Home Depot Jacks Up Price For Countertop After Order Placed, Homeowner Says
Giovanni and his wife bought a counter from Home Depot, but caught a nasty surprise when he called to check on the order. Suddenly he was told he had to cover a minimum order and he'd have to pay hundreds more than the agreed upon price. Now kitchenless in New York, he writes:
I'm wondering if you guys have some advice for us. We recently decided to get our small New York kitchen redone, and went to our local Home Depot to buy a new counter. The guy we spoke with, [redacted], was friendly and helpful, and he suggested a specific color of Corian counter because according to him it was the only type that did not have a minimum order (otherwise we would have had to pay for a much larger counter than we needed). He drew up the paperwork and we signed for it and paid approx. $750 with a credit card. In the meanwhile, we had our old counter removed for the counter people to measure the space exactly and because we are re-tiling that wall. So now we don't have a counter.
This morning my wife called Home Depot to check if they could speed up our order (they had told us it would take up to three weeks), and was told by the person she spoke with (someone named [redacted]) that there had been an error and that there actually was a minimum order on the counter and that we had to pay another $500. My wife explained that we were told that there wasn't a minimum on the style we ordered, and the person replied that the contract says that prices are apt to change upon measurement. But clearly that applies only if the measurements are different than what was estimated, and has nothing to do with a minimum — the measurements came back the same as the estimate, so there was no reason there for any price adjustment.
I called [redacted] and he was busy so I left a message, and he later called and left us a voicemail saying that he had not said that there was no minimum, that he had actually said that he would try to negotiate with their vendors and that my wife had misunderstood. That really made me angry, because I was there when he said there was no minimum, and now he was trying to blame it on my wife. I called [redacted] again, and after I confronted him he admitted he had made a mistake and that he would speak with his manager. He called again and left another voicemail (which we still have) in which he again admits he made a mistake but that the best they can do is split the difference with us. So basically we made a deal with Home Depot, paid for it and have their signed paperwork PLUS a recorded voicemail saying they had promised us something else, but they want us to pay an extra $250! Isn't that illegal?
I'm calling the store manager, someone named [redacted], tomorrow (I called today but was told he had already left), but from the conversations we've had so far it looks like they're really going to insist on this new charge.
I'd say it's time to abandon ship, dispute the charge and move on to another company. Another option is to contact the Attorney General's Consumer Protection Division at 1-800-368-8808.
What do you think, internet?
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Just take them to small claims, their Corporate legal team is filled with idiots. They'll never get anywhere and you'll end up with the money back.
The OP's best solution is to stop it before it gets too far. There's no amount of negotiation at this point that would convince Home Depot to just give you the counter top. They know they've already lost a repeat customer - they just want to recoup the cost that they really meant to charge.
It seems to me that the Home Depot employee made a big mistake, and is trying to salvage the situation for his boss by offering to split the difference with the OP. I don't think the OP is obligated to give Home Depot anything, since they were told one thing, and then found out they were going to be charged more later onward.
I say refuse the shipment, get a full refund (services not rendered, you're still far enough from delivery time that they probably haven't cut your counter top yet) and go elsewhere for your counter top needs.
It sounds like you have an enforceable contract. yes?
I don't know how small claims court works in New York. Can you sue to force performance of a contract? Or is small claims just for monetary damages?
If not, then a lawyer will cost you something like the $250 just to send them a scary letter.
If there was a signed contract with a clearly stated price, I don't see how Home Depot can go back on it and change anything. Maybe what they signed was just an estimate though?
Tailor-made for small claims.
Without seeing the contract, it's hard to say. No matter what the salesman said, she signed a contract with them that says what the real conditions are. The person on the phone seems to indicate that the price can rise and the price she was given was just an estimate.
@squinko: Most likely.
However, with the voice mail in hand, I would go into Home Depot and tell them you're canceling, before anything else goes wrong, and don't be afraid to hint that small claims court/other legal options are not out of the question.
They shouldn't fight you, and in the long run I think you will be better off. Otherwise, what happens when they call tomorrow and tell you something else was wrong? Best to stop it before anything enters your house and by extension, becomes your problem.
@EricL:
Gil: "Well, if you, well ... really? Wow, Hot, hot dog! A sale!"
Stan: "I'll take it from here, Gil."
Gil: "No, wait, no. Aw, you can't take my sale. My wife's going to leave me if I don't start bringing in the green. Come on, let me have this one, Stan, I'm begging you. Look at me, I'm begging you, Stan."
Stan: "Mmmm-hm" (he walks into his office with Homer) "Let's go write this up, shall we?"
