Non-Receipt-Showing Walmart Customer Says He Was Physically Threatened
Tony's hands were full with a bookshelf and milk carton as he left a New Mexico Walmart, so he wasn't in a receipt-showing mood. He denied the security guard's request to stop and show him the receipt in the pocket, and says he was stalked and physically threatened as a result. He shares his Executive Email Carpet Bomb letter:
I recently broke one of those cheap bookcases y'all sell - I got it some 6 years ago, so I wasn't worried about it being replaced. I figured I'd just buy another one. So, off to the store just down the road from me in [redacted].
So I find a shelf that looks ok (beggers can't be choosers at this point in the evening), and take it to the check out. First off — there are only 5 registers open. Each line is 9 people deep. I go up to the customer service counter, check out there. Go to the GM door to leave, holding this 25lbs bookshelf under my arm with a jug of milk in the other hand. Old guy at the door asks for my receipt - I state it's in my pocket, and ask him to hold the shelf. No deal. Fine, I'll leave. There is no law or agreement I have with your company to be searched or present a receipt. I understand that at Sam's Club there is, but I would have agreed to it there.
I walk out. The guy starts yelling at me, and as I turn around, I see him running at me with his arm across his head, like some amateur footballer ready to tackle me. I, being a slightly confrontational person, "Expletive dare" him to hit me like that. He backs off, I continue to my car, rather upset. I put my stuff in, and see him pop around another car and point at me while yelling "THERE HE IS" and two of what I presume is your loss prevention goons come out. They had no badges and didn't identify themselves, so I can again only presume. I said it's in my pocket, and they then say I could've stolen it. I leave.
I call and ask to speak to a manager and get Chris. He was pleasant enough and to be honest, I was a jerk to him. I get home, cool off, call back and apologize - he was grateful. He then goes to explain that it is policy to make sure electronics not in a bag are not stolen.
How is a 25 lbs bookcase electronics worth running me down and treating me like some perp on cops when apparently the policy is electronics? Should I worry about the eletronic content in a bookcase now? Or should I travel with a lawyer should I ever venture to wal*mart again?
From all my legal understanding, you have no right to even try and detain me, let alone charge at me for leaving your store. What was the point of this?
Tony first wrote us in June, and has never heard back from Walmart corporate. We're no lawyers, but there are some legal gray areas in forced detaining of suspected shoplifters, particularly those who don't appear to be concealing anything. We're surprised Walmart doesn't respond to complaints about this subject, you know, considering the recent news.
Previously:
Detained And Harrassed At Walmart For Not Showing A Receipt
EECB Stops Improper Searches At New Mexico Walmart"
Do I Have To Let Stores Check My Receipt
(Photo: genebob)
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Comments:
@wchamilton: I'm only getting even a hint of that after they follow him out into the parking lot - which is, among other things, probably against the store's policy in the first place. I'd be annoyed too, if I were followed out into the parking lot to prove I'd made a purchase, especially when they're large and bulky and the register from whence it was purchased was probably within sight of the receipt checker...
Well, first of, asking for a receipt is pretty much accusing you of shoplifting, so I'd say they are the ones "starting it".
Why should a legitimate shopper be inconvenienced as he is carrying out the items he bought? Do shoplifters usually go around carrying their items in plain sight? Nope.
They need to get rid of that receipt checking policy, it is ridiculous. I always decline and haven't run into any problems yet, but could easily see some asshat causing me some trouble when I refuse to show my receipt. Fry's also checks them at the exit which annoys me since I love that company so much - but have never had an issue when I decline there either. Stop treating your customers like criminals!
Last year I bought some stuff at Walmart and proceeded to the door. When I got to the exit, I was asked for my receipt and very politely said "You don't need to see my receipt you old hag". I know - not appropriate nor polite, but I was in no mood to be harassed.
As I was getting close to my car, I see some guy running out the store after me. I stop, turn and give him the "come on" look and he stops and walks back to the store.
I now have a new method: I crumble MY receipt and jam it in my pocket. If they want to see it -- Good Luck!
@winstonthorne: we really need more people to do this, if only to convince walmart that this is just a bad policy and that people won't yield to intimidation. Unfortunately, walmart takes advantage of the fact that most people respect "authority" unconditionally, regardless of whether there is any legal basis for that authority, either because of ignorance or just wanting to make the big scary man to go away.
