It doesn't end there:

[coconutgrovegrapevine.blogspot.com]

Plus it's TAKEOUT. I give a 10% tip for takeout and I think that's totally acceptable. The person who brings you a takeout order put it together and put it in a bag. They didn't spend the whole night going back and forth from the kitchen to your table, refilling drinks, etc.

She should have filled in the total as 15.96 and disputed with the credit card company.

@punkrawka: I still think that is generous, LOL.

this is the type of consumerist I have missed so much!

pretty soon they're gonna be charging gratuity for gratuity.

This is because nobody tips for takeout, and the salary structure of the employees in those carside takeout businesses expect it due to their low salaries.

Assuming a 15% mandatory gratuity (which @walterny's posted link suggests) the gratuity was calculated off of the pre-tax total. They just chose to put it in after the post-tax total which is misleading.

$17.16 X .15 = 2.574
$18.53 X .15 = 2.7795

It's still not excusable as, if my local Johnny Rockets is anything like the one mentioned above, the food is so-so and the service sucks and the food is only ok.

I've always tipped for takeout. This will be a first, but I'm not really on the customer's side on this one. Yeah, making it an add on is kind of ridiculous, but making a big stink out of it seems cheap. There are times where you may be technically in the right, but aren't really, if that makes sense. I understand why the employees reacted that way. I might have done the same thing.

You know, that's a pretty stupid racket, as rackets go. Take a low-paying cashier job, then make a habit of asking your customers for contributions to make up the difference between what you make and what you would rather be making. The servers earn their tips. What does a cashier earn?

Jesus, when I was working at Macy's in college, I gave people generous helpings of my time and advice. I always got compliments on how helpful I was. I made close to minimum wage, no commissions. Maybe I should have had my hand out like these cashiers do, eh?

Fracking beggars.

Just so you are clear, they are not doing anything illegal, and they are properly putting the gratuity post tax:

Rule 12A-1.061(3) (c), F.A.C. expresses that any charges made by a dealer to a customer for gratuities, tips, or similar charges are taxable as part of the total sales price unless both of the following conditions are met:

• The charge is separately stated as a gratuity, tip, or other similar charge on a guest's or tenant's bill, invoice, or other tangible evidence of sale; and

• The owner or owner's representative does not receive, either directly or indirectly, any economic benefit from the charge

A gratuity charge collected by a private member-owned club [Restaurant] is not subject to sales tax. Since, the charge is billed separately to Club members and identified as a service charge, and the full amount collected is distributed to the Club employees, with
no benefit from the gratuity charge received by the Club, the charge qualifies as a nontaxable gratuity. Whether the charge is billed by the Club to the members monthly, quarterly, or annually has no bearing on whether the charge is subject to sales tax.

@speedwell: But cashiers are paid more. Restaurant servers aren't paid minimum wage. If they were, I'd be in total agreement. But, if a worker is taking time away from working tables where they'd be getting a tip to work the take out shift, I'm going to make up the diffence, particularly since I'm using the take out as a convenience over having to actually go in and stit down at a table and waiting longer. This is why I think making an issue out of it was pretty crappy and why I don't blame the employee for just voiding her sale.

And they dare ask for an additional tip? That's even more rude.

I always give a generous tip for wait staff that actually DESERVE it. When a place starts adding it in themselves or makes the tip mandatory their service drops to non-existent. Anytime I get a bill that has that 'done for me' I know its the last time I'm eating there.

@TKWarrior:

Are you as commitedly capitalist in your other discussions?

@TKWarrior: I agree with you. That's awfully rude. A tip is a thing you're supposed to deserve and that is to my discretion. In fact, a tip is something that isn't even mandatory. It's you that decides if you give one or not.

Anyone or any business that expects a tip doesn't deserve one. A tip is for good service received, not a required part of the bill.

If they're so demanding of the extra money, then they should raise the menu prices by a dollar or two. I'd rather know I had to pay more than put up with that bullshit.

I've never done carside pick up, but when I pick up food to go I normally give the person a couple of bucks but not 15%. 15-20% is for service, when I pick up food I'm doing most of the serving.

Also, as an aside, this is very common in South Florida.

A lot of places have gratuity added to orders. They should have something about it mentioned in the menu somewhere. If they don't have it listed or posted then it is worth fighting.

@cosby: That's true. How can it be legal? That's like an hidden fee.

Quaker Steak and Lube over here does the same thing on their Unlimited Wings Tuesday's. They forcefully add 15% gratuity to everyone's order, and the hilarious part is that if I pay with cash, the server will bring back more 5's and 1's expecting me to leave an additional tip.

Sorry, but if your company must force a gratuity on me when its 4 or less people, no additional tip. Yes, I do sound asinine, but that's how it works. You're getting enough by charging 15% PER PERSON.