Gil calling his wife on a rotary cell phone: "Honey, you should have seen me with my last customer, I ... no, but I came so close. This guy was as ... Whose voice is that? Is that Fred? ... Aw, you said it was over ... No, don't put him on -- Hello, Fred, h-hi."
It would be hard to find a countertop place that will not charge you for a whole slab, unless they can do the job out of remnants. Hence the minimum charges. When we did our kitchen, I had them cut some tabletops out, since we had purchased the slab, I wanted more of it than was being installed!
If they start over, I suspect they will be paying a similar amt to what Home Depot is charging, but it will be 3 weeks later. However, it might be worth putting down some plywood and finding a good local shop, they often do better work anyway!
Call Home Depot Customer service, usually they will try to solve your problem. If that doesn't work then try an EECB, It worked for me when I worked there.
I worked there for several months, and to clarify about the "Contracts" they are estimates, until paid for at the register. At that point in time, as long as they paid some amount of money the estimate then became a legally binding contract. If the EECB doesn't work take them to small claims court. the amount of the contract is well within the NY State limits for small claims court. Depending on your county or city the fees for filing a case in small claims court varies, Check with your local town, city, or county court clerks office for more information.
We had a similar situation with Lowe's. I needed a replacement window, just one. "$99.00 installation fee".
$35.00 to come out and measure but that money could be applied to the window if I did chose to go with them.
Waited for measuring day. Then came the call from Lowe's. They made an oopsie! The installation would now be $249.00. What?
Oh, small job surcharge, explained the window dept guy.
I said, That's not what I was told nor what your sign says.
Again, the "I'll talk to my manager and make you a deal."
I stood my ground. $99.00.
Agreed. He said, Come in and pick out your 3'x 2' in stock window so we can get started.
Drove down. The man looked at my paperwork and said, Oh I am so sorry, we only have 2'x3' windows in stock. Yours will have to be a special, custom window and it will take weeks. Plus, our windows have a trim edge that will have to be cut off and I'll have to check with the contractor, but that's going to be a lot of extra money to get the window to fit your space...
He actually told us to go elsewhere because, "It might be cheaper for you."
Lost our $35.00 measuring fee. Thanks, Lowe's.
We moved on because of the ridiculous amount of wasted time.
I would let corporate know, by letter, why you aren't doing business with them any more. What was particularly galling was that the OP may have chosen a countertop that he didn't particularly care for, because of the supposed cost savings.
Check with a local company. I thought prices would be higher than the big box stores but in the end, one window person suggested replacing only one section of the window and the final price was under $100.
The reply from Phil is your best option. Cancel the order, do a charge-back and call the Attorney General.
It shouldn't be the price that stops you from dealing with them. Don't deal with them because THEY LIED.
@pecan 3.14159265: This is the great example of why I buy things with a cc. Refuse the order and call the cc and they'll do an appeal and you'll get you money back pronto!
An people wonder why I AV everything once I leave the house. This has happen to me (no like this but close) in the past. I called the person a lair, said being you did not say this. I guess the AV of what you said can be posted (Yes I can and have done it). How fast they back off.
I'm the person who sent the query to Consumerist. As I said in a follow-up email, after two days of angry phone calls on my part and some ridiculous back and forth from them, Home Depot relented and dropped their last-minute charges.
I had also sent an email to their CEO (as recommended in a previous Consumerist post) and their office called me a couple of days later to make sure everything was in order. I asked them to see if they could do anything to expedite the order, since it had been on hold for almost two weeks, and the person I spoke with said she would look into it.
@Skankingmike: To get the money back, all they need to do is dispute with the CC company.
To make a stink and possibly force them to honor what they quoted, I think the Attorney General is the way to go - ESPECIALLY in NY.
I feel your pain, literally, every day as I look at our granite counter tops. We ordered them at Home Depot, the first install was a total botch job, backsplash wasn't cut right or even the same length as the counter, they cut the sink hole way to big ON SITE with our sink to use as a guide. When my wife pointed out the erroneous measurements the minimally English speaking crew said sometimes that happens. So my wife called HD and complained. They hooked us up with a escalations person who got the contractor to come back out toe try to fix the backsplash, in the process they ripped up the wall a good bit and as they were working the escalations manager arrived to make sure it was coming out ok she had a fit over the quality of the work and the fact the backsplash was from a different slab and wouldnt match the counter top. On top of that she could see daylight around our sink froim below so she made them replace that piece too.
They made a new template and left. My wife complained about paying a plumber to come reseat the sink again and HD offered to send theirs at no cost. A week later they came out with the new backsplash and counter, the counter was too long this time, they cut it and polished it on site, they got the new backsplash installed in almost an acceptable manner (it still doesn't look like something that cost nearly $50/sq ft because they didn't miter it in very well).
