Over the past year, a number of you have been telling us that, due to “pre-optimization” of computers, it’s difficult — sometimes impossible — to walk into a Best Buy and leave with the advertised deal (in effect, you would be paying a $39.99 surcharge over the computer’s advertised price). We decided to look into your complaints. We sent the Consumer Reports secret shoppers to 18 different Best Buys in 11 states, and one of our shoppers was denied the price advertised for a specific model because only pre-optimized computers were available. When the Consumer Reports engineers compared three “optimized” computers to ones with default factory settings, there was no performance improvement. In one case, an optimized laptop actually performed 32% worse than the factory model.
Optimize This
Would you pay $39.99 to improve your computer’s processor speed by 200%? What about software updates that would take you two days to perform on your own? Or how about services that take an “incomplete” computer and make it more useful? Good deals, right? Just one problem: None of these claims – made by real Best Buy sales clerks about the company’s Geek Squad optimization services – is true.
We wanted to know three things:
- What is optimization? What does the service consist of?
- How is Best Buy marketing the service? How widespread is “pre-optimization,” in which a store sells computers that have already been optimized?
- Is optimization something you should consider? Can you do it yourself? Is it a good deal? Are there any downsides to the service?
To find the answers to these questions, we enlisted the help of the Consumer Reports secret shoppers, the technical experts on CR’s electronics testing team, and of course, Consumerist readers themselves.
Preoptimized computers stacked up in a Best Buy store. (Photo: Mike)
Meet Betty and Nelson
All Betty (not her real name, but a real Consumerist reader) wanted was to go to Best Buy, pick up a laptop she saw advertised in a newspaper circular, pay for it, and leave.
It wasn’t that simple. She was quickly informed that if she wanted the laptop she saw in the ad, she’d need to pay $39.99 for optimization.
“I replied that I really didn’t care about computer optimization, and that I came into the store to purchase the laptop for $649.99, the advertised price,” Betty told us in an email. “[The Best Buy employee] said that there was nothing he could do about the $39.99 optimization charge, since those were the only models left in the store.”
Betty is the stubborn type. She refused to pay for a service she didn’t want, so she was told to go pick up the laptop at another branch. Once Best Buy employees began calling around, they discovered that the pre-optimization issue persisted at other nearby stores.
After another 45 minutes passed, the second manager Betty spoke to agreed to waive the fee.
Reader Nelson, however, wasn’t as lucky. He wasn’t able to walk out of the store with the advertised deal. Despite protesting, he was charged a fee for a service he didn’t want.
“It wasn’t optional,” Nelson told Consumerist, “They said that they sold out of the unoptimized $250 Acer laptops and the only ones left were the optimized versions. The other Best Buys around my area were sold out too.”
Nelson managed to talk Best Buy down 50%, to $20 for optimization, but still feels cheated. He told us he doesn’t think pre-optimization is fair to the people who don’t want the service.
What is optimization?
Getting to the bottom of what exactly the consumer gets for their $39.99 was more difficult a proposition than we initially assumed. Eventually, we had to buy three optimized laptops and enlist the help of CR’s electronics testing experts to tell us what had been done to them, but we started by looking at Geek Squad’s website.
Here’s how they describe the service on the Geek Squad blog:
Our Geek Squad Agents enable up to 100 system tweaks that improve PC performance and functionality, including optimized startup and shutdown, improved menu navigation, quick launch and taskbar cleanup and program shortcut creation.
There are also several different types of “new computer” services being sold to prospective buyers. They include, but are not limited to, anti-virus installation and recovery-disc creation. The services range in price from $29.99 to $219.99, and include offerings for both Windows PCs and Macs.
Services offered by Best Buy include “Netbook Protect,” a $50 plan that includes installation
of anti-virus software and Windows updates — and adds 20% to the price of a $250 netbook.
On our first visit to Best Buy we intended to ask about the optimization services, but the sales staff never seemed to come our way, so we grabbed a Geek Squad folder full of sales information that was being made available to prospective customers.
It included a confusing and intimidating order sheet that seemed inspired by the ones used by auto mechanics, complete with official-looking carbonless copy paper. The menu seemed designed to replicate the experience of having your car serviced.
For example, the folder contained a sheet that touted a six-month anti-virus protection deal, provided for free with all PC purchases. Geek Squad offers something called “Standard Security and Performance” ($69.99), which includes optimization and then the installation and configuration of anti-virus software (plus the cost of the software itself).
If, however, you choose computer optimization alone ($39.99), you could still get anti-virus programs offered with “Standard Security & Performance,” because they’re part of that six-month deal.
We drank coffee and tried our hardest to see why anyone would choose to pay $69.99 for a service that was nearly identical to one that cost $39.99 and were unable to think of anything that sounded reasonable.
Consumerist reader Patrick sent us this picture of an in-store display
designed to “prove” that an optimized computer boots faster than a stock unit.
The Secret Shopping Adventure
According to Nelson, the salesperson told him that ‘optimized was better’ and that Best Buy were sold out of un-optimized laptops. “Yes, I felt it was an attempt to upsell me on the ‘optimization fee,”‘ Nelson told Consumerist. “She knew I wasn’t going to budge on that ridiculous price of $40 extra ’cause I knew what I was talking about.”
