Yes, our pro-consumer bias has its limits. For instance, when a customer service representative tries to help you, don’t respond by telling them to “go back to school,” or by mentioning that your fourth-grade class can “spell better.” Of the tens of thousands of tips you have sent us, this is one of the worst. Do not be this guy.
Here’s the situation: Reader Bryan ordered an item from Adorama’s Amazon store. After the item shipped, he decided to change the shipping instructions so he could pick up his package at the UPS store. Amazon’s policies kept Adorama from changing the instructions on a shipped item, so, after apologizing, Adorama gave Bryan two options: a full refund, or once the item returned undelivered, they could re-ship the item with the right instructions.
Bryan didn’t send us his original request, so we’ll start with Adorama’s response. The writing isn’t the clearest, but the content speaks for itself:
hi!
unfurtunaly this is an Amazon order and we wont be able to have you pick it up. I apologized for the inconvenience this may have caused you.
PAOLA
Adorama customer service
Brian responded:
I don’t see why it being an amazon order changes anything. It’s MY package that I paid for, and paid shipping for. UPS is not able to deliver to my location, all I want is to be able to pick up the package THAT I PAID FOR.
Make it happen, or I’m just returning all of it, and then you’ll be refunding my money.
Right off the bat you can tell Bryan is trouble. “Make it happen?” Tell that to a waitress and you’ll rightly end up with a drink down your shirt. Let’s see how Paola responds:
I apologized for the inconvenience but our contract with Amazon is like that we cant make any changes to the order or have ups hold it for you , if you are unable to be at the address you provide with your order for shipping the order will come back to us and we will give you the money back for the item.
have a nice day!!
PAOLA
Adorama customer service
Paola provided a direct explanation to Bryan’s question. Adorama’s contract with Amazon prevents them from changing the shipping address. Simple enough, but Bryan kept pushing:
Well, I guess you just lost some money. I have NEVER had any issues with getting UPS to hold a package that I have bought from Amazon.
I’m so sorry for the inconvenience maybe you place the order through Amazon and it was ship by another company. I don’t want you to feel like if we don’t appreciated your business but unfurtunaly we can not hold the pack. if the order was place directly from us we wouldn’t have this problem.
again I apologies.
PAOLA
Adorama customer service
Another fairly direct response from Paola, and a way to avoid the problem in the future. Fine.
How Bryan choose to advance his case?
Please learn proper grammar and english. It would make your messages much easier to understand.
At this point, Paola could have stopped responding. The substantive interaction was over. If we were in Paola’s place, we wouldn’t have been able to respond with anything approximating a polite response. And as we’ll see, advancing the conversation doesn’t help anyone, even if the intent is to help an unreasonable customer.
Oh thank you…. For the compliment… am just trying to give you good customer service. at least someone is paying attention to your problem.
PAOLA
Adorama customer service
See, this is what I’m talking about. Re-read your last 2 messages. They are written poorly. “unfurtunaly” is spelled “unfortunately”.
All this poor grammar and spelling lets me know is that the employees at this place are incompetent, and that I would never order anything from you again. No one is paying attention to my problem and I am NOT receiving “good customer service”. If I was receiving “good customer service”, my problem would have already been taken care of when I called yesterday. I can’t believe all this hassle is being put into this situation. All I want to do is pick up my package; this should not be an impossible task.
You fail. I will never order anything from adorama again.
Are you a teacher? All I m trying to do is help you and “unfortunately” you don’t see that you are just looking for mistakes in the grammar. I hope you have a very nice day!
PAOLA
Adorama customer service
Yes. I am a teacher. I teach 4th grade, and they spell better than you
and can complete sentences using proper punctuation. It reflects poorly on you and the company you work for. If you can’t do this, maybe this is the wrong job for you. You are doing NOTHING to help me. If you want to help me, offer to overnight me another camera with no restrictions on the package, so that I can pick it up at the UPS office. Sitting here and arguing with me does nothing to fix the problem.
Today, I will be contacting any management/owners that I can get ahold of and informing them of the awful customer service I’ve received. If you can’t solve the problem and just type gibberish to me, then you are of no use in your current place of employment.
