I don't think the government has the Constitutional authority to regulate the price in private transactions, especially on non-necessary items like concert and sports tickets.

Decency? Really?

I'm all for hyperbole but that's pretty douchey even for my standards.

The first thing I thought of when I saw this article was Stubhub. I don't live in New York, but I thought it might start a precedent for other states to follow regarding this online scalper's paradise. Oh well.

@henwy:

Only thing missing is something tacked on about why won't they think of the children.

@Ben Miner:

Agreed.

It sounds like the politicians have given New Yorkers their circus. Now they just need to scare up some bread.

@Ben Miner: Not directly, but they do have the authority to impose a 100% tax on gains in excess of X% over face. That's just an exercise of the taxing authority. Of course enforcing it would be a royal pain and probably not worth it except in large cases, like TicketMaster.

@Ben Miner: Apparently, it does.

Market forces should be the only regulatory force at work here. No one needs to go to a fleetwood mac concert....so why does government have to regulate the tickets to said crapfest?

First sentence should say legal and not illegal. :)

Other than that, GOOD JOB NY! NY always has the best laws.

Quick! Someone get a TicketMaster headliner in NY to declare AFFORDABLE the price of their tickets so we can arrest the NY TicketMaster brokers!

What many here are missing is that most of these stadiums and concert venues are built with a large and I mean large dose of tax dollars. It could be in a bond, or a tax free status or even city and county tax funds to build and then operate the stadium.
So you are already paying for this place.The ticket prices were agreed on before hand in the approval process that these people used to access the tax dollars.

There are also revenue dollars for these places that come out of hotel funds, rental car rates and several other sources.

So it is not like a free market where you haven't made a contribution but a subsidized ticket where most residents are already paying a portion of the fare.

Having recently purchased from stubhub for commissioner's box/2nd row seating for $20 a ticket over face value (TX Rangers), I have to wonder what the problem is, exactly? I purchased tix from a seller who obvs. had season tix, we were both presumably happy with the service & price, and we had the opportunity to enjoy seats we normally wouldn't be able to get because they are always bought by season ticket holders.

I've purchased similar tix in the past, and just don't see how it's "indecent" or that we got screwed, at all.

If the scalpers set the price too high they cannot sell their tickets. Its pure economics. Prices should reduce until they meet the 'wealthiest' buyer. The government is only created huge deadweight loss by requiring that there be a large consumer surplus. I am sure someone out there is willing to buy a ticket to event 'X' for ten more dollars. This person 'deserves' the ticket more than the person who is only willing to pay the sale price.

When government becomes the meddlers, out go the peddlers.

If you are smart, you would sell the tickets at the listed value and to gain some extra money, sell limited edition stick figure drawing that you've created with the tickets.

@labeled: When StubHub sells 15$ tickets for 110$.. Then it's indecent.

@henwy: Eh, I think it's perfect. I considered getting a ticket on StubHub for a concert at a hole-in-the-wall club that I really wanted to see that was sold out.. Tickets were originally 15$ and StubHub had them for 110$.

I am not that up on understanding how face value is created? Some times that is the problem I see. Face value is way too high.

@Ben Miner:
The US Constitution probably wouldn't let the Feds do this, but the states, assuming the state constitution doesn't prohibit it, are free to regulate this. They shouldn't, but they can; and many do.

Uhh, IIRC, hasn't there been laws regarding scalping tickets on the books for YEARS? I mean, why are people whining about constitutionality and government regulation now?

@Jessica Haas:

It's not indecent, it means that the original ticket seller has priced their tickets too low, assuming that said ticket will actually end up selling for $110.

@LegoMan322: Not always.

The face value of tickets is sometimes really awesome, however once you add convenience charges and BS fees, a 20$ ticket becomes a 45$ ticket.

I understand and agree with the free market argument in general. What gets me with the scalpers is the sleazy way they go about getting the tickets. Don't they normally break some rules just in the way the buy them? If it was just Joe Schmoe deciding he couldn't make the game, that would be one thing.

Legomann, if face value is too high, then how do the scalpers get to charge even more? It looks like sometimes it is not to high, at least for SOME people. Mostly all tickets prices for me are priced too high, but I guess they are doing fine without me.

@TCama: Because the government does something then that must in all cases mean the Constitution says it's ok? Federal and state courts have declared laws to be Unconstitutional countless times. You just need a lot of money and time to challenge.

@Powerlurker: I don't quite understand what you're getting at -- The original seller priced their tickets too low so they decide to sell it at more than 4 times the original price?

@Jessica Haas: That is the thing. $20 tickets are well out of my sight from what is going on. I like to see what they (band/singer/etc) are doing.

To be closer to the action usually skyrockets in price. I understand more, but where they are putting the prices.

@LegoMan322: Well, you're probably going to arena concerts. A lot of non-arena concert tickets are like 20$ for general admission. I recently went to a concert at a hockey rink, everything was GA and it was 30$ (before fees, etc.)

@Jessica Haas: I think that would be internet. Finally some kind of voice that has the most power of the people.

Blogs, journals, and I think hacking show bigger people who can play with them even if they are much smaller.

Customer service over the phone could not careless since there is very little consequence.

@Oregon: Then give the local taxpayers vouchers worth a certain amount to the events at the venue.