With that in mind, we set out to see if Betty and Nelson’s experience could be replicated. Did Best Buy make inflated claims about the value of these services, and in some cases, even try to sell pre-optimized computers to customers who didn’t want them, citing a lack of unopened computers?
To help us find out, we dispatched the Consumer Reports secret shoppers to 18 Best Buy branches in 11 states.
The shoppers are scattered throughout the U.S. and are responsible for researching and sometimes purchasing the products that Consumer Reports tests. For our mission, each shopper was to go to a Best Buy location and inquire about an advertised laptop, then report back about the optimization options that were offered – and how they were characterized by the sales staff.
The first shopper reported back within a few hours. She had indeed been denied the advertised deal because all available units had been pre-optimized.
Here is her account of the conversation:
Salesperson: Best Buy has this model, but it’s $369.99 instead of $329.99.
CR Shopper: Why?
S: Because it was already optimized.
CRS: What does this mean?
S: The model is quicker, the user can “sign on” and it won’t have to be configured.
CRS: Why is it quicker?S: Because they removed the trial version of products like Norton.
CRS: Does that mean that I will not have anti-virus protection?
S: They can install a 6-month antivirus program.
CRS: Is the optimization optional?
S: It’s not optional because we don’t have any of this model without the optimization, but we have other laptops that are not optimized.
CRS: Can you waive the fee?
S: The fee can’t be waived because it’s already installed.
We also learned a few other interesting things about Best Buy’s optimization sales pitch. One shopper was told that optimization made the computer’s processor “200% faster.” The same shopper was told that he could try to optimize the computer on his own, but without assistance he would not be able to increase the processor speed.
When the shoppers asked if they could duplicate the optimization themselves, they got a variety of estimates of the time they would save if Best Buy did it for them. One shopper was told she would save “an hour and a half,” while another was told that downloading Windows updates alone would take 6 hours. One shopper was even told that optimizing a computer at home would take about two days!
Another shopper was warned that the laptop was “incomplete” without optimization.
When she asked what the salesperson meant by “incomplete,” he told her that it didn’t come with anti-virus software or Microsoft Office. The salesperson went on to tell her that optimization was her choice, but that Best Buy didn’t “recommend getting online” without it.
He explained, “You’ll get online, get a virus, and end up spending $200 to clean it up.”
When she asked if she could install anti-virus software herself instead of paying Geek Squad to do it, she was told installing software yourself, “negates the vendor’s warranty.”
During this same conversation, our secret shopper says the salesperson also told her that the manufacturer’s warranty was “obsolete” and had been “replaced” with Best Buy service contracts (which she would need to pay for, of course, and that were not included in the optimization price).
Not all salespeople touted optimization, and many branches did have unoptimized units of advertised laptops in stock, and were willing to sell them without pushing optimization. One sales rep even told our shopper not to buy a laptop during that visit, because some “truly amazing sales” were coming up soon.
Dean Gallea of Consumer Reports, in the lab with two laptops purchased
from Best Buy (see video here).
In Which There Is Science
Though we did learn a few interesting things about Best Buy’s sales practices, we found ourselves no closer to being able to tell if optimization was a good deal – or even precisely what it was.
So, we asked Consumer Reports’ electronics testing experts to help us out. They purchased three optimized laptops from a local Best Buy: An Asus U50A-RBBML05, a Gateway NV5207U, and a Toshiba Satellite A505-S6980. They then compared each optimized laptop to regular factory setups to see what kind of improvements optimization might offer.
Here’s what they found:
When we received our test models, the initial impression was of a rushed service: Some samples were left in standby mode, and two had not finished installing Windows updates. A quick start guide for one laptop had been mixed in with the papers in another laptop’s box, and a power cable for one sample was missing.
Upon comparing the optimized changes, the first noticeable change was a cleaner desktop. Most of the removed shortcuts were for trials, promotions and software added by the manufacturer. The programs themselves were still installed and available for later access. Updates had been downloaded on all three models, but differences in the factory default setup can affect how the system is optimized. On one laptop, for example, because Windows Defender was deactivated by default, its definitions had not been updated.
Some optimization changes seemed intended to make the laptop easier to use, such as adding the status bar to the file explorer, or displaying the file menu bar in Internet Explorer. Including a link to the Downloads folder in the Start menu, for example, can save you a few clicks. Security settings were adjusted to allow for automatic Windows updates, and in Internet Explorer, privacy settings were eased up to allow websites you visit to save info you provide on your PC.
Because optimization was being pitched to some of our shoppers on the basis of improving the computer’s performance, we asked the tech team to compare the performance of optimized computers to ones with factory settings.
Here are the results of the tests:
We ran the 3DMark 2003 graphics benchmark on each laptop, comparing optimized and non-optimized settings. For two of our samples, the Gateway and Toshiba, performance changes were negligible. On the Asus laptop, however, optimized tests actually scored about 32% worse than the non-optimized setup. We have been unable to isolate the source of this performance change. On none of the three tested laptops did the optimized settings give a performance boost in our test.
[Emphasis added]
And finally, we wanted to know if a consumer could “optimize” their own computer.
Some of the optimized settings were changes that typical users can do themselves, and basic security measures, such as the Windows Firewall or OS updates, are normally already activated by default. The optimization service does cover most of the security settings we recommend you perform, but in addition, you should check that Windows Defender and your anti-virus software are active and updated, and keep a recovery backup of your system and files. Geek Squad’s optimization is best for saving consumers the hassle of waiting for updates to download, or applying tiny “tweaks” to promote usability. However, you might not like all the setting choices Geek Squad makes, and as a performance enhancement, the optimization failed to impress.