With the respect you deserve let me explain you something. I was trying to assist you since the first time that you call , but you just say that you wanted your money back and started complaining about my grammar instead of telling me that you wanted the item expedited, is very frustrating for me as a customer service representative that is doing her best to assist you, to only get this kind of email in response like if I was one of your students . Am really sorry this is going the way is going, you are the first customer I get that is a “teacher” and act like a student.
If you want the item I will be more than happy to place a new order for you, I will need to charge you for the item again and am supposed to charge you for shipping as well because I don’t see where we mess up with your order we send it to the address that you provide Amazon for shipping. if you will like I can ask my manager as a first time courtesy to give you free shipping. And if you want fell free to contact my manager to complaint about my customer service skills her ext# is 2219 her name is Leah, I am sure she will be happy to listen to you and read our emails….thank you and have a nice day!!!!!!
PAOLA
Adorama customer service
Can we all agree this is a reasonable solution? Paola offered to resend the item, possibly even waive the shipping. And she volunteered her manager’s number and rightly suggested that any third party might find Bryan’s behavior offensive.
So how does Bryan respond to the olive branch?
Wow. I have no clue what any of that says since your sentences are all run-ons and really really long. Go back to school.
The situation deteriorates from there.
I just feel sorry for the kids you teach … You are very disrespectful, maybe my problem can be solve going back to school but in your case you will have to be born again.. Respect others is easy and make others life easier too. Here at Adorama we treat our customers with respect because that’s how they treat us. but that’s not you case. Have a good life.
PAOLA
Adorama customer service
Spend less time telling me to be ‘born again’ and more time studying an English book. Religion is just a crutch for the weak.
Sent from my BlackBerry(r) smartphone with SprintSpeed
Be happy!! Have a nice day!! “teacher”
PAOLA
Adorama customer service
I was happy today until I had to deal with you. And for some reason you decide to bring religion into this. I’m making phone calls right now, doing my best to make sure that you don’t have a job by the end of the day.
Sent from my BlackBerry(r) smartphone with SprintSpeed
Ok she is waiting for your call ext#2219 leah .. bye
PAOLA
Adorama customer service
If you were Bryan, how would you characterize this interaction when you sent it to our tipline? What one point might you seize upon to sensationalize your story?
Okay…. Here’s an awesome email exchange between an adorama.com camera customer service rep and myself. Yeah, I’m an asshole, but this ignorant woman actually suggested that I become “born again”.
All this because they put all kinds of restrictions on MY package which won’t allow me to pick up my package at the UPS office.
Enjoy!
You sure got one thing right, Bryan.
Clearly the exchange could have been handled better by everyone. The telecoms and other large companies use rigid customer service manuals to limit similar debacles. Their customer service is like Plinko: your complaint’s destiny is governed by its fall down a maddening decision tree. Bryan would have been dismissed with a simple: “We cannot accommodate your request at this time. Please be assured, your business is important to us.” We prefer companies where employees can treat us not just as consumers, but as people.
When dealing with any company, always treat customer service representatives as you would want to be treated yourself. The whole Golden Rule thing and all. Not only is it common decency, but it’s the single best way to get exactly you want.
(Photo: paolo màrgari)
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Ah, Bryan. I work customer service both in a store and for the store’s online division. Sadly, Speshul Snoflakes like Bryan don’t worry that the series of tubes might get clogged up with their complaints.
I’m a self-admitted grammar Nazi and even I wouldn’t (I don’t think I even could be THIS rude) to a basically uninvolved third-party. His problem was with the Amazon’s policy (probably even UPS, I work with them everyday and they’re definitely sticklers about shipping to different addresses after receiving packages). Take it up with UPS, not this poor girl.
I applaud consumerist.com for posting idiot customer stories. Obviously, someone is trying to help, with someone who clearly doesn’t understand how nice and prompt the CSR was.
This sounds like a teacher I once had in 4th grade. I wonder?
Did anybody else notice that the photo for this post was taken by a “Paolo” and the CSR in the post was named “Paola”? Coincidence? Married tag team? Conspiracy?!
As someone who works for an amazon subcontractor, we’re unable to change anything about any order we get through amazon, and if you’re too stupid to type in your own address you should’t be calling anyone else stupid.
A lot of my job is actually resolving screwed up addresses and such and I’ll say this guy is definitely an extreme example, but I get more assholes bitching than I do people who appreciate that I’m doing extra work to make sure they get what they ordered.