The plumbers arrived and said that you couldnt seat that sink in that hole because the self riming sink didnt have the right clamps, this despite the HD escalations person having said when she was out prior that they could install longer clips if needed. So the sink is 'glued' in with silicone caulk (though there is a gap around the edge that the plumber said should be there so water and crumbs get under the rim of the sink). After this last install we just gave up, HD for something like this just SUCKS and we will never use them for a professional service again and we have a very expensive reminder of why. We could have called and complained again but why, so we could not use our kitchen again for a period of time while the fixed it? It gets tiring that you cant get a quality job the first flippin time. HD just doesnt seem to care. I dont think we ever got a follow up call from HD after the reinstall.
@Hawkins: Just remember, the moment you mention 'lawyer' 'lawsuit' 'small claims court' or any legal term, they're going to stop negotiating with you, so make sure there's no chance of them taking the hit first.
The only thing that really matters here is what the actual contract they signed says. It makes little difference what the salesperson told them (at least as far as enforceability).
General Home Improvement Advice: The local Big-Box stores generally do not have their own home-improvement guys. Instead, they sub the work out to some other company that actually does the job after taking a cut.
You can save big money and aggravation by hiring the contractor yourself, and as an added bonus, very few independent contractors charge for measuring. Angie's List can be a great place to find contractors.
When we had a laminate countertop installed, we saved $600 by hiring the countertop guys ourselves.
@Hawkins: You usually can't use SCC to enforce a contract action, just monetary damages.
If the OP goes to a different vendor, and it costs more, then SCC could be an option to recoup the difference in the prices. But an attorney should review the contract written up by Home Depot, I'll bet it's ironclad, although a small claims judge wouldn't like this kind of conversation:
HD Esq: "Your honor, on the back, in Subchapter Z of subdivision D, it clearly states that the contract price is subject to change."
Judge: "Umm, does the staff put on a minimum price if there is one?"
HD Esq: "Well, yes, but..."
Judge: "Why didn't they this time?"
HD Esq: "Subchapter Z..."
(I don't think the judge would take too kindly at that point, in my experience SC judges are usually friendly to consumers without legal knowledge)
Based on our experience with IKEA, I'm betting a lot of the problem is with a third party counter company. We were perfectly happy with IKEA's end of things but holy crap on a stick the counter company was AWFUL. They kept having artificial delays, would say someone was coming and then no one would show and call us liars when we called to ask why nobody had shown, they made a mess of things, they scratched our tiles, etc etc etc. Awful, horrible company. And meanwhile IKEA couldn't do much about it.
So maybe find out who the third party contractor is and go to them directly. Then, at least if they give you the same hassle, you know there's no point in arguing and to go elsewhere.
@ninabi: YES. Always check with a local company first. I got an estimate from Home Depot for carpeting our finished off walk-up attic. They told me the price with the carpet we chose (we chose a little lower grade carpet because we wanted to keep the cost down if we could). When they asked about the installation, they asked if I wanted the stairs down regular, or "Hollywood" style. I asked the difference, and he said Hollywood style was when the carpet is tucked under the lip of the stair. Well, from what I can tell, the entire house is done that way so I wanted the steps to match. So of course, the price goes up. Otherwise, they just stretch the carpet over the step, which to me is pretty lazy.
So we called a local carpet company, they came out with a free estimate and told us the price - it was only $100 or so more, but we got better carpet, and each step was done the correct way. Plus, they did the job in 1 day because their installers are used to houses like ours (Built in 1900 and the rooms are not square in the slightest). Home Depot would have had an installer come in from God knows where.
@sleze69: Possibly, however CC's are not always inclined to offer charge backs, remember CC's make more money from the retailer than you.
@ShruggingGalt: I would be surprised if there aren't HD cancellation clauses with no penalties for them.
I work for Home Depot's main competitor (I'll bet you can figure out who) and have a tip for the OP. If the salesperson said that there was no minimum charge for the job, then tell the store manager to simply sell the countertop at cost. Otherwise, get your money refunded and go elsewhere. The retail pricing should be marked up about 35%
$555.56 x 1.35 = $750.00
$370.37 x 1.35 = $500.00
$555.56 + $370.37 = $925.93
$925.93 - $750.00 = $175.93
The store would have to sell the job for $175.93 below their cost, which is certainly cheaper than having to drag their legal team into this mess. By informing the store manager of this, they may decide that it is better to take a $176 loss. Another thing that may help is if you changed from Corian to another brand of acrylic solid surface material (I think Home Depot sells Staron), since Corian is typically the priciest. If you go with a less expensive material, then your $750 goes further, and the store might not have to take as big of a loss. The quality of solid surface from one brand to the next is equal, in my opinion.
