With all the big brother things companies already do to potential employees are references even relevant any more?

Two hundred dollars for fake job references?

If you're at the level where that is worth it, I would hope they would do more than call!

But seriously. Just bribe your old boss. Or, you know, your friends. Both cheaper than $200, but sadly the friend is probably just as easily bust-able.

I would think it would be cheaper to do it yourself...oops...said too much.

IIRC, isn't it now pretty much illegal for a company to say something negative about you? Heck, I know you don't even have to tell a new company you were fired because doing so slanders yourself. Too many lawyers my friends, too many lawyers.

So they're not actually pretending to be your real previous employer, they've made up a new company and they're pretending you worked there? Otherwise I don't see how this could be legal.

@GitEmSteveDave_RunsFromBestBuy: It is, but they can answer whether the candidate would be eligible for re-hire.

@GitEmSteveDave_RunsFromBestBuy: I've also heard that a previous employer is not allowed to say anything bad about you. The problem is that if you don't get that job you interviewed for how will you find out that it came down to what your previous employer said? I mean I know you can ask why you didn't get the job, but they could always come up with a fake reason.

@GyroMight: You can have a professional-sounding friend (someone with secretarial experience is perfect) call your references and pretend to be someone interested in hiring you. I always do this.

@GitEmSteveDave_PorchMonkey4Life: Nothing illegal about telling the truth, and in some cases, it may be required. Most companies don't want to give any references as it can be quite subjective...and it's possible to get sued by the former employer. Yet, some companies have been sued when the references they provided didn't disclose the true nature of the person's performance.

Ultimately, it's why companies stonewall about references as an official policy.

@Wombatish: I actually had someone try using friends as stand-ins for references. Unfortunately, they weren't well rehearsed and couldn't answer basic questions about what the person did in the job. Former co-workers are probably better.

@GyroMight: You could always have someone you know and trust contact your previous employer asking for references.

@RandomHookup: Make that "...sued by the former employee."

@GitEmSteveDave_PorchMonkey4Life: Are you sure about that? I think my company has a policy that they only provide references as to the employee's name, dates of employment, job title and department. But I'm pretty sure that that's just a company policy. Why would there be a law about that?

reverse lookup isnt foolproof... ive worked in several call centers and a police department where the primary number you'd give out is listed nowhere... because they dont want anyone not calling for staff related reasons to be calling it. same with supervisors numbers.
and actually, one call center where they directed calls for several companies, and the initial person answering the call would have no idea which one i'd worked for until hr had the folder in front of them.... that would probably sound really suspicious up front, and when reversed, pulls up like 20 companies.

That web site is classy. Pure class right there.

Who wouldn't want Jack Bauer as a reference?

I look like I have fake references on my resume. There are three companies that have gone out of business. Their phone numbers belong to other people now. This is a major part of my resume and I've been out of the workforce with raising kids and self employment for 18 years. I don't think I'll ever be able find a job.

McDonald's and the like may check references but for most career-potential, salaried jobs I seriously doubt they would just make a few calls to old employers. Besides, if you live in at "at will" state you can be fired for anything or nothing as long as it doesn't violate the very few federal laws that exist to protect employees. Even then, there is a myriad of ways for employers to get around the laws and still get rid of you. They are not worried about your "references".

You can't order anything from the website; video links don't work...

It's all a SHAM!

@bohemian: Because they want to know if you're good at your job.

Although with people having been sued for giving bad references, most places are too afraid of liability to give bad ones ... they're just less-enthusiastic in their good ones.

@Ihaveasmartpuppy: You put down some clients who can attest to the quality of your work, and/or some people you've worked with at volunteer events in the community. It's not uncommon for people who have been out of the workforce to have difficulties finding references, and most employers are aware of that. I've referenced for women who were SAHMs who worked with me in my volunteer group; I can attest to their organization and management skills, their communication, their follow through, etc.

Of course, if you sat in a cave for 18 years, you're kinda screwed.

@TCama: Well, it might not be a written law, but it has legal precedent, so it's just like a law, in essence.

@bloggerX: A sham? Wow.

@TinkishDelight: I don't see how it can be legal in either case. It is still fraud.

@bloggerX: he sounds sexy.

@Eyebrows McGee (now with more baby!): Thanks Eyebrows - and no, of course I haven't sat in a cave. Those are some good tips. It's easy to lose your confidence when starting the job search process - especially now.

@TinkishDelight: I don't think it's illegal to falsify your resume. It will just screw you out of a job.

@GitEmSteveDave_PorchMonkey4Life: No, it's not legal precedent, it's not law, it sue-paranoid employers. And it's not slander/defamation if it's true.

On the other hand, some professions should have laws requiring accurate references, like doctors and teachers. A hospital didn't bother to check with the judge listed as a reference for Dr Swango and hired and doctor with a conviction for poisoning co-workers. The judge Swango used as a reference presided over the assualt charge for the poisoning, which tells you how much references get checked even with lives on the line.

@Eyebrows McGee (now with more baby!): Yeah, but the employee-to-be lists his own references. The list is already whitewashed with people who are probably going to be in their favor. References have never been reliable because of that.

@Smashville: I meant for Alibi HQ.

@sleze69: I'd imagine the latter would give you a little more wiggle room, but you're right, I don't know the law but it still seems really suspect.

