Verizon Loses The Broken Phone You Returned, Suspends Your Service
Luis dropped his busted LG EnV in the mail at the end of last year and tracked its progress as FedEx delivered the package to Verizon. Verizon, apparently unfamiliar with tracking numbers, doesn't believe that Luis ever returned the phone, and insists that they're owed a $320 replacement fee. Luis disputed the charge, but rather than investigate his claim, Verizon decided it would be easier to suspend his service. Now they want Luis—a customer of seven years who pays over $350 across six phone lines each month—to pay another $15 to reconnect the service they should never have disconnected in the first place. He writes:
Last year around August 2008 my cellphone was not charging so I called Verizon to get a replacement. I received my replacement a few days later. I went to a Verizon store to move my contacts to my new phone but was told that they couldn't do it because a piece inside the cellphone was damaged. So I left the Verizon store and moved my contacts manually. That same day I went to Fedex to drop off the old cellphone.
Then came my December bill and I get a charge of $320 because they say i didn't mail back the damaged cellphone. The cellphone is a LG EnV. As soon as I saw the bill I called Verizon. They asked me if I kept the receipt with the Fedex tracking number, which I had, because they needed to look it up. I am told that the tracking number is invalid. Then I was told not to worry cause sometimes its in the warehouse but has not yet been scanned and put in the system. They tell me they will send a report to the warehouse so they could look for the phone. They said not to worry and just to pay my normal bill without the $320 charge. 2 weeks go by and I call again.
They have not found the phone and the customer service rep tells me that i need to pay those $320. I tell her that i am not going to pay for something i didn't have. I also tell her why would I want a busted phone for when i could easily get a brand new one for less than the $320 I am being charged. She says the only thing she can do is make a report and send it to the warehouse. I tell her that the previous rep had done it already. She tells me she needs to do it again and I ask her if i can speak to a supervisor. She said I couldn't because first she had to get a response from the warehouse. I tell her to do it and she says it will take 1 week to get a response. I call again and get the same exact responses i did from the previous 2 reps.
Then January my line gets cut. They say I have to pay the $320 and I have to pay a fee for getting my phones reconnected at $15 per phone. I have 5 phones in a family plan. I tell them the same thing that I do not have the cellphone, that I sent it out. They tell me to at least to pay the regular bill and they would reconnect my phones without charging me the $15 per phone. They also tell me the same thing the previous 3 reps tell me and till now I have not been able to speak to a supervisor.
They now just cut my line again, called Verizon again, I still have that charge on my account and each time the reps tell me the same thing. I have been a Verizon customer for 7 years and have changed my phone many times and have not had this problem. I have 6 phones total with them and my phone bill is anywhere from $350 to $450 a month. I called last week again and i got the same BS from the reps. Maybe you guys can help me out and point me in the right direction.
Fire off an Executive Email Carpet Bomb to Verizon's head office and explain that the $320 charge is significantly more than the $200 early termination fee you would consider paying if they can't appreciate you as a loyal customer with a tracking number.
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Comments:
i had the same problem with AT&T. bought a pantech matrix in 11/08 for $50. in 2/09 the slider broke off. i brought it to a store and they said it was recalled. after a long, annoying, and boring quest to get a new phone, i had one sent out to me, and i was to return the broke one in the replacement's box. i did so that day. after the 2 weeks time i had to return it, i started getting 5 e-mails, 2 calls to my cell, and 2 calls to my home per day for almost a week saying i'm late on returning the phone. i provided the USPS tracking number each time and was told by every rep "oh yes it looks like it arrived to the warehouse, but hasn't been scanned into the system. i'll make a note in your account and you shouldn't get anymore calls, and the $200 charge will be removed." yeah, BS. it took NO LIE, 20+ calls over a 6 day period to set it straight.
and i won't even get into the issue how the replacement they sent me smelled like smoke, was covered in a white chalky dust (cigarette ash?), and had greasy finger prints.
where are these cell phone warehouses, and why can't they scan the packages upon arrival?
$320 is far cheaper than paying an ETF of $175 x 6 lines.
Actually, if he ends up cancelling his whole account, it's $200 early termination fee per line. That's $1200 in early termination fees for 6 lines of service, so, the $320 is the cheaper of options.
However, I think Verizon is in the wrong on this. They need to fix this. And EECB needs to be sent.
In the meantime, send a copy of your complaint with documentation, paper trail and chronology to your state's Attorney General's office, Consumer Division.