I unfortunately have seen this happen too many times, though thankfully it wasn't on any jobs that I have sold.
I had a counter from HD installed. They SUB Everything out, but I got a good sub! The contract does say prices subject to change, but that's because your measurements aren't what they go by. They go by the contractors measurements (theirs are much more accurate). The excuse they are using that the "Price is subject to change" for this reason is Bull. Just call them and cancel the order.
Are you in a bad spot right now because you have no counter? Yep. Been there, feel your pain. Call some local contractors and see what they will do. Call a counter top maker directly, see if there are cut pieces left from a previous job that will fit in your space. Normally there are, and they normally only charge a cutting charge for them.
This exact thing happened to me except it was with carpet. Take your contract (quote sheet and installation approval) and go scream bloody murder to the manager.
Here is what happened to me:
I bought 231 square feet of carpet for an 11'x21' room. The cost including install and taxes came to $450. I put a down payment and signed the papers. They then sent someone to my house to take measurements (some people can't use a tape measure). My measurements were bang on, they confirmed this. I got a call a week later to confirm the install, at that point the Home Depot person informed me that the final cost would be $750. I was told the carpet had to be bought in "sheets" and couldn't be sold by the square foot (despite a large advertisement in store and the contract that I had that said otherwise). The sheet was 20 x 40 and I would have to buy that and then pay install on top of it (even though half of the sheet would have been thrown away). I went to customer service and informed them that in the province of Ontario (where I live) we have consumer protection laws that state no job/product offering can be more than 15% higher then the quote for the job. It's part of our new anti-gouging laws. I also pointed out the signage pointing to the carpet we chose that says, only "$XXX per square foot". There solution was to give me a refund, I refused and demanded to speak with the manager. After much back and forth, they called her. She heard the story, looked at the paperwork and admitted she had "no choice" but to honour the quote. I got my carpet installed two weeks later for $450.
Check your consumer protection laws, hang onto your paperwork and argue like hell. They can't do this to people, it's unethical, amoral and if it's not technically illegal it should be.
@sirwired: Menard's doesn't coordinate the sub-contractors, they just keep flyers and business cards at the order counters. They may charge these subs a nominal fee for hosting their material, and that gets baked into their estimates, but YOU have the power to get multiple estimates and choose the sub you want.
I had the same thing happen to me with HD. They do sub everything out, and I had the subcontractor out to do the measuring. I discovered he was the guy who did some nice work for a neighbor of mine, so I went with HD for the job. (The job was replacing several interior doors in my house.) I had to pay for the measuring and this fee was nonrefundable but applicable towards the final fee if I chose to have HD do the work.
Went to the store to pick out the doors I wanted. Waited while they did the price figuring. Decided to come back another day because after an hour, they still couldn't tell me how much the job was going to be.
Came back a couple of days later, they had everything all figured up and I signed the sales and installation contract. They had told me that the subcontractor who measured the doors was going to be the one who put them in, and I noted this on the contract. I put down a substantial deposit with a check.
A few days later, they call to tell me the amount was much higher and I would have to pay more. I got well and truly pissed and was going to hold them to the contract, and then they told me that they were going to have someone else do the work, not the subcontractor who I wanted (and whom I had noted on the contract.) The contract did say something about them being able to choose the contractor, but that didn't jibe with what they had told me verbally (and I had noted it on the contract in writing.)
When I told them that this was a materially adverse change in the terms of the contract and I wanted them to refund all my money including the nonrefundable measuring fee, the bonehead I talked to actually had the nerve to tell me I would forfeit some of my deposit for canceling the contract. This was literally two days after I had signed it. (The doors I had chosen were in-stock items and work had been done yet. We hadn't even scheduled an appointment to have them installed.)
I couldn't believe my ears. Honestly, I was beginning to think this whole thing was a scam.
Fortunately I had been to small claims court before and I had a lawyer doing some work for me (regarding another matter) and he gave me some free advice for dealing with HD. (He had had a bad experience with them as well, so not only did he have an opportunity to vent about them to me, I feel I got really good advice.)
The upshot was, I got all my money back including the "nonrefundable" measuring fee. I dropped the idea of having HD do the work with another contractor because I didn't want someone like Red_Eye's crew showing up to hang doors. In order to get my money back, I did have to write a masterpiece of a letter with all the right legal phrases. I had a friend deliver it in person (like a process server) to the manager of HD and get a receipt showing he had received it. (This last bit wasn't advice from my lawyer, it was a bit of intimidation that I had thought up.)
