Sears Can't Get Its Story Straight Regarding Rust And Craftsman Tools
C'mon Sears, rust isn't a magic brown fairy powder that you can sprinkle over any warranty issue to deny coverage. Brian was told he couldn't have his worn-out sockets replaced because they were rusty. He pointed out that he needed them replaced because they were worn out, not because of some cosmetic damage due to oxidation. Now Sears has officially told him that any rust on a Craftsman tool automatically voids the warranty—which is not what Sears told us two years ago.
Brian's first email to Sears (we reprinted it earlier today) triggered a meaningless auto-response, so he tried calling. Here's what happened, according to a second email he sent to Sears and copied to us:
I doubt this will do any good, considering the last detailed email I sent was replied to with what looks like an auto-reply message, but here goes. I called the number you provided, and spoke to a charming girl in India or Pakistan or somewhere, who did not understand my concern. I was then transfered to another girl from the same country who once again didn't understand. She just kept repeating that they would not replace a tool with rust on it. She even went on to tell me that I should just throw away the sockets in question. I have a problem throwing away anything that came with a lifetime warranty, so I'm pretty sure I won't be doing that. She finally gave me a number to a different customer service line (800-549-4505) and told me to try them. I called and spoke to Judy who was very friendly and knowledgeable. She reiterated that Craftsman excludes all tools that have rust on them. Alright, fine. I give up. What about my Craftsman tool box which leaked causing my tools to rust? She stated that it wouldn't be covered under the lifetime warranty either. It appears Craftsman just won't budge on this issue.
I averaged out my tool purchases and came to the conclusion that I have spent about about $300 on Sears tools, per year, since I was 15. That means that thus far I have spent $3,000 on Craftsman products int he last 10 years. If you figure that I will live until I'm 80, that would mean future purchases of approximately $16,500. A new car in other words. Now with the economy the way it is, customer loyalty is very important to companies, but by treating your loyal customers this way, you won't make it through the next 5 years. I'm just one voice and I know that the decision makers and CEO of Sears will probably never hear my story, but I have to try. I was a customer who was buying Craftsman partly because of tradition, and partly because of a lifetime warranty. Little did I know that "unlimited lifetime warranty" had exceptions. It is sad that I am now one of the exceptions. This process has left me with a feeling of alienation by a company and brand I trusted. By replacing 9 sockets that would probably cost you $5 to make, you would have kept a lifetime customer. Now I'm afraid that the warranty on my lawnmower won't be good because it has grass clippings on it.
My next emails will be going to every other tool company that offers a lifetime warranty. Perhaps one of them will value their customers more.
Thank you for the last 10 years, and good luck surviving in this economy.
Now here's our problem: in March 2007, our own Ben Popken contacted Sears about this exact issue, and he received the following response:
Craftsman hand tools come with a life-time warranty against product defects. If a Craftsman hand tool ever fail due to a defect in the product, simply return the item to the nearest Sears store. Some exclusions does apply which would void or do not apply to the life-time warranty, which include but is not limited to:
- The item being altered in any way.
- Lost, stolen or damaged by an act of God (such as fire, flood, etc.)
- If the item is used for any other reason than its intended purpose, including neglect.
- Rust that does not prohibits the performance of the item (most rust is strictly cosmetic and does not justify being classified as broken)
- Precision hand tools that includes a mechanism (such as calipers, micrometers, most torque wrenches, etc).
Clearly, then, Sears means that you cannot simply trade in an otherwise functional tool with rust on it and receive a rust-free one. Rust is not grounds for replacement.
Again, just so we're all clear (please let some Sears C-level type be reading this): Brian, a lifelong Craftsman customer, tried to replace sockets that were no longer functional. The rust is a non issue. He is not trying to return sockets because they are rusty.
So when did you change your policy, Sears? We're having a hell of a time tracking down the official lifetime guarantee wording anywhere on the Craftsman or Sears site, but we'd love to get a look at the official language, and find out from Sears exactly when the policy changed for the worse.
