If you don't like your bank's policy why don't you switch to a credi- oops. Wrong post.

They didn't say if the Visa side of the cards were also limited to 40, and I'm guessing not since they suggest using it at businesses.

In this day and age, who doesn't accept credit cards? I'll tell ya who: businesses that don't like staying in business.

@zacox: In Philly, most small business (including one VERY popular restaurant near my house) only accept cash. It's a pain, but they seem to be doing fine.

In fact, if I'm going somewhere that's not a national chain, I make sure I get cash first because it's safe to assume they don't want anything to do with my credit or debit card.

go to a grocery store and buy a pack of gum with cash back, its cheaper than the ATM fee anyway!

@tsume: That is what I always do when their is no in-network ATM and I must have cash.
It's a win-win. Cheap sale, x-cash back, and no $1 (or more) service fee.

@sven.kirk: Plus gum!

This is like when my Credit Union puts limits on an out of state check when I try and cash one. They only let you have access to $100 and put a hold on the check for a whole week.

For as nice as credit unions are, they do seem to small minded about some things.

@Klaus_Kinsky: Some places won't give you a dime from out of state checks for 5 days. I was pleasantly surprised to learn I got $100 straight away.

So they're limiting the ATM transactions (which require a PIN) to $40 because of a security breach. The article doesn't give any additional details, but I assume that the PIN was part of the security breach. The workaround they propose is to go to a merchant to get cash back on a debit transaction (which also requires a PIN). How, exactly, does going through a merchant protect the customer at all?

@tsume: What sucks though is that when you're out of the US you can't use anything but the "credit" half of the credit/debit, so you can't get cash back easily. At least I've never gotten the prompt in Canada with my US card that I do with my Canadian card.

@Liam Kinkaid: I'm guessing it's more to protect the bank, by making the merchant pick up the tab instead for fraudulent use.

@Agent19488: The merchant only picks up the tab in fraudulent credit card purchases, not fraudulent debit usage.

@Citron:

They're doing as well as the other businesses because they aren't paying extortionary fees. Most businesses pay on the order of $0.50+5% of each transaction.

@Klaus_Kinsky: it usually takes a week, sometimes longer, to find out if a check is being returned for insufficient funds or a stop payment or fraud.

@Klaus_Kinsky: The check-hold periods, including the first-$100-available-right-away is all part of the Federal Reserve's Regulation CC governing check transit. Reg CC applies to a lot of institutions, including those who aren't Reserve Bank members, because the Fed moves check funds around.

@huadpe: Yeah, most Canadian retailers use Interac as the interbank network (the network that's used when you select PIN debit).

I don't know of ANY U.S. based financial institution using Interac as an interbank network right now (though I've heard Discover's PULSE interbank network is trying to make arrangements with Interac for interoperability). NYCE, STAR, SUM, etc. are more common over here.

Uhh...what's the point of this? If a fraudster can use an ATM, then they can do PIN-based or signature-based debit transactions too. Why aren't they more concerned about signature-based transactions where you don't need your PIN?

@zacox: circuit city? blockbuster? linens 'n' things?

Labor day really isn't something to celebrate! :-(

@azntg: Interac is Canadian only but has agreements with a couple of other businesses - PLUS is one can't recall the other.

Still it's a limited relationship - canadians don't have those fancy dual use cards. I carry a debit card (attached to my chequing and savings account) and a credit card. Both work at the ATMs, have their own PINs and only access the individual instrument. I dunno it works for us.

I honestly don't understand the 40/20 limit. If they know the affected people can't they issue them new cards/PINS Doyle quick?

@PsiCop: Yes, I know... they hide behind the time frame included in the federal law. But if you look at the actual law, you'll find that that is the maximum period-- not the minimum. This I think they learned from commercial banks.

@Klaus_Kinsky: Talk to your branch manager. My credit union doesn't do this on out-of-state business checks if you have direct deposit to your account.

@Fuzzy_duffel_bag: lol

@zacox: I will relay this news to the hundreds of small businesses and restaurants in Chinatown, San Francisco.

@Klaus_Kinsky: My credit union doesn't do holds on amounts under $5000 with one procedural exception. When I feed a check into the ATM, I can only get $100 out of it until the end of the next business day, then the whole amount becomes available. Presumably this is so that someone can check that there is actually a check in the envelope. From an insurance settlement a while back, I found out that over $5000 is held for 5 days, then $5000 a day releases until the whole check is clear.