In Which We Draw Conclusions
Based on the results of the tech team’s tests, we believe that optimization is not a good deal for most consumers. Our tests show that the service did not improve performance, and there are a number of free ways to do many of the same tasks (though you may be out of luck if you just have to have those exclusive “100 system tweaks”). We’ve listed a few of them below.
Yes, having Geek Squad download your Windows updates can save you time, but the tech team found that the service was inconsistent. Best Buy hadn’t finished installing all the updates, and of course, a power cable was missing from one of the computers. The computers we received still had the trialware installed – only the shortcuts were removed from the desktop.
We asked Best Buy about the inconsistent information provided by their sales staff, and about some of the more incredible claims about the benefits of optimization. A spokesman admitted that boasts of a 200% performance gain “seem a bit aggressive.” He also said that no stores should refuse to sell a consumer an unoptimized version of a product.
“This is about the choice,” the spokesman said. “If you don’t want it, you don’t have to get it.” He added that “we always try to stock some that are stock and standard so customers have the choice,” and suggested that customers who feel they were pushed into optimization when they didn’t want it should contact the company directly.
We asked Best Buy about the real value of optimization to consumers. The spokesman acknowledged that the service “isn’t for everybody” and “some people can do it themselves.” He said that one advantage of optimization is the “customization” that can be performed for individual consumers. However, when asked about pre-optimized computers – which aren’t customized for individuals – he suggested that “things like the updates and tweaks and removing programs” still make it a useful service for some buyers. “I would get optimization for my parents,” he said.
The New Service Economy
Best Buy takes the position that optimization is simply a choice available to consumers, and that it’s not for everyone, but looking at the larger picture it becomes clear that the company is betting heavily on services like optimization to take them through the recession and beyond.
Is Best Buy Mobile, with its emphasis on “specially trained,
impartial mobile phone specialists” the shape of things to come? .
In a recent Fortune magazine article, Best Buy CEO Brian Dunn cited “connectivity” (such as Geek Squad services designed to help consumers use their electronics together more effectively) as a potential $250 billion business that his company is going to aggressively pursue to remain competitive with more diverse big box threats like Walmart.
The company is experimenting with a new store layout that eliminates the many racks of DVDs and CDs and instead has stations for MP3 players, laptops, and such, according to Fortune. Each station will be manned by Best Buy employees who might turn your tech questions into sales opportunities for Geek Squad. A difference between Best Buy and Walmart (which recently started to offer a support service for electronics), says Dunn, will be that they own their own service company – Geek Squad.
“The operative word here is ‘owned,’” Dunn told Fortune. “Outsourcing works for back-office operations, but we believe that when an experience touches a customer, you must own it.”
Geek Squad’s services still represent a tiny percentage of Best Buy’s income, but that number is growing. According to a presentation delivered by Best Buy (PDF) at a conference in 2008, in the company’s fiscal 2006, Geek Squad services and Best Buy’s appliances installation business accounted for about 2.5% of domestic revenue, the same percentage that was brought in by extended warranties and other service plans. By 2008, the Geek Squad and appliance installation revenue share was up to 4%, while other service plans had declined to 2%.
At a 2008 conference associated with the W.P. Carey School of Business of Arizona State University, Sean Skelley, then Best Buy’s senior vice president for services (he’s currently president of international retail operations), said that Geek Squad – which Best Buy purchased in 2002 – gave the company a “relatable mythology” to connect to its customers, according to a W.P. Carey online article. Skelley was impressed by Geek Squad’s use of terms like “special agents” to refer to its staff. “We were interested in Geek Squad for these stories,” Skelley said, “and the brand elements that could help Best Buy get its ducks in a row.”
Skelley also waxed rhapsodically over another company’s creation of a service that kept customers coming back for more, as described in the W.P. Carey article: “Everyone knows you’re supposed to get your oil changed every 3,000 miles. But that was a Jiffy Lube marketing creation rather than an automotive standard, Skelley said. It is the way the company pulled customers back into their stores on a frequent, regular basis.”
Ultimately, it’s not Best Buy’s official policy to press customers into buying anything they don’t want, and they suggest you report any such indiscretions. However, it’s clear that Best Buy’s new post-Circuit City business strategy is to concentrate more on “services.” It might be helpful to keep that in mind when you head into the store with the circular in hand.
Optimize Yourself!
You can optimize your computer on your own with free software and a little patience. You’ll have to learn a little about your PC in the process, but since when is that a bad thing? In addition to using some of these tools, you should also keep your web browser up-to-date – and stop downloading cursors and toolbars!
| Task | Program | Comment |
| Overall optimization | CCleaner | This Swiss army knife of optimization can change your startup options, remove files left behind by web browsers, clean up your system registry and delete unnecessary programs. Settings can be complicated, but extensive online help provides answers for most questions. |
| Remove trialware | PC Decrapifier | This program includes a frequently updated database of trial programs bundled with PCs, making it easier to identify those that you don’t want. One click deletes multiple “craplets.” |
| Change startup options | msconfig | This system utility comes with every copy of Windows. It’s not for the faint-of-heart, but it will let you change almost all of your system’s startup settings, including which programs load automatically |
| Remove unnecessary software | Programs and Features (Add/Remove Programs in Windows XP) | This Windows Control Panel lets you remove both third-party software and unneeded Windows components. |
| Block spyware | Windows Defender Spybot Search and Destroy |
Free programs that are automatically updated with new threats on regular basis. |
| Protect against viruses | Avira Antivir Personal AVG Free |
Free antivirus programs rated as highly as commercial applications by Consumer Reports. |
Phil Villarreal and Marc Perton contributed additional reporting.
