“Maybe I’m being picky,” tipster David writes. “But it says what it says.”
Verizon math, of course, is when companies forget how decimal points work.
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I’ve seen this problem in multiple phone companies, especially ATnT.
Wow, that is some cheap yogurt.
So for 38 cents you get 100 ounces. That’s a pretty good deal!
Unfortunately this is for eat in only and the strictly enforce cleaning your plate.
Time for my famous plastic lined pockets (note to self: add insulation)
I would gladly go for 3.8 cents worth.
Pay with a nickel, that’d give them a tip in excess of 25%!
Companies should be forced to honor that price if they advertise it or put it on a sign. Any losses as a result should be their penalty for being stupid.
In a lot of states, the law forces them to do exactly that. If they post a sign and the computer says a different price, then by law, the computer is wrong.
But what if in this case,(or so it appears) the sign too, is a computer?
The sign-computer isn’t the one in charge of ringing up the bill. The constraint would obviously apply to the one that is, ergo, still, the sign is right and the cash-register-computer is wrong.
This is interesting, but some laws in various states (CT specifically) state that if a product if advertised as one price, but rings up incorrectly, and it ends up being MORE expensive, the retailer actually must give the item for free…provided it meets a specific criteria.
Although I suppose frozen yogurt isn’t a “commodity”
http://www.housedems.ct.gov/gentile/pubs/Shopping07.pdf
Punishing for bait & switch is one thing, but punishing for what is clearly an honest mistake is another.
Agreed, this is an honest, if stupid, mistake. I would point it out to the manager on duty and specify the difference a couple of decimal points can make if they don’t understand.
What got me really scared was when my community college economics professor started to do this with percentages. He had a hard time grasping the concept that 35% = 0.35
I had a philosophy prof who had that problem. But then again my statistics expectations for an econ prof are much higher, and none of my econ profs had that issue as far as I knew.
I see this often in produce departments of local grocers. I’m often tempted to, whenever I see, for instance “apples .99¢/lb” I’ll go up to the counter with 10 lbs and a dime and tell them to keep the change.
By which you mean you’ve never actually done that but have been tempted to do so several times.
Which is why he said “tempted” in his post.
I’m glad to see at least one person who passed reading comprehension around here.
What about writing?
I’m often tempted to, whenever I see, for instance “apples .99¢/lb” I’ll go up to the counter with 10 lbs and a dime and tell them to keep the change.
You realize that sentence makes no sense? you’re tempted to you’ll go? By adding that extra “I’ll” it looks like you’re saying you do in fact do that. You mean “I’m tempted to go up to the counter”.
I don’t think it is fair to expect a retailer to sell out their stock for a stupid mistake an underpaid clerk created. If it is a hand-written sign, I would attempt to purchase a single instance of the item and offer them a penny. It would make the point that the sign is wrong without making them go broke.
This professionally-made sign makes me more likely to call them on it. You would have to call the manager directly. Don’t make a typical employee try to be the middleman.
Fair?
Screw fair.
Stupidity should be PUNISHED … that way, it’s less likely to be repeated!
“Your game shows reward knowledge. Here, we punish ignorance!”
So whats your opinion on people scamming old ladies? So stupidity should only be punished when it works out in YOUR favor?
There’s stupid and then there’s taking advantage of the vulnerable
Perhaps if they hired a clerk at a decent living wage the retailer could have an employee that understands basic mathematics. Heck, who knows what else an educated and qualified employee might be able to accomplish for the retailer?
I don’t think it is fair to expect a retailer to sell out their stock for a stupid mistake an underpaid clerk created. If it is a hand-written sign, I would attempt to purchase a single instance of the item and offer them a penny. It would make the point that the sign is wrong without making them go broke.
You obviously didn’t read my post. Here, let me post that again, with a little emphasis:
I see this often in produce departments of local grocers. I’m often tempted to, whenever I see, for instance “apples .99¢/lb” I’ll go up to the counter with 10 lbs and a dime and tell them to keep the change.
Hope that clears that up.
Yeah, the gas station I go to sometimes advertises cups of coffee for .75 cents – I always want to go in with a penny and tell them to keep the change. I don’t, though, because I have a feeling the conversation would not go well.
