy enough charter a sailboat and cruise in the BVI's, then you should also know enough to call AT&T to report the missing phone ASAP. You said you didn't call AT&T until you got back to the states. Say what? Couldn't find a phone back in St. John?

Since you are here defending your position, feel free to post your charter trip route. I'd love to see where you were.

chopchopturtleboy

cbear

I wasn't there, neither were you. Based on the information that the OP provided, it appears highly likely that her claim that it wasn't possible for her to inform AT&T that her phone had been stolen could more accurately be expressed as "I figured it wasn't my problem, so I didn't try very hard, and now I'm trying to defend myself." Given that _her_ AT&T wireless phone could readily roam on CCT's GSM network, I see no reason why one of her friends' phones couldn't do the same. OP has never even claimed that she _tried_ to call on multiple occasions and couldn't get signal.

Buran, OP posted a story here asking for feedback. My opinion is that her complaint isn't valid, and that she should abandon her efforts. You're welcome to disagree, but I'm very comfortable in declining to comply with your "respectful" request that I "shut my mouth" so as not to pollute this board with positions that you find inconvenient or distasteful.

JustAGuy2

Buran

Buran

a_m_m_b

mattisimo

"Do you say the same thing when people get their safe deposit boxes cleaned out, or when someone gets held responsible for multiple thousands of dollars of mistakes, too?"

I think your analogy button is broke.

bedofnails

Buran

Buran

Do you say the same thing when people get their safe deposit boxes cleaned out, or when someone gets held responsible for multiple thousands of dollars of mistakes, too?

Buran

You weren't there. I respectfully suggest you shut your mouth right now. Or bash your keyboard. Or whatever.

I just love how people on the net think they know better than the people who were there.

Not.

Buran

I appreciate all the constructive comments and helpful hints - I will definitely keep going until I run out of options. Again, I have to say - my point is getting lost here - the policy is lame. Even if you can prove it is fraud, AT&T doesn't care and doesn't try and prevent it, - I want other people to realize that so the same thing doesn't happen to them.

PillowFightGirl

@Bigroblee:Csp changes constantly. Your info is out of date.

@PILLOWFIGHTGIRL: I realize that losing the phone is ultimately my responsibility, but AT&T should treat this type of fraud as other companies (such as credit card companies) do.

Can you name for me any industry other than the credit card industry that does this?

cac67

Cowboys_fan

Cowboys_fan

bigroblee

floofy

Carelessness categorized as victimization? Sweet.

bedofnails

Pick up your piece of chalk and write: "lesson learned."

bedofnails

Well, I don't know where you were in the BVIs, but I have a hard time believing that you never anchored on Tortola, Jost, Virgin Gorda, or the Dogs. Anyone with a Verizon phone would have had coverage there.

None of your friends may have activated their international roaming, but that's hardly AT&T's fault.

AT&T should clearly be responsible for any fraudulent charges after you notified them. Until you notify them, however, they're not going to intervene. Credit card companies notify you because your card # can be stolen without you knowing - not true with cellphones.

Bottom line, you were careless, and are now trying to avoid the consequences. You might get AT&T to forgive the charges to keep you, if you're a valuable customer, but you certainly don't have any moral or legal claim that they do so.

JustAGuy2

No sympathy for contract whores

EtherealStrife

chrisfromnl

Buran

Buran

Buran

My entire point is that the policy stinks. Fraud should be treated like fraud and companies like AT&T should try and protect their consumers from obvious fraud instead of passing the buck. I realize that losing the phone is ultimately my responsibility, but AT&T should treat this type of fraud as other companies (such as credit card companies) do and at least pretend like they are doing something to protect the consumer from theft.

BTW - I had the name of one of the movies wrong. It was "Wild Pillow Fight Girls" not "Pillow Fight Girls 3" I didn't want any of you out there searching for the wrong title to download on your RAZR.

PillowFightGirl

That's exactly what I was thinking.