Wait.. In order to “optimize” these computers, Best Buy has to open them up, launch Windows, and presumably mess around with the registry and uninstall some software.
I see two things wrong here.. For one, once they open up the packaging, it’s no longer a “new” computer. And yet they want to charge you more for a used computer? And another, I’m sure this violates the Microsoft EULA and/or the hardware warranty somehow.
If the optimization causes problems somehow, who’s gonna fix it? Best Buy or the computer manufacturer. I’m guessing Best Buy will deny responsibility and tell you to send it to the manufacturer.
my thoughts exactly.
Your thoughts would be wrong on whether the open box constitutes a used computer.
This is why I will never EVER recommend purchasing a PC/Laptop or anything from Best Buy. As the “tech guy” in a large family and social circles I figured I’ve personally steered a couple dozen or so people from wasting money at BB. I know feel all the better for having done so.
Its getting harder and harder to find stores that sell simple computers for cheap. My needs are simple — internet access, word processing etc, pictures and music. In my immediate area, with the closing of CompUsa and Circuit City, among other stores, my options are limited to WalMart, BestBuy and Sears. I live in the NYC suburbs so, If I’m willing to drive a bit I can find a few more electronics stores, but there aren’t as many options anymore.
I’m thankful for Costco if I want to purchase in person, otherwise I buy online now.
HP is full of win in my book. They’ll build you just about any computer you require from a checklist on their website, and the prices are probably better than Best Buy. The HP-specific software that arrived with my box appears to be useful, at least. I didn’t have to weed out all that much crapware compared to some machines I’ve seen other people get. My biggest gripe was that I didn’t get any disks with my machine – I had to create those myself, and apparently the recovery software that does this is finicky when it comes to the brand of DVDs you’re using. Nice, fresh DVD-R’s from Sony did the trick.
Ever since I worked in a computer repair place and saw all the weird problems HPs would come in with, I’ve been leery of them. We use them at work and they aren’t bad, but I’m still not sure of them.
I think the biggest issue here is: These computers were opened by the store played with (optimized) and then re-boxed and sold “as new” when they are in fact used merchandise.
It’s one thing to buy a computer then have the service, it’s quite another to buy it already “serviced”
I’m pretty sure this is all very illegal.
How do you figure? There is nothing illegal in a retailer providing additional services on computers offered for sale.
Sure there isn’t anything illegal in your scenario however, this isn’t a computer that has already been purchased. It’s a computer they opened up played with than closed and are trying to sell as new. Sorry charlie this item is used.
OT: Am I the only one who hasn’t seen any new Consumerist posts since early this morning?
Yes, you are. I think you may be being misled by this article staying at the top of the stack today, while the newer articles are accumulating below it.
Consumerist must be very proud of this one (justifiably).
First of all, I want everyone know that I don’t work for Bestbuy (BB) or Geek Squad.
I think everyone is jumping too fast to the conclusion by reading this article.
Of course, personally, I don’t believe BB’s Optimization service can really optimizating performance. But neither the Consumerist’s/Consumer Reports’ (CR) testing is conclusive.
Here are my reasons:
1. In all 3 models tested, are the CR using the same laptop or not? It does not mention in the article (as I don’t believe it is the case). As a lot of people may not aware that, even the same model of a computer (desktop/laptop), the parts used may be different. For instance, memory. In such case, CR fails to address the possible variation the computers. Such configuration issue may lead to difference in performance.
2. CR fails to address if pre-optimizated laptops and after-optimizated laptops have the same settings (not only Windows, but also pre-boot BIOS), as Windows Aero Interface may significantly reduce performace due to wrong settings in BIOS (as BIOS can control shared memory allocated to onboard video chipset, which all 3 models have).
3. BB fails to address what have they done (and apparently working on a computer without a standardized procedure).
4. CR fails to address if an power adapter is used (as many may know the power source of a laptop is also a kep issue in performance).
Without no doubt, that BB may be unethnical in providing pre-optimizated laptops only, but not necessary cheating its customers. Simply put, BB never proves its after-optimizated laptops for its performance.
I hope everyone can understand that
(A cc of the message has sent to Ben Popken for response.)
“Optimizated”? What is that, the Popeye version? “We’re goin’ ta’s get yer computerator optimizated, Olive! Gyuk-guk-guk-guk-guk!”
Sorry, I know that’s uncalled for, but it just gave me a funny image.
Little Registry Cleaner is also a great open source program that should be on the list, as is TCP optimizer.
Little Registry Cleaner is also a great open source program that should be on the list, as is TCP optimizer.
First and foremost – DO NOT BUY ANYTHING AT WorstBuy! They will lie, cheat, inveigle, and obfuscate as much as humanly possible in order to achieve a sale. There’s lots of other places to shop which will get you the item at the same price, and indeed, cheaper when you take into account sales tax and shipping differences. Plus, it comes to your door – no need to hit “the mall” and “the parking lots”… No traffic.