There should be a comma between the two “really”s in one of his responses. If you’re going to be a dick about grammar to somebody who obviously has learned English as a secondary language, get all of your shit right. She handled this really well and he is a douche bag blaming people that deserve no blame, and expecting the world to be delivered to him when he only paid for a camera.
I thought sure this was going to be about the OMG 16%!111!1 WTFBBQ Icelandic savings accounts.
Not saying Bryan handled this as well as he could have, but it does drive me crazy when a business cannot communicate with any semblance of proper English.
Their correspondences really are pretty pathetic. “unfurtunaly this is an Amazon order and we wont be able to have you pick it up. I apologized for the inconvenience this may have caused you.”
Sure, you get the point of what this person is trying to say, but it looks incredibly unprofessional and childish.
Of course, Bryan also screwed the pooch here with rude and obstinate correspondences of his own. Lose-lose.
Consumerist, I say you start a new site called “Anti-consumerist.” It would be quite entertaining.
Haha, insane. Sadly, that is in fact Amazon.com’s policy with a lot of their sellers.
I highly doubt that Brian is a teacher, teachers don’t typically call people out in every day life. I work in IT, does that mean when the Border Patrol was having computer problems I offered to help?
Bryan’s attitude was wrong from the beginning. By asking her to “make it happen” makes it appear that he is an over-demanding jerk. I think he just wanted to complain and used Paola’s English as a target. Customer service reps are people too, and deserve respect, as do their customers. It is not Paola’s fault that the shipping agreement is the way it is. True, her English is less than stellar, but that’s not the point. Paola did all she could to help him within the boundaries of company policy. If I were the owner, I’d consider pressing harassment charges against Ryan.
What a douche.
Please make this a weekly feature. Pretty please?
PS: Dear Bryan, stop breathing. Thanks!
I’ve pruchased many things from Adorama and can say they have great customer service, fast shipping and good prices. I don’t blame Paola at all as I have a lot of trouble tolerating assholes. She handled it a lot better than I would have, then again, I’m not a CSR(Thank god).
Wow, Bryan, maybe you should try that ‘born again’ thing … can’t be much worse than what you have right now.
Bryan really has no skills that would indicate to me that he is a teacher of any stripe that I would want interacting with my children. Some of the most important qualities of a teacher should be patience and understanding.
If Bryan had patience, he could’ve at least bitten his tongue when dealing with Paola who, despite his treatment, continued to offer her assistance with his issue, even if it was just “because it’s her job.”
If he had a sense of understanding, he would sympathize with her that at best, she’s merely a pawn in a large company that requires her to adhere to a rulebook and her managers’ decisions.
It is also evident that he NEVER made clear his request that another package be sent out in place of the first.
In my opinion, Adorama is truly going above and beyond their duties here, and since Bryan has already determined the outcome (that he’ll never shop there again), there is no need to grant him free shipping on the replacement. Refund his money less shipping, and send him on his merry way as a reward for his belligerence.
The CS rep handled this jerk pretty well. Considering English probably isn’t her first language, I’d say her English is pretty good too.
I’ve used Adorama in the past and have always been happy with them. This reinforces my belief that they are reputable company and I will continue to patronize their business.
The way you treat people in these kinds of situations equals the kind of person that you are. And in this case, Bryan is a piece of shit. Die in a fire, buddy.
Adorama is generally pretty awesome. Not quite as awesome as BHphoto, but close. I hope her supervisor gave the guy an earful when he called.
Poor Paola! She really was doing her best. I’m sure she had steam coming out her ears toward the end and even though she faltered, she still did pretty darned well, all things considered. I hope her employers appreciate that! Bryan acted like a fool, but clearly he didn’t realize that. He didn’t understand the policy and, in truth, her grammatical errors did make that hard to grasp at first. If one were looking with clear, level headed detachment (as we are) then it is easy to discern. However, if one were pissed about not getting their camera and having to deal with customer service through an email exchange I can see someone getting so upset as to really not get the message. Had he calmed himself he might have been able to get it. Having been in customer service (and at many times dealing with people of lesser intelligence) I found it very very important to make sure people understand by speaking clearly and using unambiguous language. Example: for one person I had to exchange the words “economically feasible” to “cheap enough” in order for them to get it. Their response? “Thank you, dems more my words.” It goes both ways.
