Is Suze Orman Nothing But A Lying Shill?
Slate's James Scurlock has some harsh words for Suze Orman. He says she's a liar who is more interested in shilling cruises and luxury car leases than anything else.
From Slate:
Who is struggling these days, according to Suze? "People who grew up without much money and later earn a comfortable living sometimes spend too much to make up for what they didn't get as children. ... People who feel entitled to the good life, or are unconsciously copying a mother or father who lived beyond her or his means. ... If you feel the need to impress people with what you have rather than with who you are, you are at high risk for credit card abuse." This from a woman who spends $500,000 a year chartering private jets and who sells "Cruise With Suze" packages on an Italian luxury liner. (She has also hawked for GM, claiming that leasing a luxury car-you know, the kind that people drive to impress others-is a terrific financial decision: "If you ask me, that's smart money!") No wonder she winks more than Sarah Palin, girlfriend.
He also goes after Orman for touting stocks as the best investment out there — while at the same time telling the NYT Magazine that she only invests money in the stock market if she doesn't care that she'll lose it.
And although one of Suze's mantras is how much she loves stocks-"[S]tocks, in my opinion, are the best investment vehicle for the growth of your money over time"-less than 3 percent of Suze's net worth happens to be invested in them. Instead, she's tucked away the vast majority of those royalties ($32 million-plus, after taxes) into insured, government-backed bonds. As she trilled to the New York Times Magazine a couple of years ago, "I have a million dollars in the stock market, because if I lose a million dollars, I don't personally care."
What do you think? Is Suze Orman bad news?
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Comments:
Yeah, she's a big hypocrite, is pretty creepy, and is a member of the Oprah cult, but at least one of her two faces is recommending living within your means. At least she's better than Jim Cramer.
When I really started reading investment articles, news, and advice, I quickly stopped clicking on anything with her name on it. Her advice always either seemed simplistic, or just plain silly. I was never impressed with her.
despite my intense disliking of her personality, she generally does give decent advice to the folks who call in. Largely, it's "don't spend that", which is good for folks who have some spending issues. You don't need a pile of books for that, but she provides the motivation for folks.
Suze Orman always recommends stocks for 20-somethings and then insists that as you grow older move them out of the stock market. I'm not positive how old Suze is, but I think she is old enough to realize that investing all of her money in a market that is probably going to go down before it goes up is a smart move for her. In my opinion, Suze always leans towards the conservative side and this just proves it. While being a spokesperson for cars and cruises does seem against what she normally says, all of her other advice is simple and straightforward enough for people to understand. I'm a big fan of Suze and she even has said in her Woman and Money book: "Do as I say, not as I do".
There seems to be an Event Horizon of success where all celebrities, no matter how good intentioned they started out, suddenly get suck into the black hole of greed.
She at least is the good subject of some rather hilarious SNL skits. But yeah, her financial advice is absolute garbage to anyone who has ever been in Business 101.
I also hate the way that she talks down to people. Average people can learn about money if you stop treating them like idiots who need hand holding. This Oprah-fication of our culture where we worry about our "feelings" about money and not out about actual results.
You can bring your own food and tap water to restauants and invest in teeth bleachings and large ... expensive ... jackets but that doesn't mean you know how to invest.
In short, she needs more economics and less marketing.
Dave Ramsey, FTW!
For someone who thinks you should impress people with who you are and not what you have, she certainly wears a crap load of make-up so she will look better. I don't trust people with that much make-up - it's a literal facade!
Both her and Cramer are shills, but at least when I watch Jim the is a good chance of:
a) Something being thrown across the room/broken
or
b) Him doing something you'd not expect a 5th grader to do, much less a grown man, aka, biting head's off foam bulls, & floundering on the floor.
if I'm gonna watch crap, mise be entertained.
When a personal finance expert turns into (or always was) a marketing shill she loses credibility. One would think at her level of success she would not need to sell herself out to make a living.
@Murph1908: Yeah, but up until recently most of America wasn't even saving. When I first graduated from college last May, I read Women and Money and I was able to understand her simplistic information. I set up a Roth IRA and a savings plan and it led to me getting really involved in my personal finances. Americans need simplistic information because otherwise most of us just won't get it.
@battra92:
The SNL skits of her make me able to tolerate her. That's one of the few things they do anymore that's funny.
@calquist: Agreed. I think you're spot on.