About the fedex tracking number? Above, it said that Luis had the tracking number. But later, we are told the tracking number is invalid.
My advise would be to send back that replacement (probably a refurbished model) AND keep your tracking info at your own expense. Got to ebay and buy some cheap phone to get you through to the end of your contract. At the end of your contract, leave.
So you want him to pay the ETF, plus take a hit on his credit for the cost of the phone? If he's going to do that, why pay them anything?
Do NOT pay an early termination fee. Instead, charge THEM a $200 early termination fee (send it as a certified letter to their accounts payable department). It is THEY who terminated the account early due to their own mistake. Check your credit report. If anything shows on it from them, dispute it. If they confirm, sue them. If they claim arbitration, argue that arbitration no longer applies because they terminated the contract (you are only suing for false reporting after the contract, not the $200 termination fee they should pay you).
A+ on the reading comprehension. I got that too. If the tracking number is invalid, then either Luis screwed up or Fedex did. The number should not ring up as invalid. It should show it was delivered to Verizon.
Verizon's ETF's are $175 per line minus $5 for every month under contract. He would not be paying $200 per line.
@sven.kirk: Maybe the tracking numbers fall off the Fedex system after a period of time following delivery. Maybe they looked it up from Fedex online (or by a private access to the database) and it had been expunged as old.
How many people have regularly checked to see if tracking numbers are still in the system long after the transaction they are part of is concluded to everyone's satisfaction?
@Skaperen: I was going to say the same thing. He mailed it in August; they didn't try checking the # until December. Although, to test, I just tracked something shipped to me via UPS before Christmas and the status still shows up on their website. You'd think FedEx would have the information around at least as long as UPS does.
@Skaperen:
I was curious enough to actually call fedex to see if that was in fact the case but it turns out they're closed on sunday's. The FAQs online seem to indicate you don't even need a tracking number to track the package. The information is linked to the reference number/billing/account. Any of those should bring up the info according to them.
I used to work at a Mail Boxes Etc. FDX keeps tracking numbers alive for 90 days. However, I still think that Verizon did not even bother to check the number.
Great Job, V. Way to follow your policy into the sewer.
@sven.kirk:
Not a bad idea. I did that for my girl when she broke hers and it was going to cost $200 for a replacement due to her being 1 yr into a 2 yr contract. $35 on ebay. If you need a cheap phone for verizon, I have one that I'll sell on the cheap. Just let me know.
All of this account mumbo jumbo is immaterial. You have a tracking number from FedEx. Is it valid? Check with FedEx...it doesn't matter what Verizon says about the number.
Then, either FedEx gave you a bum number or the phone disappeared in Verizon's receiving department. If the former, the issue is with FedEx. If the latter, produce the signature of the person who received it and send it to Verizon.
If it is indeed an issue with FedEx, hopefully you haven't waited too long to address it for Verizon to reverse what they've done to your account.
Regardless, the tracking number is the first place you start. Best of luck.
This crap is pretty typical. Verizon Wireless threatened to cut off my father's cell phone for non-payment even though he'd sent them a check just like usual. Two different CSRs gave him extensions of several days. The third time he called up, they said it must have been lost. He told them he didn't want a check out there floating around that might be fraudulently cashed. He didn't want to pay with credit card. So they told him, cancel the first, send another, and then they would credit him for the check cancel fee, and give him another extension on the bill. So he sends the second one, and it takes them 3 weeks to process it. He keeps getting "we're going to shut you off" messages on his cell phone. Then they finally process check #2, credit his account, and that goes away. Then they find check #1, cash it, and on his next bill it says he owes nothing. Then after he gets his bill, they figure out check #1 has been canceled, and then they tell him his service is going to be shut off again. It was a nightmare.
I want to know where the tracking number is, and why you sent it in, when you could have taken it to the Verizon store ( I am assuming the store could handle this like other carriers do).
If the tracking number you gave is invalid then you need to check with FEDEX. The number is around for a long time, and you cna look it up online. You could easily say, the package was delivered on such and such a date at such a time, and signed for by this person. Immediately remove this charge from my account. If you choose not to, I will consider it your agreement to terminate my contract, and I will owe you no ETF.
@henwy: Was it invalid in FedEx's system, or Verizons? He should check it himself on the FedEx website.... I would bet it shows up as valid and delivered on FedEx's end.
@Randa the Panda:
This is why I hate being under contract. Haven't been under contract for 3 years and it's great. They're always trying to do anything for us because they know we can just walk away. And they're always trying to get us back under contract, of course!
