Hey, New Stockholders - What Kind Of Cars Should GM Make Now?
The U.S. and Canadian governments now own a substantial portion of General Motors. If that means that us taxpayers are the real owners. So Consumer Reports Cars wants to know: what do you think GM should make?
My best idea, "hoverbikes," is apparently not a valid option.
What should Government Motors (GM) build? [General Motors Cars]
(Photo: cantoni)
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Comments:
I remember what the comedian George Carlin said years ago. They should make 57 Chevys.
Eh, it doesn't matter. I know that I am subsidizing every GM car with my tax money, but I will never, ever buy a GM vehicle so long as the company still exists. I believe that they already failed as a business, and the insistence of our government to keep them on life support doomed them to an extended period of unprofitabilty at the expense of the US taxpayer. Whatever faults and inabilities they had before will only be compounded by the immense bitterness that people like me feel that they were granted exemption from the rules that govern the rest of us.
I am assuming that is not the message that our shareholder representative, the President, wants to pass along.
Anything fuel-efficient and reliable. Really. But if we're looking for specifics...a mid-size along the lines of a Volvo sedan, a compact sports car, and a sub-compact like the Honda Civic.
Screw cars. I want one of those GM cupcakes.
It should have 2 bubble domes, 3 horns that play La Cucaracha and giant cupholders.
ANYTHING but the absolute POS vehicles they make now. Moreover, EVERYONE in the GM design department in charge of aesthetics got a BIG FAT "F" in design school.
And if they are banking on making money on a "Camaro" with a huge V8, then good luck when gas is $5 a gallon, which seems to be a certainty if "cap & trade" gets passed, which seems a certainty now that that clown Al Franken is a [shudder] senator.
Why isn't VW importing 50+mpg diesels like the Polo? I'd take a normally-aspirated diesel with that kind of mileage any day over, say, even a quality-built Toyota Prius any day.
But Hitler & stalin will be having snowball fights before I buy ANY vehicle from "Government Motors" or Chrysler.
I drove a loaner Chevy Cobalt this week. Not that. What a piece of trash.
I always wanted a full sized pickup with a small Diesel. Something like sub 3 litres with a turbo. Think excellent fuel economy and driveability coupled with just enough grunt to handle most consumer towing/hauling tasks.
Frankly, I'd like to see more diesels available. I own a hybrid and it is not an equivalent replacement for a regular car.
compact sedan
subcompact (I'm thinking along the lines of what Geo did)
DIESEL cars!!!
A small SUV along the lines of the RAV4 for the folks that legitimately need one.
Bring back the compact trucks! S-10 forever!
Make some delorean's for today but nextgen, something cool but affordable in today's economic situation while still good on gas.
They took steps in the right direction by cutting the fat in getting rid of Hummer, Saturn (sorry), etc...
Secondly, for people bashing GM's aesthetics, I have to disagree there. Buick used to always scream "old man car!" and they hired Tiger Woods to try and change that image. it failed miserably.
Now Tiger is gone, and the cars from Buick are looking better and better.
@saya: I loved my dad's S-10 except when I had to cram myself in the extended cab. And I'm under 5 feet tall.
GM should make electric cars again.
We just recently watched the movie "Who Killed the Electric Car?" It is a terrible shame that GM developed the electric car technology, and then proceeded to obliterate those vehicles. The people who had the opportunity to drive those cars in the 1990s fell in love with them.
GM had the technology, and they caved to the interests of the oil companies and parts manufacturers. After seeing this movie, I wished the government hadn't lifted a finger to help them: they deserved to go under!
@Shoelace: something fuel efficient and reliable yes, but add on also something not horribly boring or ugly. If it's reliable enough I'm gonna drive it 10 years, I don't want to hate it from day 1.
Since we own them, they can bring my free car over tomorrow. Just leave it out front, keys in the mailbox. Thanks.
Until they do this, I'm not going to willingly spend one cent on their products.
All of this is an academic question if they don't address the problem that has doomed them since 1959 - The seeming inability to build a small car that people want to buy. I'm talking about a car that doesnt explode , dissolve , burn more oil than gas, gets 30+ MPG and actually holds enough value after a few years to serve as a down payment on your next car. GM has refused to build this type of car and now finds their stock trading for S&H Green Stamps.
I find it incomprehensible that the asshats that have run this company into the ground cannot grasp that they are being asswhipped by companies that make small , fuel efficient cars.When customers drive a Honda or Toyota for 5-6 years and have to do no more than routine maintenence , they are hooked for life. This fact still hasn't registered on GM. They believe that by laying cash on the hood and bribing you to buy their little griefboxes (like the execrable Cobalt or Pontiac G-3), they are doing everything possible to "please the customer". When it falls apart or just plain sucks , their answer is for you to buy the newest griefbox.