I could be sarcastic about this, but why not buy 10 ounces in ten one-ounce transactions? An ounce is less than half a cent so it rounds down, yes?
(yes, I know they’ll never let you do this, my store got in the same argument over a sign that said “Corn – .29¢ an ear”)
How long before some brash yogurt-eater tries to hammer the poor guy (or gal) behind the register into honoring the incorrect price notation?
Seeing as it’s self-serve, go for it! Just bring your own bucket.
Depending on the state that sign is posted in, the store honoring the price might well be required by law.
This is hilarious. Who the hell they’re hiring for math tasks?
The same person you’re hiring for grammar? (I kid!)
Is everyone ok? I smelt something burning from the homepage.
It’s vowels. The vowels are burning.
I think that’s from the mexican food I ate earlier.
You eat mexican vowels?
¡Olé!
¡Ay carumba!
My favorite instance of this form of math is when talking about DUI and BAC limits. In most states, the maximum BAC for legal driving is 0.08%, or 0.0008. But people, including state officials, will often say “0.08,” which is the same as 8%.
If your blood has twice as much alcohol by volume as beer, there might be a problem.
As long as they don’t specify units when they say “point oh eight” I’m fine with that. It’s like saying “I got a ninety on my exam”. Without units, its implied that the societal norms for the matter at hand apply.
For instance, if I’m loaning you money and I say the rate is 50 points below prime, I don’t mean 50 percentage points, but 50 basis points (which is 0.5%).
Agreed. This is the reverse of that issue, in that units are explicitly specified to be cents.
You’re drinking the wrong beer.
Oh my god what the hell is everyone talking about? What math.. they are selling an ounce of frozen yogurt for 38 cents.. 1 oz is equal to this little cup http://www.ellsworth.com/imagelibrary/jpegs/600/jpegs/MIX_CUP_1OZ_GRAD.jpg.. that is 1 ounce.. so you can buy that teeny cup with yogurt for 38cents.. what is the problem? And to the guy who said if the sign reads “banannas 99cents a lb” and takes 10 lbs up and tried to give them a dime?? your retarded.. if you take 10 lbs up and its 99cents a lb that means you are going to pay $10.. what are you people misreading? one dollar written out is $1.00… 50 cents is written 0.50 or .50 if you drop the first zero because of laziness.. i doubt they are trying to sell a teeeny cup for $3.80.. are you saying 38 cents is too cheap for 1 oz .. or too expensive.. gah this is making me so crazy!
It seems to make perfect sense to me.. i fill my cup.. i walk up…. they WEIGH it.. then they put the price on it at 38cents per oz.. if i get a lb of it .. it costs me $6.08
Read the sign. It doesn’t say 38 cents, it says .38 cents. That little dot in front is called a decimal and changes the quantity quite substantially.
if you’re saying it says 38 percent of a cent then it would be written 0.0038¢ .38¢ is still $0.38.. i’m not getting it
The random dots you have sprinkled throughout your posts represent something, in grammar as well as math.
Ellipsis (plural ellipses; or “three little points of suspension”; from the Greek: ἔλλειψις, élleipsis, “omission”) is a mark or series of marks that usually indicate an intentional omission of a word in the original text. An ellipsis can also be used to indicate a pause in speech, an unfinished thought, or, at the end of a sentence, a trailing off into silence
Thanks for the lesson. However, from what I see, you are putting two periods. That is not an ellipsis by your definition. Plus you used them a lot, so basically at the end of each sentence.
That “whoosh” you hear is somebody still not quite getting it. It is like a math FAIL and an ellipsis FAIL all rolled up in one!
This needs to go on the FAILblog.
Oh my, so much fail.
Wow…just fucking WOW…
Quote >> Ellipsis (plural ellipses; or “three little points of suspension”…
You obviously know what an ellipsis is, but still only put two of them where there should be three (as I used above).
Quit digging your hole deeper than it already is!
Thank you so much, you have totally made my day. This is so hilarious.
Riddle me this:
If, as you say – “0.38¢ is still $0.38″
does that mean that – 38.00¢ is $38.00 ?
I hope so. I’ve got $10 in my pocket, so I can finally afford that lavish HDTV I’ve had my eye on, right?
