Continental: No Refunds For Swine Flu Cancellations
The swine flu outbreak is making thing tough for people who had booked Mexican vacations. Reader Kurt is one such person. He got a full refund from the hotel, but is dismayed that Continental won't extend him the same courtesy.
Kurt says:
I just got off the phone with Continental Airlines customer service because I had to reluctantly cancel my vacation to Cozumel, Mexico at the last minute because of this Pig Fever "epidemic" going on. It's not that I'm afraid of catching what's just basically the flu, but I'm more afraid of the hysteria surrounding it and what the US may do (stopping flights resulting in my becoming stranded, etc.) as a result of people feeling kind of icky.So, I called Wyndham to cancel my hotel and they were great. No problems there at all. They offered a full refund even though my date of stay begins Monday May 4.
Next I called Continental Airlines where I spoke with Charlotte. She informed me that she would be more than happy to give me credit good for the same amount, valid through January 31, 2010 (a year after I bought the original tickets). But, I explained to Charlotte, I won't be going anywhere else in this timeframe, so I would like my $1051.38 credited back to my card please. She told me that this would be IMPOSSIBLE.
See, I apparently purchased a non-refundable ticket with the package deal I had received via Wyndham. I understand what non-refundable means, but when the CDC advises you not to fly to Mexico, no matter how Un-goddamn-refundable a ticket is, you'd think that the impossible would become the possible and they'd give me back my money.
Alas, this was not the case. Even when I posed an admittedly, in retrospect, borderline-terrorist threat of, "Well, what if, for some reason, Continental planes all started crashing and I feared for my life to use the airline, would I get a refund then?" Charlotte went back to the well and replied, "No, sir, you would be issued credit for Continental Airlines good for one year after the date of original purchase." That's comforting.
She indicated to me that she had been denying refunds all day to people because this was their policy. I'm not the only one in this situation.
Well, Kurt, we're afraid we don't have good news for you. This swine flu thing is out of their control, so allowing passengers to rebook or take credits is probably all the airlines are going to be able to do for you unless you have a refundable ticket. But look at it this way — at least you didn't book a cruise to Mexico.
Over at Elliott.org cruise passengers are being told that instead of going to Mexico — they're going to California. No refunds, no rebooking, no nothing, unless they bought the cruise line's insurance package. After a fair amount of outrage one cruise line decided to offer a 50% discount on the next cruise as compensation, but only if the your cruise was entirely to Mexico. Skipping just one Mexican port? Too bad. Enjoy your day at sea.
So it could be worse.
Have any of you seasoned travelers managed to get an actual refund from an airline because of the swine flu outbreak? How did you do it?
(Photo:FlyGuy92586)
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Comments:
A credit sounds pretty good and more than the airline was obligated to do. Maybe someone should have bought flight insurance on the offchance for something untoward happening.
Wow, this sucks, for everyone involved in the tourism industry, because airlines are seeing flights canceled, the hotels in Mexico are seeing their industry tank, and the consumers are left with no vacation and no money.
@henwy:
I guess I should also mention that my sister is supposed to fly to mexico at the end of the month. My mom wants her to cancel the trip. There were a couple of suggestion guides linked through CNN about how to get a refund. Some of the airlines are allowing them, but only if you're flying in the next few days. It's believed there will be rolling dates if this swine-flu thing doesn't get better so the advice was just to sit tight and wait until your travel date rolls around.
Overall, a credit still seems to be more than meeting someone halfway though.
What is wrong with the credit? Book a hotel in Europe and fly there on Monday.
good on continental. never mind the the violence and kidnappings by the drug cartels... not going to mexico because of sensational reporting on the flu is just silly.
I think the OP's problem with the credit is that he has no intention of going anywhere else. You can feasibly have a vacation in Mexico for 4 days with a flight that takes maybe 3 hours depending on where you are, but anywhere in Europe is at least 8 hours in the air, and that would eat up a chunk of time for the OP...especially since it's apparently he's been planning this since January.
It's very possible that he won't a) be able to get a round-trip flight to anywhere in Europe for the same amount he paid to go to Mexico and b) be able to get a good hotel for less or the same amount he paid for in Mexico.
I think the problem is that anyone wanting to change their mind on a nonrefundable ticket could use PIGSARS as an excuse. If they made that exception, none of the nonrefundable tickets outstanding would actually be nonrefundable. Everyone would call with that as their excuse whether it was true or not and the airline would end up taking the loss...and why should they take the loss?
@Corporate_guy: That's what I was thinking. You (as in the OP)have already got the time off. You've got your passport. Ok, so maybe your hotel bill in Europe might be higher? OTOH, you might find a cheaper place.