@KJones: This is why we should be fighting for fair wages for restaurant workers. The whole tip system should be abandoned. As long as I use restaurants, whether dining in or taking out, I tip, but I'd fully support a living wage for waiters/waitresses and abolishing the tip system.

tip for TAKEOUT??? Like MCDONALDS???? WTF difference is there between McDonalds takeout and Johnny Rockets takeout? Tipping a register droid???? NEVER have i heard of such a thing. Tipping is for SERVICE. WHAT SERVICE IS THERE IN PUTTING YOUR BURGER IN A PAPER BAG?

you people are insane.

For those of you who don't know it, Coconut Grove is a total tourist trap, so most of their patrons are visitors (MANY foreigners) who aren't familiar with our customs. You very rarely see locals eating at JR's... So, basically they are counting on most people not knowing the tip is a scam... I especially love how they leave the line there on the receipt for you to add even more of a tip! I'll make a point of NEVER recommending them to ANYBODY. Shady business!!!

@betatron: The difference is the McDonald's employees don't depend on tips for their wages. If you use takeout, you're using an employee who depends on tips and taking time from waiting on those tables where they'd get the tips. You're also using the takeout as a convenience for a sit down restaurant because you get your food faster than if you went in and sat down. I don't get why people think it's so ridiculous to tip for takeout. I'm against tacking on gratuity, but given the amount of people who flip out over tipping for takeout, I don't blame them adding it on for takeout orders. If more people properly tipped, they might not do it.

Depending on the restaurant gratuity is very much included. Outback always charges 10% gratuity for pick up. Outside the US, gratuity is almost always included on the check period. They love Americans because they have a tendency to "double tip"

Johnny Rockets is not McD's or Burger King... its a RESTAURANT.

That being said, the ONLY way your going to stop staff from feeling the customer should tip by mandatory, is if you forced restaurants to pay their service at least minimum wage. Most barely pay over 2.50 because the law says they are legally allowed to as long as with tips their wage meets minimum.

To put in perspective when I worked as a soda jerk, I made minimum wage. I did a damn fine fucking job, and as such was tipped a lot. But I made minimum wage, so even if I didn't receive and tips for doing good work, I still felt like I was being paid for my effort.

Now compare that to my fiance when she worked her ass off 2 shifts a day at Macaroni Grill. She could work her ass off, and still at the end of the night, once the tip split was made, barely meet minimum wage because people dont relize that

1) their tips dont go ONLY to a waiter, they go to just about everyone who worked on your food who isnt salaried.

2)their waiter is paid dirt and not minimum wage like most people in the US seem to think.

And she used to get treated like shit when she worked there. People threw pagers at her, had sex under the table while she had to "look the other way" would treat her like a piece of ass, you can go on.

So it doesnt shock me wait staffs want to force customers to start paying their due. What does shock me is how little people care about how mistreated restaurant staffs are.

At Atlantis Paradise Island, they do a 15% charge on fast food, which is annoying when you are just getting a soda.

I don't tip at steak and shake, and i won't tip at Johnny Rockets.

If your main "meal" is burgers and fries, the restaurant model is an insult to other real restaurants.

I worked as a waitress for many years in what I would describe as "pretensions of fine dining" restaurants. When we got a call for a take-out order, the hostess would summon one of the waitstaff, who had to take the order, submit it to the kitchen, put together all the side items (anything not coming hot off the cook's line: salad, salad dressing, rolls, butter, dessert etc.) watch for the entrees to be ready, and package everything together, all while still working our regular tables. While it wasn't as arduous as returning multiple times to a table, it still required a good bit of time and attention. We always charged 12% gratuity.

Even at the time, though, I thought there had to be a better way to do this, as customers frequently questioned the gratuity. One way would be to have a separate takeout menu, with higher prices, and have either a fee paid to the waitstaff for the order or have a salaried employee (the hostess or manager) handle take-out. For a place like Johnny Rockets, that has a dedicated takeout register (at least the one at the Providence Place Mall does), there's no reason to not have a streamlined takeout system in place, with gratuities factored in.

So basically: if take-out is an anomaly at a predominantly sit-down restaurant, your order is being prepared by a waiter/ waitress who is taking time out from other tables and should be compensated, and you should be informed up front that gratuity will be included. If it's a place that does 25% or more of their business in take-out, you shouldn't expect an added-on gratuity, any more than you'd expect one at McDonald's.

nothing is MORE ANNOYING than taking a take out order, making sure their take out has silverware and such, paying the same attention to a take out order as i would for a table and not getting a dime for it. 15% is a bit much, ill admit. At least leave a dollar or something

if you've worked in food service, you're thinking 'omg totally tip!' if you've never worked in food service, you're thinking 'what?! all they did was take my order and i'm out of their!!'

well, their's more to it than just taking the order, the same way theirs more to any job than what you see when you walk into the store.

There was a court case about this in New York. Though the holding probably wouldn't apply in Florida but the judge in the case seemed to think that other courts had ruled similarly.