With recursion, you can own the world…
.38¢ is NOT $0.38
Perhaps you need to retake elementary school math.
Let’s try again, substituting in the words for the symbols.
38¢ = 38 cents = 38 pennies.
$.38 = $0.38 = 0.38 dollars = 38 pennies.
.38¢ = 0.38¢ = 0.38 cents = 0.38 pennies, or less than half a penny.
The decimal place and the symbol used aren’t just there to fill space on the sign — they have independent meaning, and their use together is inappropriate. It’s the economic equivalent of a double negative.
Perhaps it’s easier as fractions.
$0.38 = 38/100 dollars = nineteen 50ths of a dollar, or less than one dollar.
0.38¢ = 38/100 cents = nineteen 50ths of one cent, or less than one cent.
It would take just over 263 of the nineteen 50ths of one cent to make one entire dollar, and it would take 100 of them to make $0.38.
IOW, 0.38¢ ≠$0.38
I think this sort of misunderstanding is unique to countries that still use old British units, actually. Metric requires you understand the difference or, quite literally, you won’t even be able to figure out how to mix juice (250 ml of concentrate to 2 l of water requires this understanding). The same thing probably happens all the time with the Liberian cent and the Pya. I imagine that before I was born it happened up here in Canada, too.
“I’m not getting it”
Keep repeating that till it makes sense.
POINT 38 CENTS is NOT the same as 38 CENTS.
See what you made me do – I actually had to use CAPS to make my point.
Not to pick on you, but they’re right…quit looking up quotes to try to make you appear more intelligent!!
Back to the subject…. .38 $ is 38 cents but .38 c is not…(not that the horse wasn’t beat to death already….)
“if you’re saying it says 38 percent of a cent then it would be written 0.0038¢ .38¢ is still $0.38.. i’m not getting it”
No. 38%of one cent would not be “0.0038¢”, it would be “$0.0038″.
UNITS, sweetheart. UNITS.
The $ means “dollars”, and the ¢ means “cents”.
1¢ = $0.01
.01¢ = $0.0001
…
Jesus, this is FIRST GRADE stuff, here. Did your mother forget to send you to school when you were a kid, or something?!?
Pax
August 21, 2010 9:16 PM
Moderate |Flag for review
“if you’re saying it says 38 percent of a cent then it would be written 0.0038¢ .38¢ is still $0.38.. i’m not getting it”
No. 38%of one cent would not be “0.0038¢”, it would be “$0.0038″.
GOOD CATCH. I missed the 0.0038¢ part, too.
Knowing that a given container holds 16 is fairly meaningless. If it holds 16 ounces, it’s a bottle; If it holds 16 gallons, it’s a small barrel. If a statue is 6 tall, it might get lost easily if the unit of measure is millimeters, or be hard to miss if the unit is smoots. An object weighing 1000 might be hard to move, or very easy, depending on if the unit of measure is tonnes, kilograms or micrograms. Units of measurement are critically important in any calculation.
The ¢ and $ symbols do not mean the same thing, they are different units of measurement of the same object (money).
In the case of the sign the article is about, a number followed by the ¢ symbol is 1/100th of the quantity of the same number preceded by the $ symbol. 0.38¢ per ounce is what the sign says (I added the prefix zero, since just a decimal point is hard to see without it), meaning they are advertising a price of just over a penny for 3 ounces. This is totally different from a price of $0.38 per ounce, which would be $1.14 for 3 ounces. Using the unit of measurement a $ represents, the price given on the sign would be expressed as $0.0038 per ounce. 100.0¢ is the same as $1.00.
In many states, stores are required by law to honor any posted price. If they posted it, that is the price, no matter what their cash register says. The intent of the law is to prevent both sloppy price signage (by creating a built-in penalty for it) and to prevent dishonest shopkeepers from being able to sneak higher than marked prices past a customer at the register (less likely with today’s use of display screens, but it can still happen). As usual, laws lag behind technical innovation, but they remain laws until changed by the government.
I think the easiest way to look it it is like this.
Say you want to buy 10 ounces of yougurt. At their INTENDED price, of $.38 per ounce, the math would look like:
$.38 * 10oz=$3.80. Correct? All you have to do is the multiplication, and then you keep the unit (in this case, it’s $).