@chris_d: Not to mention the arbitration clause survives contract termination. Read the details, it's in there.
@Wombatish: When I worked as a Sprint billing rep I ran into this scenario a lot. How it worked was when the damaged phone was received to our warehouse, it would be logged and our system would auto apply a credit to your account.
This credit WAS NOT to be applied manually under ANY CIRCUMSTANCES. The logic being that if we credit you $200 now, the warehouse will credit $200 later and you'll end up with 200 extra dollars you weren't supposed to be credited with.
Even if you had a verifiable tracking number that showed your phone had been delivered to our warehouse we still could not issue any credit. I heard customers arguing with Supervisors endlessly about the stupidity of this system, but all the Sups did was quote policy until the customer hung up.
Interestingly enough, I don't recall ever seeing an account suspended due to non return of a phone, except in cases were the $200 that was not yet credited had put the account past due or over its spending limit.
Consumerist says: "Luis dropped his busted LG EnV in the mail at the end of last year and tracked its progress as FedEx delivered the package to Verizon."
Luis says: "They asked me if I kept the receipt with the Fedex tracking number, which I had, because they needed to look it up. I am told that the tracking number is invalid."
So which is it?
I think it depends on WHO told him his tracking number is invalid.
If FedEx says its valid, and Verizon doesn't, obviously, the problem's Verizon.
If FedEx says the number is invalid, he needs to get on the phone with FedEx customer service to find out WHY it's invalid (perhaps the number expired?) and try to get records from them proving that at one point it was valid, and what the end result of that particular package was (was it recieved, rejected, etc?). Once he has a copy of that (assuming FedEx can provide it), he needs to make a copy to show to Verizon (and keep the originals for himself).
Regardless of where the phone is or who has it, I suspect this will need some big guns to be resolved, though, like an EECB or even litigation.
@chris_d:
People who insist on mailing checks out really should make sure they mail it out in sufficient time to reach the company by the due date, thereby avoiding collection calls, extensions, and possible interruption of service due to non-payment
Something like this happened a few years ago when Verizon failed to admit to having recieved two phones I sent them, even though I had signatures on a UPS reciept.
I had three separate conversations where I explained that they had my phones, and I didn't actually owe hundreds of dollars. The first two times the customer service type reversed the charges, and a few days later the charges mysteriously reappeared on my account.
The third time, the rep wouldn't do anything and the supervisor wouldn't either, so I politely told her that if the situation wasn't resolved during that phone call, my next call would be to the BBB and the call after that would be to my lawyer. I then asked her to repeat her name for my records.
I will grant you, it was a bluff, and a cheap one at that, but within seconds somebody actually went to look for the phones and apparently found them while I was still on the line. I never had problems with VZW after that, but I also switched to another carrier as soon as my contract was up.
@Skaperen: Sounds like the contract wasn't actually terminated by verizon...only suspended for non payment. This isn't a violation of t&c's.
@Cyberxion101: Why write checks anymore? They are not free in most cases. verizon accepts electronic checks over the phone. #PMT
@invisiblenemies:
I think he's afraid their system will save his information and then screw up and withdraw more money than he owes from his bank account. It's not unheard of.
@twophrasebark: It could be that so much time has elapsed since the phone arrived at Verizon that the tracking number has become invalid/deactivated.
@sven.kirk: I used to work for FedEx C/S. FedEx tracking numbers are accessible for up to 6 months from time of shipment. Usually the tracking numbers get reused after a period of inactivity. The OP can contact FedEx and have them send him the tracking history on the now defunct tracking number but they must asked to speak to "Escalations" if they want to get anywhere.
Who said Verizon is #1 in customer service? Looks no better than Sprint but Sprint gets all the bad reputation.