@GitEmSteveDave_PorchMonkey4Life: That's making a leap that isn't really supported, though. There's nothing illegal about giving a bad reference. Employees have successfully sued when the bad reference is deemed slanderous or retaliatory for legally allowed actions (filing a discrimination claim, in the best-known case). Companies may therefore avoid giving bad references because they don't even want to deal with the possibility of lawsuits, but the giving of the reference itself is perfectly legal if it's true and non-retaliatory.

@savdavid: We're not McDonald's or the like, and we always check references; I'm also regularly called for references, so it's not just us who follows up.

"Say Vandelay Industries... say Vandelay industries!!!"

"...and you want to be my latex salesman."

@GitEmSteveDave_PorchMonkey4Life: It's not illegal at all. The potential exists for a civil lawsuit for defamation if a company provides a false reference for an employee that prevents the person from being hired elsewhere. Many companies therefore have an internal policy of not commenting on a person's ability to do his or her job, and will only confirm the period of employment.

@TinkishDelight: What law do you think is being violated? It may be sleazy but unless AlibiHQ is signing documents under oath and having them notarized they are not going to face charges for perjury.

@floraposte: But virtually any bad reference can be deemed to be "retaliatory" if the person giving the bad reference didn't like the former employee. And it is hard to prove, especially when the prospective employer and the former employer know each other. The former employer may not give a 'bad reference' to a stranger (i.e. the employee's friend who calls up to 'check'), but they would to someone they know. A friend of mine thinks that happened to her. Its not like the employers are going to admit it.

@TinkishDelight: I stand corrected. Apparently it varies but state, but for Maryland...

An employer acting in good faith may not be held liable for disclosing any information about the job performance or the reason for termination of employment of an employee or former employee of the employer (Sec. 5-399.7, as added by Ch. 469, L. 1996):

to a prospective employer of the employee or former employee at the request of the prospective employer, the employee, or former employee; or

if requested or required by a federal, state, or industry regulatory authority or if the information is disclosed in a report, filing, or other document required by law, rule, order, or regulation of the regulatory authority.

An employer who discloses information as described above is presumed to be acting in good faith unless it is shown by clear and convincing evidence that the employer (Sec. 5-399.7, as added by Ch. 469, L. 1996):

acted with actual malice toward the employee or former employee; or

intentionally or recklessly disclosed false information about the employee or former employee

@harvey_birdman: I didn't say anything about perjury, but representing yourself and acting on the behalf of someone you're not is fraud. I'm not sure how it would apply here though and that's why I was asking.

Fun... you can buy anything these days...

This suggests an interesting complimentary service for job seekers... having a professional HR service call up your previous employers and query them about you in order to evaluate what they say about you, both on and "off the record".

I always wondered with so many companies now refusing to give letters of reference and only willing to confirm the basics of your employment with them what individual HR people might say if contacted directly by anther HR person who knows the "HR speak". Will they follow the rules or, as I have heard rumoured over the years, might they have to give more detail, good or bad?

@Jevia: The "retaliatory" in question is retaliating for specifically protected actions, in this case the filling of an EEOC complaint, which is recorded.

TinkishDelight has posted a state law about bad faith recommendations, which are, as you suggest, harder to prove, and I suspect also that doesn't appear in every state. That's more like defamatory stuff, in that it's often complicated to track down what may have been oral communication and prove it sufficiently to take to court.

@Preyfar: You'd be surprised how clueless people can be in failing to ask the listed person if they're willing to serve as a reference. Fortunately, the fact that this is a completely cold call often serves as information to the prospective employer in itself.

@Ihaveasmartpuppy: Hey, don't knock the cave thing until you've tried it!

@TinkishDelight: Some damage needs to occur for there to be fraud.

@floraposte: The job I'm 99.9% hired for is the first one that ever involved a reference check. But it also involves a background check and a driving history check before I can start

@Eyebrows McGee (now with more baby!): Goodness, woman, you talk about teaching, being a lawyer, all your volunteer work, etc. etc. - and now being a mom. I think you must be the best time manager I've ever "known."

@GreatWhiteNorth: I had my friend's mom do exactly this for me!! She works in HR, so I asked her to call one of my old employers, who I had a feeling would not be saying nice things about me. Apparently they are only allowed to give basic information, but they went as far as telling her that I "looked and dressed like a freak with all those damn tattoos and piercings," they were pretty sure I "didn't believe in god," and that they thought I didn't really have migraines, I was just using it as an excuse to miss work. On the plus side (maybe) they also mentioned that I was easy to con into working extra shifts, and I rarely said no when asked.
Needless to say, the three miserable months I spent at that job have since been deleted from my resume!!

@GitEmSteveDave_PorchMonkey4Life: The HR person at my company got a call from a fortune 500 company confirming a prior employee's employment. The caller actually had the nerve to ask for a reference. Our HR person had to inform this moron that what they asked for was illegal to give. What they needed to do is have the employee request a letter of reference.

Illegal or not HR departments at major corporations could care less.

@subtlefrog: and I guarantee you it took a long time for her to get there. Those kinds of skills rarely come easy.

@morlo: Fraud by deception is what I think they are doing. It is kinda like girls who feel they have been raped after sleeping with a guy who falsly said he was a doctor/rockstar or something.