Now, what they ACTUALLY posted was .38¢, so the math in actuality is like this:
.38¢ * 10oz =3.80¢. Remember to KEEP THE UNIT THE SAME. Until you do the math to convert the cents to dollars (100¢ : $1), the unit does not change. And since this started in cents, the product we get in the end stays in cents.
Do you see the difference now?
Remember, there’s a difference between $1 and 1¢. There’s a difference between $0.5 and 0.5¢
$0.5 dollars is equal to 50¢ (Multiply the $.5 by 100 to get the price in cents).
.5¢ cents is equal to $0.005 (Divide the .5¢ by 100 to get the price in dollars).
if you’re saying it says 38 percent of a cent then it would be written 0.0038¢ .38¢ is still $0.38.. i’m not getting it
And you’ll probably never will. Too many people have already tried to explain this to you, but let me try.
1¢ = $0.01
.1¢ = $0.001
.38¢ = $0.0038
.0038¢ = $0.000038
I know, math is hard. But if you can grasp the simple concept of the fact that a cent = 1/100th of a dollar, then it’s not too difficult to figure out.
$0.38 is 38c, not .38c, which is one hundred times less.
“your retarded..”
I think you have missed the point.
BWWAAAAAHAHAHAHA! Zing!
you are SO not getting it, you made the same mistake the signmaker did, 38 cents per ounce would be written as 38 cents, not .38 cents, it’s .38 $
i hope you are a troll. lol. i hate these math fails. but they are funny.
It doesn’t make sense to you because you’re seeing it for its actual intent- 38 cents per ounce. But the sign really should read $.38 to mean that- the decimal indicates that it is a fraction of one dollar. With the cent mark there, it indicates it’s a fraction of one cent.
brain freeze.
Do you by any chance work for Verizon? Because that would explain a lot.
+1
I was about to ask the same thing.
Oh god I am laughing so hard.
Especially the “38% of a cent is 0.0038¢”
Man I hope you work no where near math. Or money. Or teaching. Or healthcare. Or… well just about anything.
Oh god you’re a psychology major.
I’m hoping you’re (attempting to) become a psychologist and not a psychiatrist so you don’t give someone 38 grams of some medication and kill them!
38% of $1 = $0.38 = 38 cents
38% of $0.01 = $0.0038 = 0.38 cents = .38 cents
(If you don’t see the period in front of the 38 it is because your mind doesn’t see it.)
Here’s an example: If you go to the restaurant, and the bill is $100, and you want to tip 20%, your tip will be $20.00. If it’s $10, then you tip $2.00. If it is only $1, then you tip $0.20, or 20 cents, NOT 0.20 cents, because “1 cent = $0.01″ already, so “0.20 cent = 20% of 1 cent.”
Anyway, I don’t think they should honor the price since it is obvious what the sign meant, not what it is written. It bugs the hell out of me, but I just let it go. It’s like trying to get the guy in front of me to signal when turning or changing lanes, getting people to write “receive” instead of “recieve,” and getting George W. Bush to say “nu-cle-ar” instead of “nu-q-lar.”
I think you’ve got your reply a bit twisted. I’m laughing at her for saying “38% of 1 cent is 0.0038¢”.
She thinks that, not me.
You’re right. I read the original post correctly, but misread the object of your ridicule. Good catch. On a separate note, the Verizon CSR conversation was clearly going nowhere…
Nice.
I know it’s off the subject, but it’s YOU’RE, as in you’re nuts.
0.38¢ is “Zero point three eight cents”. Or, thirty-eight hundredth’s of one cent.
0.38¢ also happens to equal EXACTLY $0.0038 … or, thirty-eight TEN THOUSANDTHS of one dollar.
The proper way to write the _intended_ amount would be either of these: “38¢” -or- “$0.38″.
If you want something to cost thirty-eight cents, then you should put the decimal to the RIGHT ofthe number”38″ … like this, for example: “38.0¢”.
On this note, could .38¢ be enforceable since it isn’t 0.38¢?
It also comes down to what is an obvious mistake. Cellular data could be realistically priced using fractions of cents. Long Distance minutes are all the time. But ounces of yogurt?
Wanting to wipe companies out for obvious mistakes is awfully close to street thug thinking. They didn’t lock the car so they deserve to have their radio stolen and be taught a lesson.