But I digress – quite possibly the worst part of this ‘optimization’ is that WorstBuy is double-dipping. They already contracted with the computer mfr. to INSTALL the trialware that they are now charging you to REMOVE. The only reason they remove the shortcuts and not the whole package is so they don’t piss off the mfr. too much.
Just refuse to pay the charge. Get the computer, and tell them you don’t want the optimization. If they only have PC’s with the optimization, then buy it. Get in the parking lot, call the credit card company and charge back the amount of the optimization. Tell the CC company that the amount of the optimization wasn’t authorized. Fill out the paperwork, tell them you though the extra amount on the bill was due to sales tax but upon a more in-depth review it turns out they added stuff you didn’t want and didn’t authorize and specifically refused and you’ll get your money back. Enough charge backs and WorstBuy will have their ass in a sling by the CC companies… RETURN THE FAVOR to WorstBuy…
Very good article.
I can’t remember the last time I bought something from Best Buy.
They need to change their business practice otherwise they will end up like Circuit City.
I hear Systemax is doing good things now that it has acquired the CompUSA and Circuit City online names. There might even be more re-openings of CompUSA around the country.
Class Action Lawsuit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I see some media attention by any number of State Attorney Generals for bait and switch, mis-leading advertising and possibly fraud. Where is 60 Minutes and other “investigative” news shows when you need them.
Comodo is a good anti-virus and 2-way firewall software company. They recently began offering unlimited online technical support, via remote control, with their security suite for only $50/yr. I like the software, and if I had a choice between unlimited tech support and a one-time half-ass optimization I’d choose the former.
*I’ve used the free versions of their software, not the subscription. They offer a free trial.
Great Investigation
I would consider any unit that one buys as new from Worst Buy and is “optimized” as used. That is why I build my own desktops and reload notebooks directly from Microsoft’s discs. Rather than charging for optimization, a discount should apply. These idiots (Geek Squad) dont know WTF they are doing. Charging for RAM installation is a scam as are most “upgrades”. I believe the FTC should investigate and indict Best Buy for under the provisions of the RICOH act. Please send your investigative report to the FTC and possibly the FCC since notebooks do transmit radio signals.
What else could be said? Do we now start a Best Buy Death Watch as we did in 2008 with Circuit City.
BTW While down in Pembroke Pines Florida I visited “Comp USA” for chipset retention pins. Could easily tell it was a duplicate of a Tiger Direct such as the one in Toronto Ontario. Except in Toronto there is a real computer store with anything you need just around the corner. Tiger Direct, “Comp USA”, “Circuit City” are owed by the same entity. They must be licking their chops waiting to grab Best Buy name.
Charging for RAM installation is a scam as are most “upgrades”.
Many people don’t know how to do simply upgrades. How is it a scam anymore than charging for an oil change or a tire rotation for those of us who don’t have the know-how, equipment or it?
If your providing a legitimate service such as charging for changing ram, then there is nothing wrong with it. You have to figure out what type of ram to use, open the computer, probably clean it out, change the ram, then test the PC. This all takes time. Some of us don’t want to open a PC because we don’t know what we are doing in there and if we tried we could make things worse, so we pay someone to do it for us. I will pay someone to change the ram and clean out my PC but for sure I am not taking my business to geek squad.
I have never purchased a computer from a Brick & Mortar store and I never plan to but I wonder how they would respond to, “Yeah, I’m going to install linux as soon as I get home.”
I’ve asked BB employees if they have a TV that uses regular cables and one that used Monster cables. Surprisingly, all of their TVs use regular cables.
The article should recommend a defragging tool as well. When I help out people’s computers, one of the first things I notice is how fragmented the hard drives are. I would recommend using either Auslogics Disk Defrag ( http://auslogics.com/en/software/disk-defrag ) or Defraggler ( http://defraggler.com/ ). This helps sometimes, but I would do a defrag at least once a month…
First, I would NEVER want to buy any computer that had already been opened, even by a store’s staff. Never.
Wow, this story is stunning. I would hope major media outlets grab it and the Attorney Generals of several states get in touch with Best Buy. How many customers who don’t know better are paying $39.99 for this service?
“Attorneys General,” not “Attorney Generals.”
Sorry, pet peeve.
Look, if you buy a computer from some pimply faced kid who was selling toasters on the other side of the store the week before, then you get what you pay for.
But as a consumer, you have legal rights. Best buy is pulling a bait-and-switch on people answering their ads. It’s the responsibility of the consumer to contact the appropriate legal authority and file complaints. It’s the only way to deal with Best Buy. Always carry a notepad and let the “salesperson” and manager see you writing down names, dates, etc.
I hate your “sticky” posts. I have to read at least the first two articles to see if any new content was posted. yeah yeah minor complaint i know, but its a confusing design element. something more should offset it from the rest of the site
“Each station will be manned by Best Buy employees who might turn your tech questions into sales opportunities for Geek Squad.”
Do you know how hard it is these days to ask an employee any kind of technical question and get a decent answer WITHOUT an attempted upsell? It’s damned near impossible.