The name sounds Asian to me, as do the nuances in the interchange. I had absolutely no problem understanding everything the CSR was saying, but I deal with Asians on a daily basis… I could see someone misunderstanding parts, but the religion bit? Wow. That customer was totally out of line, amazing job on Paola’s part to remain composed in dealing with that dick as long as they did.
Bryan deserves a particularly large amount of ire and derision for this. For being the kind of bratty customer who encourages corporations to draft blatantly anti-consumerist policies to protect themselves; for being the kind of atheist who gives other atheists a bad name and keeps them from being respected and taken seriously; and for giving a bad name to Bryans and Brians everywhere.
The International Association of Bryans and Brians has issued an official censure to this Bryan, and his membership in the IABB has been permanently revoked. An associate will arrive shortly to confiscate his membership card, engraved ring and monogrammed towels.
What a jerk.
And to all the commenters who suspect that English was Paola’s second-language, please read her name again. It’s clearly Portuegese, which means she’s either Brazilian or…well…Portuegese (but probably Brazilian).
I thought I’d clear that up. Cheers.
Underpaid and grouchy. Gogo teachers of the USA.
I was also a teacher, and, if you want to get all prescriptivist about it, I’d like to note that Bryan had numerous errors in his e-mails (the first paragraph of his first reply alone is full of preposition errors). As a teacher I also know how crazy people can get over what they think you should do for them and far away from reality that can be. I also know the attractive power of honey versus vinegar or, in 4th grade terms, Jolly Ranchers versus sitting in the desk all the way in the front of the room. It’s a shame that Bryan can’t see things that way.
Also, what the heck is a 4th grade teacher doing with a Blackberry?
Does this guy not know that you can call your local delivery center/warehouse and ask them to let you pick it up there? I pick stuff up all the time without permission from the shipper and all they require is a photo ID with the address matching the delivery location.
Kind of amused that guy thought “born again” necessarily meant religion. His heckles are clearly up anyway, defensive mode. I think she was just saying he was old.
Bryan, you probably thought you were being extremely clever and funny at the time, but the fact is you are a douchebag. And her spelling may be poor (obviously not a native English speaker) but any reasonably literate person can still understand what she is communicating. If you had trouble, you’re the idiot.
That guy was obviously looking for a fight from the moment he sent his first email. Working in customer service you quickly learn that people like that don’t want a solution, they just want someone to beat up on. Usually because they are too weak and emotionally out of touch to realize there are better ways to work through your negative emotions. He sounds like he has the emotional intelligence of a 4th grader.
Love the “born again” comment and it was so obviously about him being a LIFE FAIL rather than religiously motivated.
Did it not occur to Bryan to call UPS? I missed a package delivery for something that I needed to get immediately. Instead of having it sent back to the sender (who wasn’t a company, although that shouldn’t matter), I just called UPS customer service, got the number of my local distribution center, and drove out there to pick it up.
Once UPS has it, you should be able to use the tracking information to call UPS and find a way to get your package. Being an asshole to a CSR over a rule she can’t control is just…wtf.
I kind of feel bad for that guys students…
@Atsumi: I had a psycho teacher like that once. Boy was that fun. Half of the class was depressed and flunking, by the end of semester.
I’m a lot more inclined to think of Brian as the stupid one rather than Paola. Paola couldn’t spell one word, but her grammar is perfect if she were speaking Spanish. It looks as if she was using an electronic translator to get the message across better. I’d wager that if she isn’t actually located in another country, then she is an immigrant trying her best to utilize her native vocabulary in her current vocation.
Brian?
Lemme address Brian.
First of all. My Mom is a teacher. My Fiancee’s Father is a teacher. My Aunt is a teacher. Most of my Mom’s friends are teachers. I have grown up around hundreds of teachers from different grades and different styles of teaching and Bryan is not only the most arrogant that I’ve encountered, but if he is incapable of understanding her emails, then I suspect he is probably the stupidest as well, so much so that I doubt he is actually a teacher.
I work Customer service, and I do my job well. She did too. Just because you are too incompetent to place your order correctly the first time, or barring that, to check the companies policies to see if what you want is even possible before placing the order, you imply that it was HER who was stupid and not you?