Seriously if I give you half an apple am I giving you .5 apples or .005 apples?
I realize the ‘double unit’ of dollars and cents is a ‘little’ confusing, but it should really stop being so after people explain it to you 10x over/you learn what a decimal point is.
Just look at it in terms of ‘cents’, and forget dollars exist. If it still doesn’t make sense then you’re probably a lost cause.
Once you realize that you are dealing with the product of the modern educational system, you will know the futility of your actions.
Oh, Stewardess, I speak non-math, maybe I can help.
Here’s the thing. Apparently the company thought they were listing the price as 38 cents, or 38/100ths of a dollar. However, to write that correctly, it should have read $0.38 (38/100ths of a dollar) or 38¢ (38 cents). By writing it as .38¢, adding the decimal point, that makes it read as $.0038, which means that 38 cents would buy you 100 ounces, not just one.
Understand now?
Wow, thank you for thoroughly entertaining me this morning. Just when I was bemoaning the lack of consumerist posts on the weekends you step up and provide both spectacular math and grammar fail fodder. Of course, I should weep for the future of the world if you are representative of your genertion or any subsequent ones, but, today I laugh.
well done jayde_drag0n *golf clap*
If you were trolling : I give your post an 8/10…
If you are just plain stupid : I give your post a 7/10
My retarded what? I’m hanging by the suspense here!
Oh, where to begin? No, I won’t bother–there are 24 people before me who’ve already said what I would have said in response to this. So all I’ll add is this: did your parents pay to let you skip grades in elementary school? Or did the school system you were enrolled in gave up on you?
I see this jayde_dragon’s complete lack of grammar/arithmetic skills has rubbed off on me. I meant “give” not “gave”.
Reading down, I see you are not a troll… just really unobservant and/or mathtarded.
The easiest thing to do is just stop using the cents symbol. I can’t even find the darn thing on my keyboard, which should give some indication of how often it’s used.
Cents and dollars are, by virtue of “no duh”, not the same thing. So, the decimal has to change depending on what you are talking about. A penny and a dollar are different, so $1 and 1¢ are different, so $.38 and .38¢ are different.
I had to copy and paste that damn ¢, so I really think it’s time to just kill it. We all write cents with the decimal, so ¢ just confuses the general herd.
I didn’t get it either. I assumed that it was 38 cents an ounce.
Screw decimals.
But, I must admit, I had to take remedial math in college.
Thanks jayde_drag0n. This is by far the funniest thread I’ve read on Consumerist in a very long time.
A long time = 0.38 months = 38 years
Thanks jayde_drag0n. This is by far the funniest thread I’ve read on Consumerist in a very long time.
A long time = 0.38 months = 38 years
Do you mean your freakonomics professor?
Actually, it doesn’t say .38 cent per ounce. It says .38 cent ounce. I guess a cent-ounce is kind of like a foot-pound, or an acre-foot, though what it’s a unit of is anyone’s guess.
This is what I came in here to say. Funny how all the pedants missed the most glaring error of all.
Shouldn’t there be a hyphen between self and serve (i.e. self-serve) as well? I am not an English major, but I think that adjective needs to be compounded.
Regardless, I hope that fro-yo is delicious!
The hyphen is dying off and has sadly been reduced to “optional” at best in almost all cases, in even the strictest grammar situations.
And yes, the lack of a ‘per’ is bad, but poor grammar doesn’t so much directly effect your transaction as poor decimal usage does.
How much for a Newton-Meter of yogurt?
It’s like a foot-candle, which, by the way, is the word unit of measurement EVER.
Think they’ll mind if I fill my camelbak with frozen yogurt?
Might be a bit hard to clean out afterward…
Rotting milk is not a good flavor for water…
When I was in college, the local McD’s had a Big Mac promotion and painted “BIG MAC only .99¢” on their roof.
A couple of us decided to be jackasses and get a four for 4 cents. The cashier quickly got the manager and the manager didn’t understand why the roof-painted sign was incorrect. After lots of explaining, he gave us the Big Macs for 4 cents and later that day, the decimal point had been painted over to match the roof.
Clearly, that “.38 c oz” sign is poorly written.