I agree with those who said a credit is reasonable enough. In fact, it's more than reasonable. Part of the reason non-refundable tickets are so much cheaper is because of stuff like this -- if you don't take the flight due, you still pay for it. This is what stuff like travel insurance is for. A full credit is more than reasonable for the airline.
The OP can't travel to florida and pretend it's mexico sans-flu? What about hawaii?
+1 on the "A Credit is totally reasonable" argument.
Chargeback. If they fight it (which they usually don't) tell them the charges were fraudulent.
@citking: How is this fraudulent? The only fraud here is the one you're telling people to perpetrate!
When I clicked to read this article, I was expecting the OP to be out his dough.
Unless a refundable ticket is purchased, I think the offer of a full credit is great. They could have charged him a fee to switch his flight.
The CDC is advising against travel, not prohibiting it.
BTW, my wife and I wasted a week of her parents' timeshare by canceling our Toronto trip during the SARS scare. Same thing. The CDC advised against going there. We took their advice, and paid the consequence.
We were going to drive there. Had we booked flights, we would have been thrilled to have the airline let us rebook without a fee.
Many airlines are canceling flights to Mexico. Even if the OP gets a credit check make sure that the plane actually left or is still scheduled. The OP should get a refund if Continental cancels before departure.
I just got off the phone with Continental 10 minutes ago to cancel my trip to Mexico. I got the same info and decided to take the credit. But, I was told that if the flight is cancelled on or before the day of departure, they will issue a full refund.
Other than the non-full refund, I found it to be a surprisingly easy process.
I don't think Continental is being unreasonable here. Credit for the full price of the tickets, usable for a year, seems fair. They're doing you a favour by offering that, if the ticket is nonrefundable. See the cruise line story: credit for a cruise sometime in the next year would be a reasonable thing for the cruise line to offer its customers as well.
Yet another reason flights are for suckers.
(Hey, it was a valid argument in the cruise thread...)
@citking: This works better when there isn't a note on the passenger record stating "customer called to cancel."
I'm going to book a vacation to Mexico soon because I bet the rates will be GREAT! 11,000 people have died so far this flu season. I haven't heard that number for swine flu. Until I see bodies piled in the streets, I'm not going to expect that anyone business-minded (except the media!) is going to fall for the insantiy and further crush the business. Go to Mexico! Silly.
the compensatory offer given to the OP is fair.
This is still OP's problem, and his decision not to fly to Mexico. Continental is still flying service to Mexico, he purchased a ticket to go. Full credit for 1 year is very reasonable, considering the airline doesn't have to do anything at all, and they're willing to eat the entire cost of his ticket as a favor.
His hypothetical question is irrelevant and makes no sense, and is exactly the kind of hair-brained consumer-zealot drivel that shuts CS agents right down (in terms of helping you). Terrible non-applicable hypothetical situations are second only to popular misconceptions of quantum theory on my list of pet peeves. What if a half-Mothra, half egg-sandwich monster who's the re-incarnation of Liberace descended from the heavens and wanted to mate with the plane mid-flight, and I spill my diet Shasta on my laptop? What? Exactly.
@henwy: I'm inclined to agree. The airline is giving you a full credit apparently without re-booking fees. that sounds perfectly fair to me. as you also said, that's what trip insurance is for.
He bought a non-reundable ticket. Assuming that on that date the plane goes to where he paid for it to go and a seat was available for him, I don't see why he'd expect a refund.
@phoblog:
I'm with you, this flu thing is WAY overblown, and my wife and I have already been talking about booking a trip to Mexico in the near future when things are going to be even dirt cheaper than they normally are.
Could you use the credit to buy a refundable ticket someplace else and then wait a while and then ask for a refund? Teehee.
@pecan 3.14159265: He doesn't have to go somewhere in Mexico. I'm sure Continental flies to the Caribbean, Central America and South America. All of which are close and cheaper than Europe (and probably Mexico).
This is making buying trip cancellation insurance more attractive, unless they suddenly stop paying out, claiming this was an "Act of God"
Good lord, he cancelled his ticket because of some wishy-washy worry about the US cancelling all flights out of Mexico (???) because of the Flu and a full credit isn't good enough?
@IfThenElvis: From Marketwatch Friday: "On Friday, Continental Airlines ... said it would halve its Mexico capacity amid traveler panic over swine flu, in the wake of the death of a reported 160 people there and infected thousands more.
Though Mexico is just a small part of U.S. airlines' total market, analysts worry concerns about the flu will discourage travel in general...." [www.marketwatch.com]
@nybiker: There's also the Bahamas, Virgin Islands, Puerto Rico (no passport necessary even!), Florida... I could keep listing every warm non-Mexican destination within a $1000 plane ticket but I'll quit now. Yeah, it sucks, but it's not Continental's fault that there's a flu outbreak. Take your vacation.