Even if your address is undeliverable (Where the fuck do you live, in a Unibomber shack in the woods?) that sounds sketchy. I wouldn’t do it even if I could have, were I in their position, it sounds like the kind of bullshit I used to go through when people were trying to scam us to get free products.
Bryan, fuck you. You aren’t entitled to shit. Buying a service or a product only means that you have the economic means to do so, it doesn’t mean anyone owes you a Goddamned thing you arrogant piece of shit. If you go into a store and buy a cheeseburger, they owe you a fucking cheeseburger, not half an hour of their time arguing with you over how to make it. What the fuck do you know? You couldn’t even understand her emails, so you must not be able to work with children very well, I’ve READ what they write and it is generally for more confusing than anythign she wrote. So you can’t even do your own job properly and you have the nerve to criticize how others do theirs, as if you know better than they do?
Seriously, you and of the baby-boomer spawn like you who think they deserve the world on a platter need to go fuck yourselves. I deal with people like you every day, and usually we just act nicely to your face and talk shit on you behind your back. Nobody likes you, and if you have any friends, it is probably only because they are amused by how much of an asshole you are, and the novelty of that wears off quickly. You probably couldn’t handle yourself in a fight if your life depended on it, but you act aggressively and rudely towards others.
If you do any one thing to make the world a better place, I recommend you kill yourself. We will all be much better off without you.
Bryan, I truly hope you learn to be a more respectful, productive member of society in the future.
First, “born again” is not a religious comment. Because you are too concerned with yourself to try to understand what other people are saying, you missed the point that you obviously aren’t going to learn manners in this lifetime.
Second, your escalating demands were completely unreasonable. You screwed up, the company offered their assistance, you rebuffed it.
Third, it’s really disgusting how self-assured you are that you were right here. Hopefully this public criticism will set you straight.
Cheers,
Chris
THe correct way to handle this is to leave a note on your door for UPS saying, please return my package to the warehouse so that I may pick it up.
This way credit card scammers can’t simply have the package rerouted there without actually going to your residence and UPS is always more then happy to oblige. Use soem common sense and avoid this whole problem!
I am an avid reader of this site, and I think it’s great that you remind readers that you shouldn’t be a jerk even if a company has “wronged” you. You’ll always get better customer service by being considerate and respectful, if persistent.
Sometimes this site takes the customer’s side when the customer could possibly have handled the situation in a better manner. I’m glad this was not such a case.
Usually, just so I remember what it’s like to be a CSR, I read [notalwaysright.com] to remember how NOT to be a consumer.
OK, Bryan whoever you are I hope you never “teach” kids again. You sound like a royal douche bag.
This is the first time I’ve made a comment on this site, but after reading this story I just had to. Brian is completely and totally in the wrong here. His smug and arrogant attitude is disgusting, and his inability to understand the communication from the customer service agent is puzzling. Personally, I thought that the customer service agent was understandable.
And like the rest of you, I did not see any religious subtext in her “born again” comment – I interpreted it as saying that Brian is such a terrible person, that the only way he could ever fix his personality problems would be to start his life over from the very beginning. I completely agree.
If Brian is such a smart and talented individual, how come he can’t comprehend the customer service e-mails? Everybody else here on the website can. How could he derive a religious reference from her e-mail, even though it’s clear it was not a religious attack at all?
I want to be perfectly clear. Brian very clearly iis (in his own words, mind you) an “asshole” and I feel sorry for everyone that has ever had the misfortune of ever coming into contact with him.
Good for Paola. Just because you are a potential customer, that is not a license to be a complete ass like Bryan seems to be. As the kids say nowadays, Paola FTW, Bryan FAIL! :p
Wow, someone just needs to slap this guy in the face. I’d hate to say something like that, but this guy has no idea how to even be humane to another person.
Anyways, I’m no english expert myself, but shouldn’t there be a comma between the two ‘really’ instances in this sentence?
“Wow. I have no clue what any of that says since your sentences are all run-ons and really really long. Go back to school.”
*shrug*
@Doublenix:
Actually, shouldn’t it read:
“Wow. I have no clue what any of that says since your sentences are all run-ons and are really, really long. Go back to school.”