Ok friends, I work for VerizonWireless and I deal with this type of stuff every day. This story is strange to me because at no time in the narrative does the customer ever say that he went to the FedEx website to pull up the tracking number. The first thing I would have done when if I was told that the tracking number was invalid would be to pull up the FedEx website and put in the number myself, who knows maybe I had told it to the customer service rep incorrectly. If the customer has kept the FedEx receipt then the tracking number is on it. I am sorry, but we (vzw employees) can only go by what the customer tells us when it comes to tracking numbers, and if they tell us a tracking number that is invalid or have copied the number down incorrectly there is really nothing we can do. It can sometimes take up to 3 months to receive the phone back into inventory at the warehouse due to the volume. That is why we tell every caller in this situation to write down the tracking number and make sure that they have it correct and to keep the FedEx receipt. We are graded on random calls and this is one of the items we are graded on. I have to put it to you plainly people; it is not the responsibility of VerizonWireless to make sure that the phone gets returned to them. It also sounds strange that the customer doesn’t say that he spoke with the financial services department about the past due balance and equipment charge. That department will gladly put the disputed amount aside and charge only the monthly amount until the matter is resolved. We do get people that will say that their phone is “not working” so that they can get a replacement and sell the replacement on eBay. Believe it or not we get that a lot. Lastly about speaking to a supervisor, if you ask we will try to get a supervisor but they are not always available. They are required to follow up with requests by customer to speak with them most of the time within 4 hours. Granted some supervisors will not follow through but just like all customer call centers if you complain enough during a call you can get a supervisor. You might be on hold a while waiting for them to come but you will get them. I don’t really think that he ever asked to speak to a supervisor. If he had there would have been another paragraph detailing the stress and heartache of actually getting to speak to one, just like every other call center story. It just sounds to me like the customer is just not caring enough and would just like to complain. In these days of entitlement we feel that we don’t have to do anything and that everything should be just handed to us. We (customer service reps) do all we can but we need the customers help too.
@dragonfire81: Ugh, Sprint did this to me a few years ago. Their "warehouse" never logged some merchandise I returned in November. Of course, Sprint never notifies me that their records show they didn't get the phones (that UPS had a signature for). Come February or March in the afternoon while I'm busy at work I start getting calls from Jamaica threatening to turn off my phone service "tomorrow" if I didn't pony up $2,000.00 that they were not due. These "bill collectors" have no latitude at all to correct a problem of Sprint's doing, and will only badger you until you tell them to die. Conveniently, once Jamaica has your account, Sprint's crack CSRs can't even help you even if they tried. So if it weren't for about 9 hours of dealing with all sorts of Sprint departments that day into the night, my 5-phone family plan would have met the fate of this Verizon OP. I found a supervisor willing to risk his job and put a temporary credit of $2k into my account until the wingnuts could fix it. After hearing the story here with Verizon, I feel a little less bad for sticking with Sprint since so many people talk about how Verizon's sh*t smells like roses....
@chris_d: They can do that with a physical check too - same information. Credit cards have dispute privileges, by the time a clusterf*ck company messes up your checking account you're waist deep in the big muddy.
I had the same problem when virizon bought out rancell, over charges, charges for options i didnt even have in my contract. BS from reps that are useless. Your best bet is to try and get to the end of your contract and get away from Verizon altogether. Good luck. Try Sprint, I have been with them for almost 2 years now and have had no problems at all.
Verizon pulled something similar with me. I returned a phone within the free trial period (to a store, back when they accepted returns). The following month, I was billed for the early termination fee PLUS the phone. Called their cust. service and was told I never returned the phone. I told them I have the receipt from the store crediting my card for the cost of the phone and which store took the return. They couldn't argue and had to eliminate the charges.
Don't give in to their incompetence if you have paperwork to back you up like receipts and tracking numbers.
@chris_d: This is the big flaw of our electronic financial systems. Anyone can just claim the money and take it.
@PGibbons: That's why we need an all new system in which every payment is done via a cryptographically signed unique transaction code that cannot be rerun (date, time, nanosecond it was produced is encoded in the code), or even have its amount modified (the amount is encoded in the code). As many times as the same transaction code might be attempted to be processed, it can only be debited once, and can only be paid once. The current system allows amounts to be modified, transactions repeated, and anyone with access to the banking system can fabricate them if they have your identifying information.
They're just trying to get money from you. If you pay them every time you talk to them, then you're not really getting anywhere, and they're making money.
@gaywolverine: Not every town has a Verizon store. He probably gave them the number over the same phone call when they asked him if he had the tracking number.
I just checked a FEDEX tracking number I used 9 months ago. It was in fact still in their database. So it appears they keep tracking numbers at least that long.
Do fire off an EECB. I had an issue with Verizon that cost a similar amount as what you're describing here. Dozens of phone calls to Verizon went nowhere and the reps even refused to take down FedEx tracking numbers to prove my point. I was told that "tracking numbers don't mean nothin'(sic)" by more than one person.
After the EECB, a representative with the executive office had the appropriate regional manager contact me and was incredibly helpful in sorting this out.
Their phone customer support is helpless in these situations and you need somebody with discretion and pull.
In the end I was very pleased with how things ended up.