Investments are for MAKING money. Suze Orman is old/er and she's got $32 million banked; at this point, for her own life, she's looking to save that, not improve it. I don't see a problem with that.
I have read her book aimed at young new graduates and I though it was really good for many young people who have no clue what to do after graduation.
However the collar popping has totally turned me off!
I met Suzie Ormond back in the mid 90's as her books were starting to become popular. I was a hotel bellman helping her load up her things to the conference room where she was doing a guest appearance. I was in my late teens and had no clue who she was, I could tell that really irritated her. She did give me a copy of her book and signed it a nice little note in there and everything. I wish I could find it, I might be able to sell it on ebay?
Taking a snapshot of someone's current portfolio in this market and claiming it should be cast against free, one-size-fits-all financial advice is nonsense. Right now, MOST wealthy investors are in capital preservation mode. But if you lack the savvy and the funds to actively manage your investments, like most of her callers, she's right: dollar cost averaging and broad stock allocations are historically the right move. Keep in mind that advice is tailored to audience, and Suze Orman is talking to a broad swath of people with little financial experience. If you can't see the sign over her glowing little face that says "amateurs only" I question your credentials as a pro.
Are you going to outearn professionals following TV-based, one-size-fits-all advice like Suze Orman's? Absolutely not. But you will do far better than if you had invested in your company's stock or invested strictly in treasuries.
Suze pushing a car lease...source please?
One of her main things is no leasing.
@Ash78: That popped collar just screams present day "Benny" that I have to deal with every summer down here at the jersey Shore. Seaside Tony is now Seaside Suz-e.
Sounds like Scurlock is a bit of a tard himself.
"Instead, she's tucked away the vast majority of those royalties ($32 million-plus, after taxes) into insured, government-backed bonds."
If you have $32 million to invest, you probably have no need for the risk of the stock market. To imply that someone who needs to preserve wealth needs to adhere to the advice she gives others to try to accumulate wealth is moronic.
Unless he has some evidence that "$500,000 a year chartering private jets" is beyond her means, the comparison to people who do live beyond their means is ludicrous.
I'm sorry for being sexist, but I've always thought it kind of strange how a woman with blonde hair and blue eyes can have zero sex appeal...at least to me.
She's got the stink of Oprah all over her. Another minus.
PBS runs her self-help specials every pledge drive, which is about once every six weeks now. That means my normal Sat. cooking shows are preempted for her schlock, which annoys me. And as such PBS gets no money from me.
No. I don't like her.
I'm not a huge fan of her, but I thought she was absolutely against any kind of car lease.
Tied neck n' neck with Dave Ramsey...
@FordingTheRiver_GitEmSteveDave: And if you ever get tired of them, just search for "Guido" on flickr or Google and you'll be entertained/terrified for days.
@battra92:
Absolute garbage? Yeah, let's make unsupported sweeping statements. Nice.
And you complain that she talks down to people and treats them like idiots? You just described the average consumer who bought houses they couldn't afford with no money down, who then bitch and moan that they're getting thrown out on the street. If the average person had more-than-a-passing knowledge of finance, this Web site wouldn't be needed.
@rpm773:
Well, it's a good thing that as a man you hold no appeal to her either.
You're not sorry or you wouldn't have said it. I fail to see what her sex appeal had to do with her financial advice.
@battra92: This Oprah-fication of our culture where we worry about our "feelings" about money and not out about actual results.
The thing is, a lot of spending is emotional, and logic doesn't necessarily enter into the picture. Putting people on a cash budget has much of the same emotional impact as putting someone on a calorie budget (à la Weight Watchers) and makes some people feel just as deprived and binge much in the same way.
When you get someone down to the level of logic, they can perhaps acknowledge that yes, renting for the next ten years instead of buying isn't all bad, but emotionally they'll long for the security and freedoms of owning a place. (Not mobility-freedoms, but, say, the right to own a dog or paint your living room green.)
So yes, "feelings" enter into consumer spending. In a big way. And learning to identify when you're out for "retail therapy" or when you're stressed or when you're irrational can be as much of a help with the credit card as it can with the waistline.
@EBounding:
She is. This guy from Slate either doesn't fact check or knows something that Google doesn't.
@friendlynerd: Yeah, I probably shouldn't have posted that. I'm just so tired of having Jacques Pepin and Lidia Bastianich preempted for the same damn Suze Orman "special" week in and week out. It's got to come out somewhere...