Speaking as an ex-travel agent who really hated the cancellation policies of major airlines (go Westjet - they don't screw you around with cancellations), I still have to say this is unreasonableness on the OP's part. You bought an unrefundable ticket. You were most likely offered travel insurance upon booking (if you booked online, it was likely an option that you glossed over or was somewhere in the fine print), which you opted not to use. The whole reason you buy travel insurance, particularly cancellation insurance, is for unexpected situations like this. The fact that the airline offered a full credit for you is far better than you will get from any other major airline, and is far more than they are obligated to give you. Don't like it? Count it a lesson learned, and next time, buy travel insurance.
i'm in the middle of a similar situation right now. I have a honeymoon in two weeks to mexico. the only difference - i bought travel insurance, i booked the whole trip through a travel agent with cancellation insurance - and so far i've been getting the runaround on it. the insurance apparently doesn't have any verbage about a pandemic as a valid cancellation excuse. my travel agent has been trying for days to get us more information, but understandably, she's having no luck getting through.
so for all the people who are saying "tough shit, it was non refundable, should have bought the insurance", at least in one case, the insurance alone isn't helping matters.
@Erwos: Fight unfairness with unfairness. The airline industry has some of the most nonsensical policies, fees, etc. established so I do not see a problem at all with fighting back. Is it underhanded and probably not legitimate? Sure. But life isn't fair.
How can Continental know what time frame the guy will/will not be able to use the credit in? It's not their fault/responsibility he can't use it in a year. For the sake of their business, they have to apply consistent rules to their passengers. Duh.
Yeah, we got screwed on the cruise thing. My mother in law is now paying to fly us from Portland, OR to Los Angeles to accompany her on a cruise to SEATTLE.
I don't know what's worse, the fact that I'm blowing what little vacation time I have on this happy horseshit or that I'm now the laughingstock of my team at work.
{disclaimer: I work for a travel agency}
Unless you pay for a refundable ticket, airlines almost never give a refund to your credit card. For [BaconFlu] the airlines pretty much are only waiving change fee for travel within a limited date range. Concidering that change fees can range from about 150 per person to 100% non-refundable, full credit on another flight within one year is about as good as you are going to get.
Between the down ecomony and [BaconFlu] the travel industry is taking it in the shorts.
@phoblog: Overblown yes, but you will need too wait for it to blow over if you want to have a good time. For example Mexico city is a ghost town and everybody is staying in their homes and business and attractions are shut down. Not easy to get a drink on beach in that enviroment, let alone if you actually want to see something.
Though I would imagine it will be at least 6 months after the last of the pig flu talk before tourism rebounds and rates go back to normal so there is no hurry booking.
You had a non-refundable ticket, and decided to postpone the trip due to the flu. They offered to reschedule your flight for any time in the next year and to anywhere else. Where's the problem?
@citking: Usually, "underhanded" and "not legitimate" are reasons not to do something. You can say, "Well, life isn't fair" when someone asks, "But why did this swine flu thing ruin my vacation?" It's not an answer to, "But how can I justify committing fraud?"
Still, you are certainly right that airlines are unethical: OP would have slightly less of a problem if he could resell his ticket (at a loss, I realize). And (IMO) there is no good reason to tie tickets to identities. Making anonymous travel all-but-impossible in the name of bogus "security" is severely unfair, and I don't think it keeps us any safer. It is all about gouging the customer.
@dantsea: In a sense you are right: the inability to travel anonymously makes ticket resale impossible. So anyone who buys a ticket not only hands over a wad of cash for a spot on the airplane, but also must to surrender the ability to fill that seat with anyone's butt but his/her own. So to some extent the airlines make a sucker out of anyone who agrees to this abusive deal.
It's really an economic issue: the airlines want to control the market for selling tickets. The issue is claimed to be a security issue, but I think it's sham. The driving force behind requiring ID is the desire to exploit.
@citking: It's more like fighting unfairness with blatant fraud. When you buy a nonrefundable ticket, and cancel out of your own free will, due to a "natural illness epidemic" nonetheless, the airline is 100% not at fault. You take a chance when you buy a nonrefundable ticket, and a credit from the airline is much, much more than fair. A recommendation against travel to Mexico from the CDC is not reason enough for them to be at fault.
Just because "they usually don't fight it" does not make it less illegal and fraudulent. That's not prudent, legitimate consumerism. Rather, it's self-absorbed, "I'm more important than you," pathetic behavior.
Ouch to the OP! Even the dbag with dust on his PS3 got more sympathy!
BTW, Continental doesn't get mad if you sell unused credits on eBay...
Why not just go to Mexico? Its a flu, so fricking what. Unless you are infirm, over 65, an infant, or HIV positive you may get a little sick. Big deal. The airline bent over backwards to quell your irrational fears and you are saying NOT GOOD ENOUGH.
The only way is to book a refundable T or Y class ticket.