A bit offtopic but the other day my son went to BB to buy a game for his DS, and it turns out that they have come up with a new and interesting way to ensure that you show your receipt at the door - the check-out cashiers no longer remove the theft-prevention cases around the games themselves. In order to get the cases removed, you have to ... guess what? Yep. Take it to the door, and show the door receipt checker your receipt, and he/she removes the case.
@winstonthorne: I've never been stopped. It's amazing because if I can fit it in my purse or it's a single item I don't use a bag. I had a Walmart giftcard and used it for in-store pick up of Windows for Mac and walked out with it coming from the back of the store (the pick up area) in my hand, no bag and the "receipt checker" just waved me through. Best Buy never seems to care either. The most I've gotten from them is a nod.
I understand them wanting to see a receipt when someone is just carrying something out. It is just different than a cart full of bagged items.
I hate it though, for all the reasons ever mentioned here.
With all the cameras Walmart has - and they have TONS of cameras - and with facial recognition software, why don't they just have checker ask, and when you won't they just click a button and the system notes time/place.
Security can find your face - or a computer does it in a couple nanoseconds - and it watches out for you in the future.
When you come back, security watches you on cameras, and gets bored because your just a regular shopper.
I have no problem with this - I'm in your store, I don't expect privacy while I'm picking out my breakfast foods. Film me. Enjoy.
on the few occasions in which i find myself in walmart, i've never been asked for a receipt. i've never seen anyone asked for a receipt. rarely do i even see anyone in a walmart smock standing by the exit door (and when i do, they are usually messing around with the carts).
i guess this receipt checking thing is standard practice elsewhere?
@alexanderpink: At least Frys (the ones I've been in, anyway) let you know with that big red sign that they'll ask for your receipt. Other places it's a crapshoot.
The worst was being asked to show my receipt at WalMart when I clearly wasn't carrying anything. I tried not to laugh as I walked away from the insistent geriatric.
Now I feel bad for laughing at an old guy.
Umm, I have to maybe agree with Wal-Mart here (except for leaving the store).
He stated in his email he didn't want to wait in line, so he went to customer service....
So out he walks from Customer Service, no cart, receipt not in hand, and tries to walk out the door. I'd think that was suspicious too, since merchandise that comes in for return they should be marking with a colored tag.
Was the milk in a bag? I don't think it was. The greeters around here usually check receipts when there is a potential for something to have gone wrong. Such as unbagged merchandise, or merchandise on the bottom of the cart. While the ACMs have sensors looking for a cart (It prompts to make sure you've taken everything from the bottom of the cart), I don't think the regular lines have that sensor.
@humphrmi: I hope BB doesn't implement that with all their stores. I'm just the type of person to ask for the key to security case. If it's not taken off at the point of sale, then I can safely consider that as part of my "purchase".
If they were to decline that, then back to the returns department I would go!
@wchamilton: I actually found it kind of refreshing that he was owning up to being a jerk. In so many of the articles that get posted the OP tries to frame themselves as a perfect angel who would never even consider raising their voice to their fellow man, while the CSR they're dealing with is the spawn of satan himself. Stories with some grey areas (ie., the OP admitting he didn't handle things optimally on his end either) are generally much more believable.
@humphrmi: At that point, I would just assume I've purchased the game AND the case. I'm pretty sure I can get the case open at home. :)
I don't quite understand the policy anyway. The guys are standing there, they can see that you went through the line and paid for whatever you paid for. Do they think that you slipped a TV into the cart while no one was looking? It would be easier for the store to just have the cashiers do a more thorough check of your cart to make sure you paid for everything. This way they don't need to have some senior citizen have a WWII flashback when they try to tackle me for not showing the receipt.
@humphrmi: I wonder how that would work if you refused to show your receipt. Would they refuse to give you your item? What if you then wanted to return it? Would they give it back to you to return if you refused to produce the receipt again?
In this instance, the guy was asked because he had an unbagged item; this I can understand. However, most stores that I've been to that are not WalMart have a very advanced system for indicating that an item to large to be bagged has indeed been paid for: A piece of brightly colored tape they affix to the outside of the box. This saves anyone the inconvenience of being stopped by LP on the way out the door.
Surely WalMart has the resources to implement such a plan? If Sears can do it in the sorry state they're in now, why can't WalMart?
@j-o-h-n: I'm with John. If I buy the game, and they leave the case on - well free case! It is not like the thing is made of adamantium, after all. Just some plastic.