A hybrid/turbo diesel mini van, a high mpg turbo diesel on par with the small VW's, a legit work vehicle with either a hybrid or diesel higher mpg SUV or truck for those that actually need it. Oh and put the EV1 into production NOW.
They also need to fire every backward thinking engineer and product manager that thinks the US still wants Camaros and Corvettes.
GM's behavior has annoyed me for years. Having to bail them out and them not really change ticks me off.
They need to target two segments.
Maintain their dominance in the mid-size truck market. Along with Toyota, both Indian and Chinese companies will soon invade the market, and that's going to spell trouble.
Get creative and innovative with their engines. Get some serious mileage while maintaining price and safety standards. They need to gain the edge in innovation, because that is the only way they can manage to slant the playing field in their direction.
I just want a car.
When I looked at the new cars on the market, they are full of ridiculous add-ons that just jack up the price.
GPS (I can find McDonalds all by myself)
Cell Phone/ iPod synch (Don't own either)
Heated seats & Water bottle chillers
Sensors to read your tire's air pressure
Just build a basic car that goes from point A to point B. Include AC and a Heater, and I'll choose the rest I want.
Forget aerodynamics, if you are in a NASCAR race it matters. In my home town there is a STOP sign at every corner (and a couple in alleys), so I am never going go fast enough to worry about air drag.
Let me pick and choose any add-ons I want, but lets start by creating a simple, basic car.
Easy to drive, easy to fix and easy to buy.
What kind of cars should GM make now?
They should make Toyotas. Or Hondas. Or Nissans. (etc.)
The Homer
@K-Bo: Agree, but who decides ugly? I wouldn't trust them with it. They should probably stick with reasonably standard, well-accepted designs.
camry and accord clones
Diesels have been mentioned. I had sworn off GM 20 years ago (they tried to force me to take delivery on a new vehicle I ordered that had been severely damaged & repaired/repainted) & have been a Ford man since. A couple years ago I NEEDED a full size pick up with mega power & endurance & a bit of "economy". Ford had ruined their new diesel trucks (when they got rid of the great 7.3 Powrstroke) so I reluctantly checked out the GM Duramax Diesel, my close friend a Ford diesel mechanic also checked it out. WOW WOW WOW!!! That vehicle rocked, I drove it about 35,000 miles in under a year, always towing a heavy trailer, often in extreme conditions. It got close to 20MPG loaded and was absolutely trouble free. It had 2 minor factory defects: a mis-chromed grille & a little trim piece on the interior that had a broken clip: both repaired without question. I no longer have it: damn WV flooding (it amazingly still ran OK after being flooded over the dash level). If they can make a similar diesel for smaller vehicles I would consider it. That Duramax is bullet-proof. It even survived & ran fine for 100 miles on straight unleaded fuel, a real no no with diesels that usually shut them right down (my diesel mechanic friend's wife borrowed it & accidently filled it with regular gas, fuckin' BP used their trademark green on the regular handles (normally diesel handles are the only green by most standards)). I hope that they can pull it off. My current small car advice for any car shoppers: the Ford Focus with top quality, comfort, & performance for relatively cheap.
@andrewe:
The current generation full-size pickups (from all brands) are so bloated that a 3-litre turbo diesel wouldn't be enough to propel them. Notice how you used to be able to comfortably reach over the bed rails in a 1/2 ton full-size truck, but you can't on the current models? They are truly pigs.
@Michael Ortega: You must not have heard that DeLorean still manufactures their DMC12 with updated interiors.
@Michael Ortega:
The DeLorean was an unmitigated disaster, I doubt they'd try that again.
I think its use in Back To The Future was the only success that car saw. The people behind it had their careers ruined, though getting caught embezzling didn't help either.
@wvFrugan:
I said "I hope that they can pull it off."
I should have said "I hope that WE can pull it off."
GOD HELP US!
@dhmosquito: Polo imports: Because diesels are notoriously hard to meet all 50 states emission standards, which is now the law of the land. They took forever to get the new Jettas out, because they needed to meet the emission standards, and Federal Law says they have to warranty them for 90k miles for emission issues.....
My brother, in the late 80's, once received a speeding ticket for traveling 86 mph in a 55 mph zone in my mother's 1982 Buick Skyhawk. My father to the traffic court judge: "Your honor, that car could not travel 86 mph if you dropped it from the sky..." lol.