I will *never* deal with HD again. And in the future, I will pay by credit card instead of check to give myself one more avenue of getting my money back. HD tied up the money I had paid as a deposit and it delayed my being able to replace these interior doors for a few weeks while I waited for their check and found someone else to do the job.
It's not really illegal, it is simply a breach of contract. They are refusing the deliver the product they agreed to deliver for the price you paid. While it is unfortunate, the most rational response is to simply cancel the transaction. Arguably, you might have a cause of action for minor damages, such as the cost to replace the item they failed to deliver in breach of contract, as well as the inconvenience of not having a counter top for however long it takes to replace it. You could go to small claims for that, might not be a complete waste of time for a few hundred bucks since small claims is a relatively simple process. Question is whether it is really worth it to you, as opposed to simply saying "my order is canceled, I am never shopping with you again."
I wouldn't assume that the manager will insist on charging you. Normal employees have very little leeway on things like this, but the manager usually has a wide degree of control. He would really be the only one who could fix the problem. Just calmly tell him if they aren't going to honor the promised price you are taking your business elsewhere, now and forever.
Or you can try this:
AMIRA WAZEER
THE HOME DEPOT CORPORATE OFFICE
SPECIAL PROJECTS TEAM- LEVEL II
2455 PACES FERRY ROAD
ATLANTA GA. 30339
800 654 0688 X 78646
@ShruggingGalt: I don't think it's molded for each job, though--it's cut from premade slabs just like other countertop materials.
@Skankingmike: Wrong answer. The CC has made their money when the charge was made, and they tacked on their interchange and transaction fees. Those are not refunded to the merchant. Also, the merchant will be charged a fine for the chargeback, depending on how many chargebacks they get over time. It's not trivial.
@ninabi: Somehow I doubt anyone gets that install price. I tried to have a door installed through home depot. Paid the $35 measurement charge and all the sudden my door is some weird non-standard door that requires a different more expensive door and a whole lot of custom work to install. Never mind that my original door and the one in the show room measure exactly the same. I think its some bait and switch BS that their contractors pull because they don't want to do small jobs.
If the person in question is in NYC they should contact the NYC Department of Consumer Affairs. Just call 311.
@Ben_Q2: I am assuming that you mean recording everything, but this is not legal in all 50 states without consent of any and all parties being recorded...
@sleze69: Is money what he wants to get back? Sounds like he wants specific performance on the counter he ordered. Thats a bit tougher.
@pecan 3.14159265: I don't think the problem here is how to get his money back but rather it sounds like the customer wants the benefit of his bargain - that is, the counter they sold him. I think he's got a case here. First step towards that end would be to actually talk with the store manager who may well rectify this and failing that contact Home Depot Customer Service/Corporate. I think theirs still plenty of time for the store to do the right thing. They need to honor their agreement.
The fact that the OP kept the recording of the employee admitting fault is fantastic. It'll go a long way.
If all the customer wants to do is cancel the sale, I doubt Home Depot would give him much trouble on it since it eliminates a headache for them also.
@foxdiddy: I know sometimes carpet can be more than you think because they have to match the pattern up (assuming there is one.) When we carpeted our home theater, we saved almost $700 by choosing a solid color on the riser and stage areas, instead of having the main patterned carpet on those areas and having to match up the pattern correctly. Fortunately, we had already had the measure so we knew when we picked out the carpet what the issues would be.
I just recently had home depot athome services come in to do some estimate for some work. They tried to push hard for me to commit and pay/sign up for financing on the spot. When I told them I would need to shop around and see what my other options the mood went from pleasant to almost hostile, they basically flipped out and told me I would never find a good contractor, or have a warranty like home depot and by not committing today, the whole process would have to start from scratch(took less than 1 hour). Keep in mind these guys dont work for home depot, they're outside contractors.
I recently had a counter put in and Swan Tile in Flushing not only beat home depot's price by 30%, they did a great job, and not charge me extra for delivery, no installation fee, or extra charge for being on a walk up.
@Red_Eye: When it comes to granite countertops, I always recommend going with a local place that specializes in it. HD and Lowe's only have a limited selection at very set prices, and you only see small samples of what pattern you're going to get. If you go with a local place, you'll likely see hundreds of colors and patterns, at a huge range of prices, and you'll probably get to pick out the exact slab of granite you want. We've done it both ways (HD for a condo kitchen several years ago, local granite company for our home theater last summer) and it was a FAR better experience going the local route.
I think you missed a [redacted] in there...