I made $700 in purchases one Sunday morning and the next day, my CC called me at 9:30 or so wanting to verify the charges (or alert me that my card might have been stolen).

When somebody regularly pays the $40 or $60 plus tax for years and then suddenly runs into the hundreds with random foreign calls in downloads, somebody ought to investigate. But, since they have no legal liability to forgive the charges, they can tell the customer to pay up or get their credit screwed.

Hawk07

In any case, if you lose your wallet and some creep spends all your cash, should your employer be on the hook for the cash because they're the ones who provide the money?

balthisar

yg17

Don't think this will work? Citibank screwed my account up and charged me over $1,500 in interest at 36% due to their mistake. They agreed to put my interest rate back where it belonged but refused to credit the $1,500. I spent over an hour on the phone begging, pleading, then finally threatening a supervisor with no luck. She insisted they had a policy and they "do not, ever" credit interest. I told her I'd declare bankruptcy and stick them for the entire $20k balance if she didn't fix this. She told me to go right ahead and do so.

On a hunch, I called back a week later (after filing complaints with the BBB, state attorney generals, etc). I played it off as if this was my first call, started from scratch, explained the situation. CSR this time said, "We're so sorry for the mistake. I'll credit this right away."

AT&T will do the same thing, I can all but guarantee it. Don't work through their chain of command, just keeping calling until someone does the right thing. I got AT&T to sell me a new Razr at the same price new customers would pay (they had a "deal" that wasn't valid for existing customers, even if I signed a new contract - I wasn't under contract at the time); I called 4 different times, first 3 reps gave me 3 different reasons why they could not do it. 4th rep said, "Sure, not a problem."

jimconsumer

RumorsDaily

JustIcedCoffee

Or use prepaid accounts as someone suggested. I have t-mobile to go and $0.10 per minute is perfect for my needs and I cant lose more than $100 if the phone is lost or stolen.

geek22

Frankly, I call shenanigans. I've been cruising in the BVIs, and you're RARELY out of cell coverage, except maybe on the run out to Anagada. Certainly, the vast majority of anchorages have coverage, so she could have called in within a day or two, at most. She didn't want to be bothered to call in, so I fail to see how AT&T should have to eat the cost.

JustAGuy2

ahdn

@Buran: Ah, ok. Thanks

@Consumerist: AWW! It was FUNNY!

Rectilinear Propagation

acambras

Honestly, this report stinks.

I'm one of the very last people you'll find defending AT&T, but its pathetic that she couldn't contact someone to report the phone stolen, I find it strange that she either wouldn't notice the phone was stolen until after leaving port, and I can almost -assure- you that there is a phone line or internet connection somewhere on that cruise ship.

Whether or not you have reception, on a cruise of this nature I highly doubt that a cruise employee couldn't get you in touch with AT&T. They must have some method of communication, and I'll wager that they have phones and that she was either too lazy to look up the 1-800 number for AT&T or simply felt that it wasn't her responsibility to take care of it immeadiately.

KIRZEN2007

Macroy

Don't go sailing across the world until the company is notified of your phone being lost/stolen.

If you fail to notify CC companies in a reasonable period of time, you ARE liable for those charges. Take a look at your contracts there too.

@bedofnails: and Agreed.

AngrySicilian

Yes. What I was being charged for -- song downloads that clearly weren't mine -- are intangibles. By that I mean, because someone used my phone to download a copy of "Brenda Got a Baby," that doesn't mean that no one else can now download a copy of "Brenda Got a Baby." It also doesn't mean that T-Mobile has to now spend money to buy more units of "Brenda Got a Baby."

I was completely in the wrong. I admitted to being completely in the wrong in the phone call with the customer service rep -- that I should have reported the phone as missing sooner. (And yes: I lost it. No one "stole" it, so much as it was picked up from where I left it.)

What bothered me was how, with all the information that T-Mobile had on me as a customer, they couldn't see that (a) these song downloads were not something I would do; and that (b) waiving the charges is a nice, customer-servicey thing to do.

