which government are they looking at getting the money from?

It says they are asking "its" government so I would assume their own.

Also this is a little misleading as both companies have already been given loans and money from their respective governments to help keep them running.

@shoelace414: Japan, of course. The article said "Toyota is asking its government." :)

I'm waiting for the Detroit bashers to show up...

*cricket*cricket*cricket*

I thought Ford owns Mazda...

WTF!!!!!!!!! Of course the new administration will give it to them. Might as well! Heck just print up another trillion dollars.

@Jenkinsbball: Ford only owns about a third of it

@Joewithay:
And I think they're trying to shrink that number too.

I just have a hard time believing that Toyota is in that kind of trouble.

@dwhuntley: Please learn to read. Thank you.

First US automakers now foreign makers want a bailout?
Whatever happened to survival of the fittest?

This is the type of bloody nonsense up with which I shall not put.

Um, US gov. =/= Japanese gov.

It's unfortunate, really. I just bought a brand new KIA, and the 3 different times I was in the showroom the place was PACKED with people signing contracts and waiting for salespeople- it seemed they didn't have enough staff to keep up with the demand. That dealership was selling brand new '08 Sedonas worth $26K+ for $16K just to move them. I couldn't even find a place to SIT. I read that Kia (or Hyundai?) actually posted profits in the 4th quarter.

What bothers me is that some of these foreign car makers can offer a brand new basic car for $10K and the US manufacturers still are asking $14K. People want the best value for the money paid. I couldn't find a decent incentive or rebate for anything US made.

1.) People who don't properly read the articles should be revoked of commenting privileges.

2.) I guess everything is going out the window in regards to a free economy....

Does anyone find it supremely ironic that the spokesperson for Mazda's name is Toyota? Wow. He must have really kicked ass to be able to get that job.

But on the subject at hand.. I agree with others, government subsidized corporations are fail. Let them die, and allow the strong to rise to the top.

@ZManGT: These companies, honestly, are frequently subsidized by their government. We just don't hear about it because it's not our pockets they're taking the money from.

@cmdrsass: And by the looks of his history, refrain from breeding.

Detroit may not be "alone in its misery," but that's only because many people are rethinking buying a new car. If they can repair the old one or buy used, why spend the extra money?
And Detroit really is alone in that they make such crappy cars. After my Ford bit the dust, I didn't even consider American cars. Thankfully, Honda knows how to make a solid car that runs for more than a year before needing its first repair.

Maybe you should edit the headline? People seem to be commenting before they read the post and realize that it's not an issue related to the current administration. Maybe have it say, "Toyota and Maybe Honda Asking for Japanese Bailouts."

@TheSpatulaOfLove: I don't need to compare Detroit to their competitors to point out that their counting on future sales always being higher than current in order to pay for retirement benefits was just plain dumb.

And a couple billion is a lot less than tens of billions. Plus, it's only the finance arm that needs it (not surprising as they now have a huge number of 0 percent financing loans to take care of now). Not to mention they are not waiting until they are just about out of money to blackmail their government into action. Need I go on?

@joe18521: Maybe it's like the Stride gum commercials, where they're begging people to buy a new pack because the flavor of the old one never fades... I would run out and buy a hybrid Camry right now if I had spare money and needed a car but the '96 Camry I already have runs like a dream. ;)

This is the slippery slope we all go down when one government props up a company supposedly competing in the free market. See Airbus vs. Boeing if you want an example.

@James Johnston: Not really. The market's saying that we shouldn't have jets, since they need subsidies and bailouts from time to time, and we also shouldn't have national trains since Amtrak constantly needs funding. The fact is that the market is now saying that cars aren't essential and that we should let the companies go out of business. Without cars, we'll still have horses, bicycles, small aircraft, boats... And you'd rather be riding a horse or a Cessna than a Corolla, right?

@dwhuntley: LOL. Might want to READ THE ARTICLE before you comment on it, so you don't look like a dumbass.

@joe18521: Toyota is down to slightly more cash on hand than GM had last year when GM announced that bankruptcy was an option they were exploring. Companies generally can't put away significant nest eggs for economic downturns like this because large nest eggs become targets of leveraged buyouts: where a purchasing company uses the target's cash reserves as collateral when financing an acquisition.

@joe18521: As of November 18, 2008, Ford sold a 20% stake in Mazda which reduced their stake to 13.4%. In doing so, Ford surrendered their controlling interest in the company. The sale gave Ford $850m in cash, though.

@WiglyWorm: The Big 3 are also regularly subsidized by us. We still don't hear about it even though it is our pockets they're taking the money from. This bailout money is on TOP of the millions they were already getting from the government every year.

RE Toyota: Toyota must be saved! At least until they release a new fuel cell version of the MR2.

***No, they haven't said anything about making a new MR2, but they'd BETTER! And soon dammit!

@TVarmy: If people base their information on HEADLINES, then they need to get off the internet.

@TVarmy: I'd take the Cessna over the horse and corolla... then add a nice road bike and I could do plenty of puddle jumping :)

@MorganAgron: Don't forget the tax-supported highways that create the demand for the autos.

@verucalise:

Those people signing contracts where actually relatives of the salespeople and where there just for you.