When I got hired on at my current job, I was already highly familiar with the products because they were a hobby of mine. I nor any of the other new hires were given any product training whatsoever. We were however, given extensive training on upselling, extended warranties and product protection services.
Swung by my local BB after reading this for lunch as I had to pick up an alarm clock and wii controller and decided to test this myself. Of course they tried to sell me the optimized package first. I told them I was proficient with computers and would like the non-optimized. They said “no problem” and were about to give it to me before I told them I wanted to shop around a bit.
This was the BB on N Rainbow in Vegas.
Ive used AVG free for the last 3 years and love it.
If best buy tried to sell me a laptop that was opened , “Optimized” and resealed I would demand a 15% open box fee be taken OFF the sales price since technically it was “Opened” and now “Used”. This is without a doubt a bait and switch tactic and believe me someone is gonna be looking into this real soon.
So I’m paying more for Best Buy to sell me an open box PC? Which begs the question, what keeps them from reselling returns as “optimized”? Don’t companies have some expectation that companies are selling their computers in sealed boxes and not doing something to mess them up? What happens when Best Buy screws up one of these “optimizations” and does something that voids a warranty?
I think this does call for an investigation
His quote is wrong. I corrected it.
I love the troll on the video. “I work at Best Buy…” Yeah, right.
Anybody notice BB is today’s front and center sponsor over at Gawker? Charming company they keep over there.
I used to love it, but I have run into a number of problems with AVG. On my current desktop, it has dug itself so deeply into the OS that I am unable to reinstall it even after running a few programs designed to get rid of it (all after the regular install package failed), manually removing many registry entries, deleting any known directory of it that I could find and overwriting a few modified windows system files. Any program that won’t properly uninstall itself is another AOL in my opinion. I have had spectacular success with Kaspersky in the past after getting it free after rebate, but have been loving Microsoft Security Essentials as it’s clean, quick, efficient and best of all, quiet! (And free.) It’s unobtrusive after only a couple changes in the settings. It has already caught and blocked two viruses and at no point has it pestered me with any popups or upgrade ads.
I think its funny if you head over to Lifehacker there is no less than 3 Geek Squad ads on there.
As the person who sent in the first story about this on 9/28/9 I feel awesome. Thanks Consumerist for making the magic happen.
I wonder how the laptop manufacturers feel about Best Buy doing this. Especially about all the trial programs installed on the system that Geek Squad removes. Isn’t there a reason they include this software on the computers (partnerships with other companies and promotion)?
I’ve never had too much trouble bringing out the two magic words…”Charge Back.” Yeah Best buy (Incident #4) charged me $35 for extra “Service”. I called AmEx and they said Bahhhh!…. Best Buy ain’t no problem.. Fill out this form and wait a week or two. Low an behold… I got my charge-back check.
….and all of this BS can be avoided by not shopping at Best Buy.
I’d recommend putting CCleaner under remove unnecessary software as well, as it is often more robust then what you listed.
In fact, it’s useful for all of the first 4, though that PC Decrapifier may be better.
Easy peesey! If you must buy from the Beast, then buy on-line and select in-store pickup. There is no hidden charge for Optimization and all you do is walk in and pick it up.
Lesson: Don’t buy stuff from Best Buy. Everything else assumes you did something wrong by ignoring point #1 and bought some thing from Best Buy. Don’t buy any warranty from Best Buy. Check your box before leaving Best Buy. Check your receipt and make sure they didn’t add items you didn’t want. Especially make sure you didn’t agree to any “free” service you’ll have to cancel later. Check receipt and make sure you got any discounts as advertised.
I work for Best Buy and I can tell you this, assuming this article is 100% true, than the person who sold these lied flat out.
Best Buy can under no legal way FORCE a customer to pay for the extra service. If they only have pre-set up computers (optimized, restore, whatever) left and the customer wants that model, but not the optimization, Best Buy MUST sell that computer to that customer with the service fee WAIVED.
In fact, barely 2 weeks ago Best Buy Corporate reminded all retail employees of this very fact.
Secondly, Geek Squad can NOT remove any trial software for a pre-set up, which means, Norton should NOT have been uninstalled. Geek Squad can only uninstall free trials when the customer directly requests it, which means, it should NEVER be done before a computer is sold.
Oh how I wish I could edit my grammatical errors.
Isn’t that worse though? $30 to $40 bucks just to delete a few icons and run windows update which is going to happen automatically when the machine gets connected to the internet for the first time?
Ummmmmm no. Where exactly is the service they provided?
Look I’m not trying to attack you personally, seriously. But this “service” is not defensible in any way.
I would like to see Consumerist follow-up with the computer vendors and see what their take is on having their products opened and tinkered-with by a retailer, pre-sale to a consumer. How might this affect the warranty to the consumer? Does that render the hardware “used”, in terms of warranty coverage? How does BB’s “optimization” (especially the removal of trial software (or shortcuts to the software) affect the manufacturer’s contracts with the 3rd-party software vendors?
I would also be interested in hearing what State AG’s might say about a retailer selling opened and used product as “new”. The obvious bait-and-switch of somehow only having “optimized” units available would be an interesting point to bring up, too.
What’s really hilarious is that quote from CEO Brian Dunn stating that they don’t outsource “experiences” that “touch the customer.” Their RewardZone customer service is outsourced to TeleTech (a global call center operator), their branded credit card is outsourced to HSBC (which in turn outsources customer service to India or some similar locale)…I could go on.