[www.nytimes.com]

Usually I tip nothing for pickup/carryout orders. I mean, I'm the one doing the serving, yes? Really, I never even thought about it until this thread, but it's more complicated than some people are making it out to be. And having thought about it now, I'm going to change my habits.

When picking up from places that are primarily takeout services - pizza, local chinese takeout, etc - I still think no tip is required. When picking up food from a place that is primarily a sit-down restaurant, 10% seems fair. After all, the food still had to be prepared, packaged, etc., and tips are not just kept by the wait staff - they're for everyone.

But 15 percent? No way. 15-25 percent tips are for a place where I sit down and get waited on for an entire meal.

What does everyone think?

@Scuba Steve: If your "main meal" is burgers and fries ordered from a counter and picked up at the counter by the customer, then no tip should be involved. If I'm sitting at a table, someone takes my order, brings me food and drink, brings me my bill, etc. then service is service, even if I just ordered a burger. If I'm in the US at the time, I'll assume the server is paid slave wages and tip according to the service provided.

The distinction is in the service provided, not the dish served.

@TinyBug: I agree. That's pretty much how I do it, too.

@no.no.notorious: See the comments of @FangDoc above. It's abusive for a restaurant to make tip-dependent employees handle take-out. If take-out is any significant part of their business (like so many of the Darden chains, e.g.) then they should have someone paid a decent wage or salary handling it and not abuse their waitstaff, rather than expect tips from people who are too lazy or rushed to come into a restaurant.

Full disclosure: the only time I've ever done this "curbside" thing was with a friend who prefers it... if I'm going to eat at my house, I'll cook.

TIPS ARE VOLUNTARY
I will leave what the hell I want to leave

Let's forget about the whole tip thing for a minute and focus on the fact that they told her they were out of burgers and fries. At Johhny Rockets.

A tip is for people that deserve it. Mandatory tips instantly defies the whole point. I'd never go back to a place like that.

I don't tip, because I'm expecting someone to go out of their way if they're going to make me pay more for my meal or whatever, and they just don't.

All this crap about 'it's a low paid job they expect tips'. They chose the job, they accepted the pay. Do you think low paid jobs in other sectors get tips? Do they hell.

Wow, good find Melissa.. simply infuriating.

@AnneofAndover: Well, sure. It's not like they sell many burgers there, right?

Falconfire - last time I checked, slavery had been outlawed in this country. That being said, your fiancee has all the power in the world to find a different/better job if she hates hers so much.

That's what gets me here - these people are not being held as captive indentured servants, forced to work for less than minimum wage on the hopes that customer tips will make up the balance. If anyone working in a restaurant doesn't like they way they are treated or paid, they can and should go find a better job. It's not like anyone waiting tables spent 4 years of college earning a degree that'll be useless if they change jobs. I don't feel it's my obligation to try to make their choice of jobs more tolerable.

For me, if I get great service, I'll tip generously. If all you've done is hand me a bag, though, that's nothing spectacular and worth the $2 they're automatically adding on. It's a bag. Grab with fingers, lift up, stretch arm out towards customer. If I earned $2 every time I handed something to someone, I'd be a millionaire.

I'm very sorry the government taxes their tips, that's f**ked up. That ain't my fault. It would seem to me that waitresses are one of the many groups the government f**ks in the a** on a regular basis. Look, if you ask me to sign something that says the government shouldn't do that, I'll sign it, put it to a vote, I'll vote for it, but what I won't do is play ball. And as for this non-college bulls**t I got two words for that: learn to f**kin' type, 'cause if you're expecting me to help out with the rent you're in for a big f**kin' surprise.
/Obligatory Mr. Pink Quote.

@AnneofAndover: Yeah, isn't that the real story? I know everybody loves arguing over tips as much as I do, but what the hell kind of restaurant runs out of burgers, fries, and root beer all at once?

I was on with a sales person from Microsoft. He told me they were out of electrons.

@GearheadGeek: Yep. I think the people being abusive towards the servers are the restaurants, not the customers who don't tip for takeout. I can understand why many customers wouldn't think they should tip in that case. Since customers don't have the social expectation that they should tip for takeout in many cases, the restaurants need to pay the servers handling that a higher wage (especially if they put a dedicated person on shift handling that). Moreover, it's even worse if the restaurant is forcing the servers to take shifts doing this takeout stuff in order to get put on the schedule for "regular" shifts (something I've heard is common).

Maybe they should make the tip out for negative 2.57

Just a thought =)

Regardless of whether it is "right" to add the gratuity, the surprise to me in this is that both this article and the one it links to say that the it was added to a total that included the sales tax when it was calculated properly using the pre-tax amount.

Obviously neither blogger bothered to check the math on the receipt.

This sort of thing is not uncommon in blogs. It is the difference between being a reporter and being a blogger. A reporter would have been called on the carpet by the editor for not fact checking and a correction would have been printed. I have not seen a similar accountability by blog editors.

It is unfortunate because it indicates a bias that makes me question the value of blogs where there is a tendency to put the value of the "cause" above that of good reporting.