We could just dump 90% of there current US offerings and start bringing over there cars from the Vauxhall and Holden. Have any of you guys here seen some of there cars they are offering there? Proper RWD sedans, inexpensive hot hatch backs that look funky and have a soul most US market cars lack. From Vauxhall we could us there Corsa(Especially the VXR hoon car), the Astra(again with the VXR option). From Holden we could do very well with the Commodore, Sportswagon, Statesman and the Ute. That and there full range of petrols and diesels too.
@NKP:
Links to the nice toys they get there first up is Vauxhall.
And the here is what Holden has to offer.
Yeah, sucks for america when we get second rate cars.
@saya: Yeah, what the hell were they thinking when they designed the Colorado? The S-10 was a nice looking truck. The Colorado fell out of the ugly tree and hit every branch on the way down.
I'd like them to make nothing. Cease to exist. I will never buy a car from them no matter how cheap or how much the quality increases because they took the money. The only American manufacturer I believe should continue to exist is Ford, because instead of taking taxpayer money they seem to be genuinely trying to increase quality.
I was just reading today about a single person vehicle, ideal for solo commuting, that would run almost entirely on electricity. It's a plug-in model but also has a diesel engine, IIRC.
For this to happen though, a lot of things need to change and, at the same time, more and less money needs to change hands. Less from the oil companies buying out technologies that move us off of oil and more from investors wanting to see change in the automotive world.
Secondly, research diesel efficiency to make the most out of both the money we spend on fuel and also the fuels we have available. I hear of cars that get 40-50 MPG on diesel easily. I did see that someone posted how there are strict regulations from all 50 states on diesel vehicles so that's a heck of a deterrent. Unfortunately, until that's overcome, it doesn't seem to be the case that diesel vehicles would become more common.
Going back to the single person vehicle idea, I would absolutely love something like that. I don't know how many people commute solo like I do, but I'm sure it's a lot. In my case, most of the car is empty space and while it's nice to have that space there, I don't need it 95+% of the time. A small vehicle with a limited size trunk, if any, would be on my to-buy list as soon as I can get a loan for it.
None. Don't prolong your death by making crappy vehicles that people regret buying. See: British Leyland.
@ShruggingGalt: Thanks; I was unaware of what you say. And yet GM produces Hummer H2s that get incredibly atrocious mileage. One would think that if this administration is truly serious about emissions and "anthropogenic global warming" [sic], they would "crack the whip" with their congressional majorities and permit high mileage vehicles to be introduced from overseas; Oh, wait, I forgot; the democrats think they owe the UAW some kind of debt so it's unlikely we'll ever see any of those efficient vehicles imported. What we need are fewer laws--especially regarding automobiles (but you know that, judging from your handle). cheers
@krispykrink: But when they do this, what chance do they have of getting pennies out of you... I say they deliver a car in your drive, sans wheels, then ask for a few bucks for some round shaped rubber bits to drive on.
You can thank the whiny tree-huggers in NY and CA for why we don't have more diesels here. All those that like to bitch about the soot my TDI puts out, I like to offer them a challenge: You park your gasser in your garage, I'll park my diesel in mine - then close the doors with them running and we'll see who has bragging rights then.
If we're going to pollute to get around, I'd rather do it at 600 miles to a fill up...
Keep the Corvette and the Silverado. Ditch anything larger than the Tahoe (which is too big itself, but they've got to have something in that market). Bring back something Corvair-sized, rear or front engined with an adequate suspension. Offer diesel options and hybrid options. Whatever they decide to make, quality at the level of Honda and Toyota will be essential to their survival. If the consumer continues to believe that a GM car is just a bucket of bolts, the government's (your tax dollars at work) investment will go right down the tubes.
@bohemian:
I think you misunderstand the traditional engineering mind. Engineers aren't the ones that think backwards, it's the bean-counters that cost-reduce long before the component is ramped to production...
Product managers, well sadly that has gone to committee - example of a committee designed vehicle: Current generation Chrysler Sebring.
"Bring back the compact trucks! S-10 forever! "
Abso-freakin'-lutely bring back the dime! I recently sold my '97 Chevy S-10 and it has become one of the biggest mistakes I ever made. The only reason I got rid of it was because it was a 4x2 which did horrible in the Pennsylvania winters, otherwise I would have held on to it. When I sold it, it had roughly 215k on the original motor and a rebuilt trans, and it still ran strong (even after going through four owners, hitting several deer, and crashing into a tree) and got pretty decent mileage (on the 2.2l 4cyl motor). A solid truck all around, and it was extremely simple to maintain.
If GM would resurrect the S-10 I would trade-in my Durango pronto.
Compact trucks like Nissan Hardbody. Good mileage and useful to boot.