I was thinking the same thing about that comment. We should also remember that Geek Squad was purchased and did at one time operated at a much higher tech level than it does today. My guess would be that they were too fearful of liabilities and were unwilling to fork out the cost of proper technical staff when they could train highschool students on running a register and how to do an RMA for less. There is very little concern for the customer in the today’s Geek Squad contrary to the CEO’s gushing. The only lasting component is the mentioned mythology and corporate image of the original. Robert Stephens, original creator of Geek Squad does a number of marketing/business speeches these days. A quick search on google video returns some of them and they are worth checking out. He explains why branding was so important when they started out along with some other interesting facts about the partnership and then acquisition by Best Buy. http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=Robert Stephens
I work part time in the Geek Squad, so I thought I would weigh in with my two cents.
First, most of the “Agent Tweaks” as they are called were originally developed for XP, and to a greater extent, Windows Vista. For vista, they really did help (it’s sorta a system hog). With windows 7, most of these tweaks are already incorporated into the operating system, so yes, its a little useless. The upside are more simple things: when you get home, the battery is charged, and the computer is set up and ready to go. You don’t have to wait during the initial startup, press next a whole bunch, and download windows updates. For some, it’s not worth it, for others (mainly people who don’t have much experience with computers), it saves them a lot more time than it takes us to do it.
That being said, we have been told (especially when it was close to Black Friday) that if we force optimizations on people we can be fired. That wasn’t a word of mouth thing, that was official communication sent out.
The problem is a lack of communication between the people in the Geek Squad performing the optimizations and the people on the sales floor. Geek Squad knows the policy, and what an optimization includes (at my store at least…), the people on the floor don’t.
We basically have two options if we only have pre optimized computers – do a system restore and set it back to factory settings, or give it to the customer and don’t charge for the optimization. The only thing unavoidable is that the computer has been taken out of the box at some point – no real way to undo that.
If you are in a situation being forced to buy the optimization – ask to talk to the store manager, or just call 1-888-BEST-BUY. They know policy, and they will make sure it’s enforced. Not the most convenient option, but it’s there.
Let me know if you have any Geek Squad questions, I’d be happy to answer.
For those that are suggesting you can bypass this ‘optimization’ by purchasing online and picking up in-store, that’s not necessarily true.
I just purchased a laptop from them a few days ago, and chose store pickup. When I went to pick it up they told me that the only one left was an ‘optimized’ version. The clerk kept trying to tell me that it “basically doubled my processor speed” and when I asked for one without the optimization and found they didn’t have any, she kept remarking “how lucky” I was because I was going to get this $40 service for free!
While I didn’t have to pay for it, I was still very unhappy that I didn’t have a choice in the matter (needed the laptop that day). I am not a computer whiz, but I am savvy enough to follow the onscreen instructions Windows provides, lol. I know enough to choose how I want things set up and what I want on my own computer. I don’t have a problem so much if BB would give customers the choice to pay for this (though I think it is somewhat of a rip-off), but forcing it on them is not in good form.
Plus, just to echo what others have already commented on – what does this mean for things like Microsoft’s EULA? Also, I was under the assumption and paid for what I thought would be a brand new, factory sealed computer – it is wrong for them to be doing this. I had a friend who bought the exact same computer a few days before me so I knew exactly what was supposed to be on it and how it ran, and I have had more problems and issues already.
Bad form, Best Buy. This, plus my prior annoyance/hatred against GeekSquad is likely to keep me outta there for quite awhile.
I work for Geek Squad, and I think the Optimized computers are a joke. They make us do work that people do not want so they can up sale. They under pay us for the tech work we do. And over pay customers. I need a new job… anyone hiring?
Pay for software? It’s like paying for addition, subtraction, etc. It’s rather bizarre that people do it. Hey, I have a 500 Mhz machine that has been running 24/7 for nearly a decade now, acting as a web and sometime game server. Does it crash? Do any of my desktops ever crash, or have they ever had a virus? No! They only go down when the power goes out. Some of those same 500 Mhz machines served up desktops via Citrix (with Linux as the local OS). It’s amazing how capable and durable most computers are, and how well they function with non-broken (usually non-proprietary) software. (Oh, and the computers in question came from the CU WCRO office. Thanks, guys!)
My four cents. I have bought pre-op systems form Best buy, but was allowed to pay the un-op price when they did not have any un-op systems available. Since I wiped the system and started over it didn’t matter.
I suspect Best Buy was looking for a way to stem the red ink on systems returned as “I don’t want this” open-box, get a discount because someone else has fingerprints on it now, systems.
Running a scam, i mean process, that can get people to pay money for free tweeks to Windows makes sense to me, if I didn’t want to sleep at night.
Best Buy sales people have always inflated the value of the service offerings, but 200% boost? Vendor warranty blow up due to installing your own software? Almost as bad as the extended warranty BS they shout for laptops.
I bought a cheep DVD player, ($29.99) and they offered me an extended warranty for $29.99 to extend the warranty for an extra 2 years. When I asked them why I would pay for the system twice when I could just purchase a new one if this one died they really had no answer. The extended warranty question is the same as “you want fries with that?” at McDonalds or Burger King.