+1 to the manager if they tell him bluntly “sir you are a complete jagoff. My employee did their best to explain the policy. You were rude and my employee did not have to suffer your abuse. It’s a shame that there is no one for her to complain to about your lack of manners and rudeness. Would that be your wife? or perhaps your parents? If you wish to take your business elsewhere, we would be pleased. Fuck off and have a shitty day.”
but of course they won’t.
I’m very confused. If you’re not home for a package don’t you just go the UPS Store by you after the truck gets back? I think they make 3 attempts and then hold the package for 5 days in their warehouse. Additionally, you can call them and they’ll take it off the truck so you can pick it up the next day.
@jnrcorp: Yeah, I was wondering about that too…
Being a call center manager and former CSR, I would have to say that the CSR should have quit while she was ahead. She expended too much energy reprimanding someone who was too busy being superior to believe for even a moment that he might be acting like a jack ass.
She needed to think a little more “outside the box” and try to figure out a way to get the customer satisfied, but he was so far up on his soap box that wouldn’t have recognized a willingness to assist if it slapped him in the face.
@SashiCallisto:Change her ”nickname” and pretend being someone else, could have helped.
I pulled this stunt once. In person. By taking off my glasses. I’m still ROFL with how the guy bought it.
Here’s my thought. Obviously Bryan was on a rampage and setting out to make life hard for this CSR. That means doing everything he could to get her fired, including sending the e-mails here in hopes of humiliating her in public. I hope that someone at the company that she works for has been notified to this post, and been made aware of the comments people are making.
I’d hate to think this woman’s job is in danger as a result of this guy’s probably repeated and energetic complaints. She seems pretty confident that her manager will support her, but sometimes things like this can translate up the chain of command without all the right context.
Hopefully, someone at the company is reading all the comments and realizing that there’s a 100 to 1 ratio of people that think the CSR was good to bad.
Obviously both parties made several mistakes here, but I got a quite different impression from the conversation than our narrator.
When the narrator explained the situation it was crisp and easy to understand, but in the actual correspondence I did not see PAOLA clearly explaining the customer’s options.
I think that if PAOLA had simply said: “We cannot have it shipped to your house, but we can either refund you fully or ship it again to a new address you provide” the situation would have dissolved in an instant. But PAOLA did not take the time to explain the options and limitations that her company provides, or to write complete and intelligible sentences.
Younger people such as myself are used to bad spelling and grammer, but many older people legitimatey cannot understand it. When they see a misspelled word they don’t necessarily know what is meant.
Grammer is not some useless law thrown over language to make it harder to learn, it is a pattern that helps us alternately accentuate or mask our meanings in order to communicate as effectively and clearly as possible.
@WilsonVitulus: Learn to spell yourself first. Then criticize. ”Grammer” does not exist as a word in English.
I think he is probably a teacher’s aide in a 4th grade special needs class. Sort of the smartest of the slow kids kind of guy who thinks he can call himself a teacher. He is clearly one of the lucky teachers who doesn’t have a class full of ESL students who have to struggle to learn two languages at the same time. No matter what he thought of the CSR’s intelligence, she was at least smarter than him in the fact that she learned a second language well enough to work customer service by phone and email. She is probably handling bi-lingual customers as well, so if she misses some basic grammar rules in the process then I’ll let her slide on that. I promise you that “bryan” is not the kind of customer that anybody wants to have doing business with them.
I think by born again, she meant he was just such an asshole he couldn’t change, and literally would have to start over.
@marcus1060: Yes, I do not think she was referring to religion what so ever. To me, it seemed she was referring that her problem can be corrected through more education, but in his case, he was hopeless and his manner could not improve in his lifetime, but rather have to re-start from day one. (how’s my grammar?)
Long time reader, first time poster.
I just want to say to you Brian/Bryan(your name changed halfway through the article but who gives a crap), that not only are you an awful human being, I disagree with that customer rep.
I hope you die and never come back
The fact that you feel accomplished with your exchange with that customer rep only shows your a worthless human being. I can imagine you in your younger years throwing tantrums so mommy would bring your chocolate glass of YooHoo in the living room so you can sip and play SNES at the same time.
We’ll refund your order, send you a new one for free, close the shop and have the manager shot. Would that be satisfactory?