@wchamilton: His attitude is irrelevant. They had no business following. I'd be feeling a bit 'comfrontational' myself, in that situation.
@Kris123: Since they're not officers of the law and couldn't get a warrant for any reason, I don't see how they could legally search you whatsoever.
@Al Swearengen: If the cashiers had to take an extra few seconds to check out someone's cart, everyone would start whining and crying about how long the wait is and how the cashier is accusing them of being a criminal and they just wanted to buy some food and how dare you waste their time.
I like using something like the following:
"So, if I was stealing something, what would you do? What COULD you do? If I were a theif, I would just take off. If you came after me, you could get badly hurt. So is it really worth it? To find out if I actually bought these? Oh, just ask register #(insert register number here) to verify i actually did buy these. You'll be safer that way."
@humphrmi: Best Buy isn't the only place that sales DS games. If the cashier refused to give me access to a game I purchased (e.g. unlock the case) then I would request an immediate refund, buy the game across the street at gamestop/walmart/target, and never buy DS games as Best-buy again.
@RecordStoreToughGuy_DragonsAreForSlayingNotPlaying: Probably cause he wasn't willing to wait the 5 minutes in line and made the customer service desk check him out instead. This guy seems a bit unreasonable; he requires special treatment cause he doesn't want to wait in line, but then won't let the guy at the door check his receipt while he tries to walk out with unbagged merchandise from a direction other than the checkouts. He seems more than a bit entitled.
@Kris123: Not really. The constitution applies as much in retail as anywhere. Numerous people have sued over receipt/bag checks and prevailed. If they suspect theft, they can detain you, but they can also be held liable for false arrest and harassment if there's no cause.
Stores in my area are generally very good about backing off. After I was hassled twice at target (and complained both times), the security guard demanding receipt checks was fired.
@triscuitbiscuit: And don't call the stores products Cheap
I recently broke one of those cheap bookcases y'all sell...Or don't insinuate that the products someone sells are ugly.
So I find a shelf that looks ok (beggers can't be choosers at this point in the evening)...Which is how I read the above comment after reading the cheap comment. Would have been better to say, I was in need of a bookcase after the one I currently used broke. And "After finding a bookcase that met my needs..."
Maybe that is why he hasn't gotten a response. We have seen some very well written EECB's here and this is not up to snufff. You would think that a reader of the site would have read how to write a good EECB.
@wchamilton: No, I'd say he didn't get confrontational until after the security guard started running after him and yelling. Regardless, they have no legal right to stop him. He was willing to show the receipt, if the guard was willing to hold his bookcase. Honestly, the loss prevention folks need to use some common sense - is someone carrying a cheap 25-lb. bookcase the one you really need to worry about?
@339point4: It's definitely regional; for example, in the predominently white, middle-class western suburbs of Chicago, never. In the more ethincally diverse southern suburbs, often.
I absolutely agree that the store has no right to demand to see your receipt. That said, my "policy", which, unlike WalMart's, is binding on me, is that if I am carrying something not in a bag, or that I can't just put in my pocket after paying, I'll show them my receipt. If not, I politely decline and walk by.
I made up my mind to ignore this silly policy a couple Christmases ago, when I snuck away from my son to buy him the new Rock Band game. I left the store with the game, paid for back in the electronics section, unbagged (of course) up on my shoulder, and no one challenged me.
I went back inside and retrieved my son, who wanted a 79 cent pack of gum, which was purchased and bagged. As we left the store, they wanted to see the receipt. Sigh.
@wchamilton:
I don't think, by his description, he was in a confrontational mood. Had he been in one, he wouldn't have told them the receipt was in his pocket. He would have immediately told them to f*ck off.
@squinko:
I was thinking the same thing. You can just say "No, thank you" and move on. Calling someone an old hag is completely unnecessary in this situation.
@winstonthorne: I tried to just keep walking the last time I was asked for my receipt and the checker grabbed my cart and yanked it back. In the process, she woke up my 5-month-old who was sleepingin her carseat in the cart. I returned my purchase and haven't been back since.
@mizike:
That's a giant leap to make. He doesn't say he made the customer service desk check him out. Chances are, they opened a register because the store was busy and they only had a few registers open. I doubt he could "make" them check him out at customer service.
















Seems to me that the OP was in a confrontational mindset from the beginning of this encounter to the end. He even admits being a jerk to the manager he called to address the issue with.