But I think any reasonable person understands it to mean, “38 cents per oz”
All good consumerists should know that such a sign is very different from Verizons fuzzy math situation.
Firstly, it is obvious in the intent; the error is clear. Secondly, it is an advert and as such not is intended to bind. It is an ‘offer to bargain’. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invitation_to_treat
This is pretty basic contract law of which good consumerists should be aware. They have little to zero chance of enforcing 0.38cents per oz.
Anyone trying to claim 0.38 cents per oz is a bad consumerist.
No, it is a case of false advertising. I used to see this all the time with burger places, .99 cents for a burger. I would politely point out that I was notifying them of their error and they could either take the decimal out, or change the cent sign to a dollar sign or they would be in violation of the law. They CANNOT advertise one price and charge another. If they are allowed to do that with cents, what makes us think that it won’t be done with a misplaced decimal for dollars? If your sign says something is $3.49, then you cannot charge $34.90 at the register and claim your sign was just a misplaced decimal.
Sometimes the only way to get through to places is to FORCE them to honor their price, otherwise they just say ‘whatever’ and never change their sign. I don’t care what their intent was, I care about the actual practice. Do not tell me something is one price and charge another.
Failing to recognize intent makes one a jackass.
Don’t know where you’re from, but we have Truth in Advertising laws in America. You CANNOT advertise one price then charge another.
http://www.business.gov/business-law/advertising-law/truth-in-advertising/
jayde_drag0n : if you’re saying it says 38 percent of a cent then it would be written 0.0038¢ .38¢ is still $0.38.. i’m not getting it
Simple :
#1) ponder this… what is the difference between 0.38¢ and 38.0¢ (hint: the second one is 100 times larger than the first)
#2) you are wrong when you say .38¢ is still $0.38 —> 38.0¢ is $0.38 and 0.38¢ is $0.0038
comprende?
Nope. jayde_drag0n must be a troll or an instigator. jayde_drag0n sounds like he/she is just trying to cause people want to reply to his/her thread. I don’t doubt people can be that bad at Math (or just missed the decimal point even when staring at the poster looking for the error), but I don’t think that’s the case with jayde_drag0n. Just my opinion.
.39¢
I
LOVE THE
THE SMELL OF
PARIS IN THE SPRINGTIME
http://www.soon.org.uk/humor/illusion.htm
There is one difference between this and Verizon. The same way I can look at my hard drive purchase and say the drive cost $0.10/GB or .01c/MB, it’s too abstract to be intuitive. And Verizon was charging so more more than would stand to reason, the misprint made more sense than their intent.
You are right, the sign says about 1/3c [per] oz. but this moves to “typo” territory.
@ jayde_drag0n –
You’re obviously one of those people who need to go back to school and take remedial math AND comprehension.
You’re NOT reading the sign correctly.
The sign is actually saying that an ounce of frozen yogurt is (focus now, cuz this is the hard part):
POINT 38 cents per ounce. (that is, LESS than a half-penny, per ounce – 38-hundredths of a penny to be exact)
NOT
38 cents per ounce.
BIG difference.
.38 is NOT the same as 38-cents WHEN you place BOTH the decimal AND the cents icon ( ¢ ) together.
Again, with the ‘banana’ sign…
First off, it was a sign for ‘apples’ (i’m seeing a trend here, with you).
Fafaflunkie posted that the sign for said apples was POINT 99-cents per pound (that’s slightly LESS than a PENNY) per ounce.
As to your claim that:
“It seems to make perfect sense to me.. “
tells me that you’re easily separated from your money…and that maybe a career in yogurt sales might not be a wide career path for you.
At least there’s one thing that will be ingrained in my head from all of this: I no longer need to rely on the character map to type a cent sign (¢).
ALT+0162 has just replaced something else I’ll need to remember–most likely tomorrow morning.
It’s a typo… there… I said it.
I wish I had the time and energy to copy all of the comments with “math” involved… would be epic.
A sad commentary on the state of mathematics knowledge in the country….
I have to agree that stupidity needs to be punished. We learn best whenever consequences are involved.
The McDonald’s across the street from me has had “Small Cone .50 cents” on their electronic sign for weeks now…
My favorite is when my old boss said everyone should give 110%. He may now be working for a frozen yogurt company.