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Comments:
Wow...just wow. Considering that the ONLY thing that gets people to buy Craftsman is their warranty, this is pretty damning. I hate to sound like some internet elitist wackjob, but it looks like I won't be purchasing Craftsman again.
When I worked at sears a guy complained to corporate and we got emails sent to our store about denying ones with rust which I hated but it was management cracking down on it. That stayed in place for about a month then they went back to their old ways. This was about 5 years ago.
Just call their corporate and they should get things straightened out. The managers try to fight it saying that it falls under abuse (I guess on that list neglect).
I returned several Craftsman tools about 10 years ago and they replaced them with Sears brand. Watch out for that scam, too. Sears brand has no warranty.
The wording of the rust exclusion above seems to me that rust that DOES prohibit the performance of the item would be grounds for replacement.
...So if any rust is found on the new Willis Towers, does Sears need to take it back with no refund?
Okay, this is predictable and obligatory, but _stop buying things from Sears_, people. This is not the company you knew and hasn't been for over ten years now. Their products are crap, their service is crap. Stop shopping there out of habit. They will screw you eventually just like BoA will.
Good to know. My dad always urges me to buy craftsman because of the warranty. I've always felt weary of satisfaction guarantees... I'll support the OP. I'll now make a point to look at other brands because this kind of company behavior is ridiculous.
I really can't understand all the Sears bashing I see in here. Just like any other company they have to work with the same quality of people for employment that everybody else does. Minimum wage part timers have no loyalty. This issue is across the board. Sears does not have a monopoly on hiring idiots. My local Sears is always pleasant to go into and the sales people are freindly and helpful.
@desertdust: When you call corporate customer support, people whose conversations are recorded and constantly reviewed by supervisors, it becomes clear that this is policy, and not just some automoton who thinks they have more power than they really do.
I believe this is the way the warranty is worded on the packaging:
The Craftsman Unlimited Lifetime Warranty Policy is as follows:
If this Craftsman [hand tool]* ever fails to give complete satisfaction, return it to any Sears store or other Craftsman outlet in the United States for free repair or replacement. **This warranty gives you specific legal rights and you may have other rights, which vary, from state to state.
* The words "hand tool" are often replaced on the product's packaging with the actual name of the tool. i.e. wrench, hammer, or shovel.
** On certain products, there is an additional sentence added into the warranty noting that it does not cover expendable parts such as replacement blades for utility knives or the tape on tape measures.
@desertdust: Sears gets bashed because they used to have one of the best customer service and return policies.
Nowadays, they are worse than Walmart.
Just us non-Sears folks warning the unaware that Sears old rep doesn't mean squat anymore.
Craftsman warranty and customer service are a thing of the past. They tout it as a selling point but then try to find any excuse to refuse even though it is an "UNCONDITIONAL" guarantee. My experiences with Sears led me to quit dealing with them 6 years ago. Denied warranties on tools, then spending a half hour trying to get service information on a Craftsman lawn tractor. I repeatedly read the information DIRECTLY from the manufacturer plate on the tractor and had the representative tell me that there was no way it was a Sears product. Despite the fact that the Sears service guy had been there long enough to tell my father-in-law that it was 1) no longer under warranty, 2) yes they had the part, but 3) it was too old to be worth repairing.
Craftsman is simply another US name that is now stuck on any crap that Sears can pick up at lowest bid.
@desertdust: The key here is that with the exception of the warranty Craftsman tools are just like any tools. So the ONLY thing that makes them worth buying (and the only reason anyone knows about them) is the warranty. If people are having problems getting them to honor their warranty, then it is time to change. How much Costco bashing do you think there would be if they went to a 14 day return policy?
I have a Craftsman ratchet set. A few years ago the latch on the case broke. Would Sears replace the case? No way, I was told. It now lives with an industrial-strength Velcro fastener, but the next time I need to buy tools, it's not going to be at Sears.
Next time buy Snap-On
Just to play devils advocate, the impression that I got was that rust could be the possible reason for rounding, or at least interpreted that way. This would in turn show neglect and misuse therefore voiding the warranty.