Why is the US government only giving money to the "big-3"? GM and Honda are both multi-national corporations who employ a lot of people in the US as well as in other countries. They both have stock- and bond- holders in the US. They both have a lot of customers in the US. The only real difference is that Honda's executives have Japanese names and sit in offices in Tokyo, and GM's executives have American names and sit in offices in Detroit.

Personally, I don't think any government should give money to any of them. Sure, some of them would fold, but the rest would survive. In the end, we would have fewer, but stronger car companies that don't need government bailouts. It sucks to be a loser in that world, but that's the way competition is supposed to work.

@Etoiles:

So by that logic, shouldn't Chrysler's sales be skyrocketing?

::::::::::::::::::::::::FLASHBACK::::::::::::::::::::::::

"I frankly don't see how we're going to meet the foreign competition," said Henry Ford II, then chairman and CEO of Ford Motor (F, news, msgs), on May 13, 1971, right after the annual shareholders' meeting. "We've only seen the beginning," he predicted. Regarding Americans' increasing preference for small cars, he declared: "Mini car, mini profits."

@cabjf: The housing market will always go up! There is zero risk.

oh... wrong article.

Welcome to modern economics: companies that make bad business decisions reap enormous rewards for their irresponsibility, in the form of "bailouts". The Japanese aren't idiots, they'll take free money if it's there for the asking.

@Radi0logy:

Reminds me of this college football team I saw last year that had a wide receiver named "Passmore," and a running back named "Rushmore."

Okay, I made up that last part about the RB.

So has the Japanese car ethos of "built to last" come back to bite them?

@joe18521: It's simple, really. If three of your major competitors got billions in handouts for cash liquidity, you're all of a sudden at a competitive disadvantage if you didn't get a piece of the pie.

It's not about needing it and feeling the hurt, it's to stay in the same playing field.

@jetblack: Which is all well and good. If anyone suggested that Toyota and Honda were looking for handouts from our government, I would be all, "oh, so those Japanese carmakers operating in red 'right to work' states want a bailout? I wonder how the Republican congresscritters from those states feel about that after crying 'socialism' when it was the Detroit Three asking for bailouts."

But I can put that knife back into its sheath. Thanks for the clarification.

Well, at least we have a way to define which companies are Japanese and which are American - it's based on which government they go to when they need a bailout!

Japanese auto manufacturers have regularly received large subsidies and loans from their respective governments.

@HiPwr: Entirely right here.

@TheSpatulaOfLove:

I'll help. Toyota is asking for 2 billion to help secure financing for its customers. GM is asking for 30 billion just to be able to stay alive, and NEEDS 2-3 billion a month just to even exist. People still want Toyota, Honda and Mazda products, which is the reason their sales have only fallen 1/2 as much as terrible companies like Chrysler.

I find it ironic that Toyhondasan is asking the Japanese government for a bailout. They have in effect been susidized since WWII by rules in their home market that make it uneconomic to sell imported (ie: American,German etc.) cars there. Also,Japanese culture dictates that driving something out of the ordinary (Japanese) means that you are the proverbial nail that needs a good pounding.(The Japanese also have an ingrained belief that they build the best cars in the world-a not unreasonable belief ,btw)

I predicted here last summer,when the first distant rumbling of a rescue for Detroit was being whispered,that any bailout by Washington would invite retaliation by our trading partners and here it is. If the Japanese government gives Toyhondasan a bailout,it will be back to status quo ante for the companies that call the U.S. their home.This just means that we may as well call our bailout a "UAW / GM Tax" to maintain the lifestyles of the management and line workers of the domestic companies.

You know the ironic thing in all of this ? The ironic thing is that the jokers in congress that vote to hand money to any car company are more likely to DIE in office than be voted out.

@Blueskylaw: When some OTHER industry (banking) fucks up the economy enough that your sales drop by more than 1/3rd, it's no longer your fault.

This wouldn't be survival of the fittest, just extinction.

It was just a matter of time and timing. These companies weren't going to miss out on free money. They weren't going to watch their competition get handouts and them get zip. They just didn't want to look as desperate. Smoke and mirrors. Hell, even if they were doing great, why wouldn't they take free money?

@Applekid: WRONG. The problem is just like the American industry had issue with loans, so to does Japans. The difference is unlike the US industry where they loan from many banks, the Japanese industry is tied to a bank, so they have not had as big a issue with securing loans until now.

But people are more interested in bashing blue collar workers and unions to realize its the banking industries unwillingness to put out operating loans thats causing the mess and neither the US nor the Japanese auto industry would be in trouble if companies could actually get the loans they need to operate.

There would have been no need to infuse money into either groups had the banks not used their money to buy other banks, jets and vegas vacations and actually loaned money like it was meant to be used.

Companies NEED operating loans. They are how companies operate when they are waiting for their product to sell. If they cant get them they have to hit their reserves (like the big three burned through and the japanese are now burning up) and once thats done then they are done.

@MichaelBrazell: See Toyota and Honda... oh wait.

You can make arguments both way bub. The Japanese auto industry wouldn't EXIST if the Japanese government didn't help support them initially. And up till today everyone had no problem saying "see they are doing good our blue collar workers just suck and should suffer along with their families."

The problem here is REALLY when one industry is allowed so much power over the others, you better regulate that industry to death so it doesnt abuse the power so much it ruines everyone.

Deregulation did this and no one can argue otherwise now. Anyone who does is a proven idiot at this point.