@honestlytoomuch: You go on television without any makeup. And see how you like how you look. There's a reason why even Terry Bradshaw wears makeup on TV.
@FordingTheRiver_GitEmSteveDave: Popped collars, turtlenecks, etc. on older women means they have some neck waddle they're trying to hide.
This is the lady that has a show where people call in and ask ridiculous questions, right?
"Hello, I only make $98,000 a year, and my wife only makes $89,000. We have $99,999 in savings, and $898,000 in our 401k. We are both in our 30s. Our house, cars and student loans are paid off. We are wondering if it is ok for us to take a $5,000 cruise this year?"
"WHAT, ARE YOU PEOPLE CRAZY? No way you can afford a cruise despite being better off than 99.999999% of Americans!"
In Maxed Out, it is revealed that she spends a lot of time talking about the importance of FICO while being sponsored by Fair Isaac. Sounds like a shill to me.
@rpm773: I agree with you. She has no sex appeal. Now Warren Buffett! That's a man that gets my groin a tingling.
@smythe: I agree. I also have Women & Money, and a lot of her advice is good for the person who knows absolutely nothing about money besides how to spend it on crap they don't need.
I never watch her show though, her voice bothers me.
@t-r0y: Love the Dave. On his talkshow he's a bit better spoken than Orman. And while Orman seems to deal with Yuppies wanting to buy Prada, Ramsey is dealing with families in crisis. Repossessions, foreclosure, lost jobs. And in today's economic climate I'd take the advice of someone who's been offering advice on how to get out of debt for 20 years than someone who's been pushing stocks for the same amount of time.
Uh, stocks are a good investment vehicle. A 16 month slump doesn't take away from 40+ years of performance. If you want to avoid stocks for the rest of your days, enjoy being poor and constantly losing to inflation.
Those scammy Suze Orman PBS pledge drive infomercial specials should have been the first indicator something is not right with her. PBS, you want to know why I don't give you money? It is because of these infomercial things you put on in place of the stuff I actually watch. Dr. Wayne Dyer and Suze Orman seem more like something you would find on at 3 AM on between Billy Mays and Kevin Trudeau.
@battra92: I don't watch her much at all but from what I've seen she does encourage people to save more in general. While I wouldn't take specific advice from her, encouraging people to save is a good first step.
@Danilo Campos:
Tell me she's wrong, though. If your FICO score is in the shitter you're not getting a loan, on anything. You may not even get a rental.
FICO isn't a product to be consciously chosen or consumed. Everyone has a FICO score, for better or for worse. Pointing out that fact to people who may not otherwise understand is not shilling.
Short answer - yep. She *made* FICO and NOLO. Who had heard of either one before her?
I would never listen to her (or most other investment advisors for that matter) for investment advice, but she's right on the money on personal finance advice, in particular about issues relating to debt.
If you don't itemize nor drive more than 14K miles a year, I don't see how car leasing ISN'T the better option. It's cheaper monthly and, of course, no car has ever risen in value, with the exception of course of the Batmobile. Well, it rose in value, dipped a bit after Val Kilmer drove it, then regained value.
Scurlock's article is insane!
I liked "Maxed Out," but I think he had a crazy moment when he wrote this crap.
He doesn't like her personality, fine. But his only real criticism of her is her recommending stocks and, mainly, dollar cost averaging.
I think he's taken the stock market corrections of late a little too personally against Suze. Dollar cost averaging wasn't invented by Suze, and it's been a widely accepted practice, even in these economic times.
Some people may think Suze's advice is simplistic, and that's fine. Those people have made it past basic personal finance. But the fact is that so many people have no knowledge at all, and her advice is, I find, very practical and common-sense.
If you're gonna rage against common sense, I can't help you.
Dave Ramsey, who on balance seems to give fairly honest advice, hates Suze and pretty much says so on his show.
Their No. 1 difference- Ramsey says to hell w/FICO scores- you shouldn't be in debt in the first place. Suze is all about FICO.
If you're looking for good advice, the television is not the place to look.
If you squint at the pic above, she looks like some jerkoff guy from the 80s.
I voted "better than nothing." Her ongoing "women and money" series seems like a pretty good thing, especially since it's aimed at the gender in charge of 85% of retail spending. So, in other words, her common sense is what drove us into this recession. Suze Orman is evil!