It's been a few years since even the $100 first day limit was an issue, as I usually have more than that lurking in my account.

@flarn2006: And when you're unemployed, every day is like a day off.

@huadpe: In China PULSE is linked to the local interbank system, so you can withdraw at just about any ATM and shop just about anywhere with it if your card uses it (if they don't take it they only take cash; KFC/McDonalds/Burger King do not take cards here as a rule; now if they'd only implement the same rule back home). The only trouble is that barely any retailers do cashback and the smaller ones will even tack on a "processing fee" (and since it's international a dispute doesn't get you too far). Why do I know all this? That's what happens when you try to live here long-term without opening a local bank account (too easy to forget reporting that, don't want to be prosecuted if I do)

@Fuzzy_duffel_bag: One of the best comments on consumerist!

@georgi55: Love it!

Getting serious, though, what the affected customers should do is show up at a board meeting in droves. A credit union's board answers to the members in theory, just like a corporation's board answers to the stockholders.

@Fuzzy_duffel_bag:
I have posted on here many times about how crappy the credit union I joined was. It was so crappy I went back to a traditional bank. It wasn't this particular credit union, but this one operates in my town and is in the same network as the one I had joined.

I wonder if credit unions in AZ just suck in general.

@Klaus_Kinsky: Depending on the credit union they may have no choice but to work the way the commercial banks work. You see ... most credit unions don't have their own item-processing departments. Instead, they hire a big commercial bank to do it, for them. Yes, they have their own routing number and all ... but those checks still go through the Fed transit system to the commercial bank that provides the service to them.

This means the funds are released along the "chain of custody" if you will of the Fed transit system, according to the timeframe of the commercial bank(s) that are handling those checks. The credit union may not be in a position to give you access to the money if they aren't granted access to it by the commerical bank(s) that handled those checks.

Things may be different if the credit union is large enough to have its own item-processing department, or if it's funded well enough that they can afford to float you the money without regard to when it's released to them. But most aren't able to do this. They aren't necessarily "hiding" behind the commercial banks ... rather they're victims of the commercial banks, the same as everyone else.

In any event, while credit unions are at the mercy of the commercial banks that service their accounts, many have the discretion to make exceptions for people. It can't hurt to ask.

@zacox:
Costco only accepts American Express.

My mattress doesn't impose a limit on withdrawls. My mattress doesn't charge me any fees.

@tbax929: Costco is a membership store, so presumably the consumer would be aware of this fact before signing up. If someone has a problem with it they should find another wholesaler.

But but but, I thought debit cards were the magic perfect solution. Who needs travelers checks anymore? I do.

@vastrightwing: [news.sky.com]

oops tbtbtbtbtbtbt :p

Ahhhh, the parade of "I told you so", "I'm smarter than you" and "My way is better than your way" types, predictably chiming in after each monetary tragedy post, and engaging in senseless "you got what you deserve" attacks on others because they used this rather than that way of paying....the main reason consumerist loses readership market share.

The obvious answer is every way of payment and type of institution has it's drawbacks, nothing is failsafe, and the best plan is to have 2 or 3 ways of getting cash at all times (diversify have some of each kind without excess), and to have 1. 2 days of food stocked at home at all times and 2. a few snacks along in your backpack. oh and 3. all id's photographed in a safe place, along with all numbers to call easily accessible.

@Areyouagoodlittleconsumer: oh and maybe a rich uncle or friend handy too :)

@scootinger: becasue if you dont use your pin, its a credit purchase, which is likely then placed on visa to deal with and not the bank.

@wardawg:
You missed my point. The poster said that businesses that don't accept credit cards wouldn't be in business very long. Costco, which seems to do a lot of business in my area, doesn't accept any cards except Amex.

Wow... it's incumbent on the credit union to figure out a way to meet security concerns while allowing customers a reasonably convenient way to access their funds. This solution seems just lazy, not to mention badly timed. What a truly poor decision on the part of this particular credit union.

@Fuzzy_duffel_bag:

lol

But seriously, why don't people just use multiple banks/credit unions so that they can maximize the best features and minimize the worst features..

/I have accounts at BofA, ING, Etrade, Fidelity, and a credit union. I also used to have a mortgage through yet another bank as well (paid off).