@Ben Miner: There are no constitutional limitations (either Federal or State) on scalping that I'm aware of, so it falls under the State's health, safety, welfare and morality jurisdiction. Many states do have and enforce scalping restrictions and I'm not aware of a successful challenge to those laws. So yes, the practice appears to be Constitutional.

Good luck enforcing this.

@Oregon: That sums up the stadium crowd pretty well . That's what irks me the most is that these owners having been getting bailed out for years with their own version of too big to fail ie we'll leave town if YOU don't subsidize OUR business .

Actually on something like entertainment tickets in particular if you are willing to pay 1000 for 100 dollar ticket so be it . Alot of the scalpees can afford it(business) or have priorities so far out of whack they deserve what they get .

The only thing I don't like about the professional scalpers is that they shorten the supply of tickets which artificially increases price . The teams and artists see ' the demand ' and continue to price tickets out of reach for the average joe .

Too me it's the sports teams and artist that are taking their audiences for granted and pricing themselves into extinction . Look at what the Yankees are going through in their new stadium . They are the ones in the end that should either tour or play more or lower their prices as to ensure they build a new generation of fans .

So scalpers will just be in New Jersey or Connecticut and charge a further fee for it.

@jsbeagle:
but that was the concept in the price structure when the stadium was approved. Most of the attendees are from within 30 miles of the area. So tickets prices set and sold by the venue account for this.
This is when the government gets involved as they already have an agreed on price that allows many people, not just the riches few to enjoy what is built with everyone's monies.

@Ben Miner: The courts have long been willing to allow governmental regulation of commercial transactions as constitutional (Article I Section 8, giving Congress the power to regulate interstate commerce). The Commerce Clause as it is understood today (including what is known as the Dormant Commerce Clause) has been understood to allow Congress (and in the absence of Congressional intent, the States) to regulate goods not just in interstate commerce, but such goods as have a substantial economic impact (read: almost any goods/services that move in commerce; after all, money is quintessentially economic).

We already have a law like this in Alberta, and it DOES NOTHING to deter scalping.

All the scalpers do is throw in some worthless extra and say "Any value or the price of the ticket goes towards this CD/Baseball Card/Magazine/Hat" or "This CD also comes with a bonus *TICKET TO BIG SOLD OUT EVENT*"

Until the police start arresting people for this behavior it will continue.

@Ben Miner: Right. The Constitution bars states from passing laws "impairing the Obligation of Contracts".

It is illegal.

[www.archives.gov]

@TCama: Apparently, it THINKS it does.

@MooseOfReason:

Heh, that doesn't mean they can't place limits on the kinds of contracts that can be created. You can't just write a contract that says anything and if somebody signs it, they're bound. Some contracts are simply illegal.

The fact of the matter is, we often assume, sight unseen, that the constitution is this beacon of fairness, and if the government ever does anything unfair, it MUST be unconsitutional.

Well, sadly, no. That is not the case. I'm sure it's CONSTITUTIONAL for the government of New York to prevent scalping like this.

Is the government overstepping its bounds? Fuck yes, in my humble opinion. Scalping is a nasty business, and I'd like to see the government do something to counteract it. But does a good government tell its tax-paying citizens how much they can sell hot commodities for? Not in my opinion. It's heavy-handed, oversimplified, and they are on a slippery slope.

The biggest scalper of all (ticketmaster) won't bee too happy about this.

I think part of the reason for some the excessive pricing on sports tickets in particular is that a lot of these teams make a season ticket holder sign a contract for so many years . I know season ticket holders who had to sign a 10 year contract for their seat and barring a bankruptcy they can't get out of that contract .

What that does is put tickets in the hands of scalpers once those season ticket holders loose interest or can't go to the games . Again this is artificially creating a demand because these venues aren't sold out by choice but by contract . Too pay off the extortionist-oops ment team owners the undesired tickets are now on the open market .

Point being it really isn't the scalpers as it is the teams,artists and venue owners . The scalpers are simply capitalizing on market conditons how ever contrived they may be .

I'd have to imagine that the performer/venue gets some of the ticket sales revenue say 50%, so it would be in ticketmaster's interest to sell it to it's "friend" for 1$, give the band 50 cents, then when it's friend sells them for 110$ they don't need to go giving away 55 bucks to some people just because they did all the work.
Just a guess, but I bet that's what's going on.

@komodork: That's how they do it where I live. There's some law where it's illegal to auction tickets or something, so everyone sells some cracker jack box ring and the tickets are "free gifts" that go with it.

So New York has forgotten the purpose of scalping laws. It's not to control the price.

@Cocoa Vanilla: I love it when people attempt to correct others, when they are wrong themselves...

@LordofBacon: The government isn't regulating the tickets to the concerts, they're regulating the predatory (and in Ticketmaster's case, anti-trust worthy) business practices surrounding those tickets. The government rounds out all sorts of rough edges in the economy.

@Jessica Haas: Its called economics... read up.

@Jessica Haas:

If the market clearing price of the ticket is $110 then the original vendor of the ticket should simply sell it for $110 right at the outset instead of letting some arbitrageur pocket the extra $95.

@greenunicorns:

But does a good government tell its tax-paying citizens how much they can sell hot commodities for?

Therein lies the rub...most scalpers pay taxes only on the face value of the ticket, not on the"new improved" price.