That being said, maybe the manager isn't knowledgeable about tools (or his job) and just doesn't understand what worn out means. I think that the associates are just missing the point entirely, and can't make the distinction that its not the rust he cares about. I personally have never had a problem with sears, i have had to replace some ratchets i bent at a 90 degree angle and they just did a no questions swap. Well, I guess they were curious how you bend a 3/4 in ratchet handle, but thats all.
If I were Brian, I would now follow up by returning the damaged sockets to his local Sears.
One at a time.
With a slingshot.
Through the biggest panes of plate glass I could see from the parking lot.
@skizsrodt: Whoops. I hope you get this straightened out, I don't want craftsman to think that they can avoid a commitment and a promise based on trivial issues. Good luck
@ct_price: They tried this with me as well. I politely asked "Why do the replacements have red handles? Aren't those the ones which have no warranty?" The guy said that they always replace warranted tools with the Sears brand.
I had to politely but firmly explain what the word "replacement" means: I want a new version of exactly what I had before it broke. Ninety seconds later, I had what I was due.
That same trip I had a pair of broken pliers from a really old toolbox my dad gave me. They no longer made that kind of pliers, so the guy said I could go pick out a similar one. That evened things out for me.
I suspect he was told by mgmt to slip in the red handled junk when someone comes in to replace their lifetime stuff.
I've been buying the Lowe's house brand. Not too expensive, cool blue and black color scheme, and a similar lifetime warranty to Craftsman.
And as a bonus, no Sears. Plus, since SEars has been spiraling, they've closed a lot of shops, so there's more Lowe's around.
So the policy used to be "Rust does not justify replacing the tool" and it evolved into "Rust justifies not replacing the tool." It looks like a small change, until you're actually dealing with a tool that is both rusty and broken.
Computer companies like Apple have made a similar change recently in their approach to warranty coverage. It used to be that cosmetic damage wasn't covered, but real defects were. Now they use cosmetic damage to justify not fixing real defects.
Get some barkeeper's friend and clean them, that stuff can get rust off of ANYTHING.
OR
Don't buy anything from sears again and let them fail.
@balls187: Heh, I was just thinking this is a perfect opportunity for some other tool company to step in and give this guy a set of new sockets. The positive PR from that alone would more than make up for the cost of the tools. The OP is a consumer looking for a brand to be loyal to, what better opportunity do they have to snipe one away from Craftsman?
Tommy: Let's think about this for a sec, Ted, why do they put a guarantee on a box? Hmm, very interesting.
Ted: I'm listening.
Tommy: Here's how I see it. A guy puts a guarantee on the box 'cause he wants you to fell all warm and toasty inside.
Ted: Yeah, makes a man feel good.
Tommy: 'Course it does. Ya think if you leave that box under your pillow at night, the Guarantee Fairy might come by and leave a quarter.
Ted: What's your point?
Tommy: The point is, how do you know the Guarantee Fairy isn't a crazy glue sniffer? "Building model airplanes" says the little fairy, but we're not buying it. Next thing you know, there's money missing off the dresser and your daughter's knocked up, I seen it a hundred times.
Ted: But why do they put a guarantee on the box then?
Tommy: Because they know all they solda ya was a guaranteed piece of shit. That's all it is. Hey, if you want me to take a dump in a box and mark it guaranteed, I will. I got spare time. But for right now, for your sake, for your daughter's sake, ya might wanna think about buying a quality item from me.
Ted: Hmm. Okay, I'll buy from you.
@MikeHerbst: Somebody tried that already, instead it was at Wal-Mart, and he was returning ammunition, at 1300 fps (as Ms. Marco so eloquently put it): Man Attempts To Return Walmart Ammunition At 1300 Feet Per ...
@balls187:
Snap-On does make good tools, but their warranty support for non-pros absolutely sucks.
Check out the "warranty" for tools bought through the website vs. if you buy off the truck. Very different.