Maude Buttons

Personal responsibility, what a concept.

TexasScout

Softer.

bedofnails

Not likely.

bedofnails

yg17

theWolf

I'm begrudgingly taking Ma Bell's side on this one. What's to stop me from downloading nearly a gig of porn on my 5MB data plan, and then calling and reporting the phone stolen to get around the charges?

She's very clear that this happened before she got on the boat. How long before is the key.

BillyShears

The intelligent person would draft a letter and cc appropriate parties, enclosing proof of her extenuation circumstance (maybe even a police report from her first port of call), etc; not whine about her lack of appropriate action and thieves viewing choices.

In the end, owning a phone and signing that contract is a responsibility. AT&T is right in that it is the contract holder's responsibility for the where'abouts of her phone and the calls made to and from.

It's funny how easily "I forgot my phone somewhere" always becomes "they stole it and racked up charges!"

bedofnails

ptkdude

hoosier45678

I remember being a kid and watching Telly Savalas, or somebody, telling us about Traveler's checks. Remember those? If some douche-y looking guy stole your man-purse you would be hosed. Now that we're in the 21st century, they've reformulated the thought by saying, "Hey! If some douche-y looking guy steals your credit card, you don't have to worry. Those purchases made in Dominica by the douche won't count against you."

Why can't AT&T get their sh!t together on this? How are transactions via one media any differently than another? Total bullcrap.

Raze50

Agreed... that narrows the age of the thief down to about 12-14.

timmus

Did you not even read the article? How about the part where they are in the middle of the Atlantic ocean?

Jaysyn was banned for: http://consumerist.com/5032912/the-subprime-meltdown-will-be-nothing-compared-to-the-prime-meltdown#c7042646

I left my phone on a Metro train on Friday night, didn't realize until Sunday (because I call no one and no one calls me -- I have a cell phone because I am desperate for acceptance, any kind), and called the phone in. When I got my next bill, whoever had been kind enough to find my phone also thought they deserved some kind of finders' fee of a lot of crappy-assed rap songs. Like "Brenda Got a Baby" and something with "Sticky" in the title. My bill was over $300.

So, I call T-Mobile to complain. And I complain to T-Mobile for over an hour. The woman kept explaining the policy, and I kept saying, "I'm not disagreeing; I'm just hoping that, as a piece of customer service, you keep this from being such an expensive lesson to me." I argued history with the representative, too: "In the three years I've had the phone, have I ever downloaded anything?" She says no. "Have I ever even approached my 700 'Whenever' minutes?" Again, no.

Finally, finally, the woman transfers me to a supervisor, who says that as a once-in-a-lifetime courtesy, she will waive these charges. ONCE. But if it ever happens again, T-Mobile will never show me mercy again.

I'm stuck with the bastards for another year. And then, I'm cutting them loose.

Maude Buttons

rrapynot

AlteredBeast

But seriously.. there was NO way she could contact ATT regarding her stolen phone? No ports had phone service? I hate dealing with ATT as much as anyone possibly could (I have Callvantage service at work)... but I think I can see where ATT is coming from on holding her to at least some of those charges.

AngrySicilian

ptkdude

Still, I did that with mine -- it is better than no protection at all. And you can't even copy the card, at least with the SIM duplication gizmos cell stores have, without this PIN. I know this because I've been with someone when they got a new SIM card to replace an older one with less storage capacity, and the SIM duplicator (looked like a guitar pick) prompted for the PIN first. So it will also provide some protection against phone cloning.

Buran

Buran

Buran

sleze69

Meg Marco

jake2600

Didn't someone say in that other post that you can password protect your cell phone? I can't remember if that's for all calls or only international calls.

Rectilinear Propagation

foghat81

ribex

donnie5

amazon

Jaysyn was banned for: http://consumerist.com/5032912/the-subprime-meltdown-will-be-nothing-compared-to-the-prime-meltdown#c7042646

Skiffer

SaveMeJeebus

Mmm... Tasty, tasty soft corn porn.

markwm