The GEEK Squad used to be the Ultimate place to work, until the sale to BB, now they are the same hacks you could get at any large tech company – Warm bodies following a scripted check list with time spent and dollars paid the only measure of “work done”.
Truelly sad to see how poor they actually perform in the real world.
I sell at Best Buy. This is not an official Best Buy statement, but I can tell you how I work, and how my store works.
When a customer buys a computer, I explain the optimization service, as well as the other services. Most of my customers are not experienced users, and some have no idea how to even open the optical drive. We tell them the computer will start faster and run smoother. The speed increase we have been told is 12 to 18%, average 15%. Some of my customers live in rural areas with no high speed internet, and so installing the Windows updates can be valuable. We uninstall some software, but not the Office demo. I think it is mostly the pile of free games. Ask an agent. The last part is the adjustments. There are about 280 registry tweaks. They are done by a program. If the customer is an experienced user I drop the subject. If all I have is optimized units, I tell them, and if they don’t want the service, I have to give them that unit without charging for it, or we could use the recovery partition on the PC to restore the system. We sometimes pre-optimize up to 40% of a model. The service can take 90 minutes to do, so this saves the customer from waiting or coming back. The free antivirus is free for 6 months, but you have to sign up for auto-renewal with a credit card. We explain how that works, and it is explained on the pad when they sign, and it is explained on their receipt. If you don’t want it, don’t get it. Yes, there is free software that can do a pretty good job. Does you Mom know which one to download, and where to get it?
We can also make restore disks, configure antivirus, and other things. Yes, we make a profit doing it. Yes, you can do it yourself. You can also change your oil, and even replace the alternator in your car. This is a service, and it is your choice. I won’t argue about it. I know a few will, but it is not Best Buy policy to push, but rather to explain the benefits.
As for the pressure and botched work, I know some stores are breaking corporate rules to boost their numbers. Call 1888BestBuy. I don’t want them making me look bad, and getting better profits at the same time.
If you have to buy from Best Buy, then you gotta know exactly what you want. Don’t go in there asking for help or suggestions. They’ll just end up ripping you off some way or another. They do have some decent deals once in a while.
I have a couple of things to say here, both positive and negative.
First of all, I applaud using a reliable party such as Consumer Reports to do some testing, and you are absolutely spot on in relaying the incompetent training of the Best Buy staff and you also clearly seem to have exposed some very shoddy “optimization” taking place.
The “more than 100 tweaks” mentioned by Geek Squad above refers to their MRI (and possibly the Customization) disks. Used by a trained staff person, these collections of programs are outstanding and are the envy of people like me who do this sort of work. However, Geek Squad has a terribly trained staff, along the lines of the terribly uninformed Best Buy staff. If you get a good BB or GS employee, they do exist, but it’s rare. It appears likely that your purchases caught Best Buy in the act of selling computers that were MRI’d by poorly trained GS staff.
However, I must chide you for then venturing into an area where you are not an expert, specifically the table at the end for “self” optimization. And if you got help with this section of the article, you got poor help.These instructions are at best vague and in most cases, most computer users shouldn’t just be jumping into Msconfig for example.
Spybot S&D is no longer a preferred application. It has not kept up with the latest generation of malware and installed by a novice, often creates more headaches than it will prevent. Likewise CCleaner can often mess up a computer’s startup process, creating lots of issues. I urge anyone reading this article to pretty much not follow its advice.
Here’s my advice on making your new PC run well:
Install Microsoft Security Essentials (which includes Defender). It’s working very well, and it’s free. Most AV programs are just not keeping up with malware and so it makes little sense introducing a lot of 3rd party apps that slow down your system, especially if you’re not a computer geek. That being said, Avast isn’t bad. But it, too, has lost favor with the IT enthusiasts, just as AVG did some time ago.
Do not install additional antivirus programs! if you run multiple av or firewall programs on your PC, you’re asking for trouble.
Install Malwarebytes AND Super-Antispyware. These are your successors to Spybot and they both excel in different areas. They don’t interfere with AV scanning. You manually run these every couple of weeks.
Install new programs very judiciously. There is a lot of badly written code out there and this affects your computer’s performance. Keep it lean and mean. Don’t just install every bit of software that catches your eye or is free.
And if you’re a novice thinking of buying a new computer, consider the extra $ and get a Mac. You’ll have far fewer headaches (which adds up to time and money and aggravation saved) and the machine is designed to do what you’re most likely wanting to do with it. A big exception would be that it’s not a machine for a hardcore gamer.
Sometimes little things speak volumes. Usually, these business practices are just the tip of the iceberg, and only more trouble can be expected down the line. Imagine wanting to make a warranty claim from Best Buy, or just asking a basic question after purchasing an item. When management is focusing only on “extracting value” from customers, rather than service, it is time to walk away. Management should label this practice as “Best Bye” to their customers.
Best Buy walks a fine line. Several years ago, I found a TV advertised and called about it. I was told yes, we have it, but hurry because we only have one left. As I was pulling into the parking lot, I saw a family hauling the same TV to their car. When I got mine, another “last one,” I surreptitiously wrote my initials on the box. When it was delivered, the initials were not there – guess they had more than one after all.
On another shopping trip, I was looking at digital cameras. I found the one I wanted in the case and asked to see one up close. The clerk said he couldn’t take it out of the box, that I would have to buy it virtually sight unseen. I walked out, went to Target and bought the camera. Target rules.