If you have a shop and are a regular stop on a Snap-On truck's route, then your wallet is probably empty but your support is great. If you buy from the website, good luck getting a tool fixed.
(But damn are the Snap-On combo wrenches comfy...)
And so begins the countdown for Sears to wind up like Circuit City
I would ask to be forwarded a printed copy of that specific policy. My bet is that they can't.
I will definitely think elsewhere on my next tool purchases of craftsmen tools.
Rust that does not prohibits the performance of the item (most rust is strictly cosmetic and does not justify being classified as broken)
Ben is mis-parsing the claim by sears. They claim that rust is not a manufacturing defect that **validates** a replacement claim. The converse is not implied. Clearly, rust can damage a tool beyond usability and the rust weakens the tools resistance to wear, such as "rounding." So sears is with in reason to reject the warranty replacement of a rusted tool. If you take good care of your tools (especially stainless or chrome plated wrenches), they will not rust.
Dunk the sockets in naval jelly to remove the rust and then return them one by one (less conspicuous that way). If necessary, make sure the teeth are suitably ground down by putting them on an air ratchet and then overtightening some junk fasteners.
Optional: Once you have a complete set of tools, sell them and buy some from a company that doesn't suck.
@desertdust: It's simple: Sears is a business, and this is consumerist.com. Naturally, all businesses are evil and out to screw customers based on the stories we've read here.
OK how about this, clean any rust off then hit it with some of that cheap spray rust converter, $3.99 for enough to a thousand sockets, it turns rust black, then take them back.
Sears can not change the warranty on an already sold product - only the bankruptcy courts can dispel them of this duty. It doesn't matter what the warranty says now. It only matters what the warranty stated at the time of purchase. Consider taking it up with Sears legal department...
I had the exact same issue here with Canadian Sears. No replacement for tools with any rust on them.
The warranties were prominently posted in the store:
"Unconditionally guaranteed"
"Satisfaction guaranteed"
So after having spent many thousands of dollars on tools at Sears I have not bought one single thing from them. It's funny how refusing a $2 warranty exchange has cost them a lot more.
I own both Snap-On and Craftsman tools. I agree that it can be sometimes hard to get a tool replaced by Snap-On. However, I have only had one or two Snap-On tools fail on me. I've had a lot of craftsman tools fail on me.
Sears is the General Motors of department stores. Outdated and rusty.
I had read ( a few years ago) about a farmer finding a Craftsman fencing tool in his field. Taking it to Sears they can't find anything similar and that this tool was at least 80 years old. They replaced it with a pair of pliers no problem.
I've found that Sears has been reasonable about replacing tools (usually the low-end socket wrenches, and with a similar, low-end socket wrench) but without complaint. I'm sure it depends a lot on the store itself.
@ct_price: Had that done to me also before. One time I threw a fit and got a manager ebcause they no longer made a rachet that I paid over 100 dollars before. He actually gave me cash back from the register other than a giftcard because I told him they had it at home depot and I needed that size.
@sicknick: Wrong - the Lowe's warranty is about the PACKAGING- not what's inside. I've had Sears employees play games with their "warranty," but Lowe's are outright thieves - up through the store manager. They print the warranty on their screwdriver packages, but if one falls apart on you Lowe's will tell you that they do not warranty screwdrivers. THEN WHY IS IT PRINTED IN PLAIN ENGLISH ON YOUR PACKAGING?
Sears is a cakewalk compared to Lowe's/Kobalt. Never again.
Wow if this is the way Sears is going to treat people. I guess I will just start buying 5 of everything at Harbor Freight for 1/2 the price as Sears. The only reason that I buy Sears tools, is because of the no questions asked return policy.
Just looked at my online statements I spent in the last 12 months $3200 at Sears. The only item other then tools, was a dishwasher.....
>>only the bankruptcy courts can dispel them of this duty
And if they keep screwing (hey - tool pun!!) their customers, chances are that these duties may soon be dispelled.
Likely the economy is causing them to tighten their belts, and thus strangle the customer they are currently forcing to suck their d....
Sorry, got carried away there.