Microsoft: Replace Your XBOX 360? "Sorry, We Can't Help You. Buy All Of Your Content A Second Time"

Reader Mac’s XBOX 360 was out of warranty when it broke, so he decided to buy a new one thinking he could just transfer his old hard drive to the new XBOX. Sadly, no matter what he tries he can’t get his content to work properly on the new machine. He called Microsoft to see if they could help him out (after all they do this sort of transfer all the time for people whose boxes are replaced under warranty), but Microsoft’s only answer was “buy all your content a second time.”

Hi guys, not sure if you’re interested in putting this sort of thing on your site anymore, but I’ve had my own problems with Microsoft, the 360 and their support.

In a sentence, I called their support after replacing my busted 360, and their response to my question as to why I can’t access most of my content either online or offline from my old hard drive anymore was “Can’t help you, sorry. Buy all of the content a second time.”

Now here’s the long version:
I was kindly greeted by Alex, the automated system guy (I’ve never seen any company give theirs a name), then transferred over to a man who I believe went by the name “Jeeves” (at least that’s what it sounded like to me through the accent). After a bit of friendly banter and him asking me for a whole bunch of different information, I explained to him the following situation of which I will attempt to detail here in as few words as possible:
– My launch 360 broke about a year and a half ago, but it wasn’t under warranty, so I cracked it open and fixed it, making the new extended 3-year “three red ring” warranty void.

- My launch 360 red ringed just a little while ago.

- I decide to purchase a new console, figuring I’d like the fresh warranty and the new (instead of refurbished) console, and I’d just put my old hard drive in the new console and things should work alright.
– Even after logging into Live, I can’t access the full games that I’d purchased over Live, so I call Microsoft’s Xbox support line, expecting someone to be friendly and help me with my problem. While they were friendly, the only solution I was offered was to buy all of my content a second time. Yes, they instructed me to buy the content AGAIN.
I promptly explained to them that they’ll transfer licenses between the broken and refurb consoles they send out, so I wondered why they couldn’t help me. I could prove that the consoles were both mine in whatever way they wanted, verify hard drive serial numbers, give them receipts, Xbox Live account information, etc… And I got nothing other than the exact same line about not being allowed by publishers to transfer licenses, and that they have to contact them about transferring licenses and get the publisher’s approval for each game.
Then I asked to be elevated, and “Jeeves” politely transferred me to his supervisor, Ian. I spoke with Ian briefly and he gave me the same response: “Buy the content again.” To his credit, he did get me to attempt some other things to at least get my content working when I’m online, but he ultimately said it’s not up to him.
It’s very frustrating, seeing as I’ve gifted consoles to friends, bought a launch 360, and even replaced my 360 when it broke, and now this is the sort of awesome customer service I get for being a dedicated 360 user.

I’ll probably end up selling my two 360s and accessories, and buying something else with the money I get from it. This experience with Microsoft’s DRM has absolutely put me off of any of their products in the future, game-related or not.

- Mac

Any XBOX 360 experts have better advice for Mac than Microsoft did? Or does he really have to buy his content a second time?

(Photo: Milkham )

Comments

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  1. CarMatchPro says:

    The boys at SEOhollywood…will have a hey day with that.
    [www.ustream.tv]

  2. dualityshift says:

    I’ve been in this very situation. Their DRM is broken and they have no real intention on fixing it. Why should they? Fixing it costs them money, and makes them less money.

    I sent letters to the execs at Microsoft, after spending several sessions on the phone with Max and his tech support cohorts. The official statement I received was that “Microsoft’s content is attached to the console and gamertag. Upgrading your console is YOUR choice, and the content must be purchased again.” I received zero response from my emails.

    The MS execs do not care, because they do not have to. They own the only consumer OS for PCs (You can argue Linux, however, it’s not that widely adopted, yet.) They own the only ‘real’ office productivity suite. Unfortunately it is the consumer that gave them this power.

    My solution was to prohibit the purchase of ANY online content from Microsoft. Why buy something that’s already broken?

  3. WBDFQ says:

    MS’s DRM needs fixed NOW!!!

  4. Scatter says:

    This is the reason why I avoid downloadable content like the plague. Sure I can download games from Steam but what happens when Steam goes away. The day that they stop making full versions of games available for purchase in a store with a retail box is the day I stop buying games.

  5. Buran says:

    I honestly don’t understand why people keep buying these things; this is not to blame the OP, but I am genuinely baffled. After the massive numbers of problem reports, wouldn’t it make more sense to avoid the hardware that constantly breaks and the bad support behind it that manages to constantly screw things up … and just go with something far more reliable (read: a competitor’s system) that does the same job?

  6. Asvetic says:

    I’ve given up on Microsoft and the Xbox360… I had my 2nd RROD and I’m throwing in the towel. Sony here I come! I hope the PS3 won’t disappoint me like the 360 has.

  7. outinthedark says:

    First I don’t believe your content does not work while you are signed onto Live with the account that bought the content. Other than that sounds like what I went through.

    I had the same deal where my console RROD and I bought/upgraded to a new console. I did however actually send my console in for repairs but other than that our stories are the same.

    It took me 6 months for them to transfer my licenses so you are in for a hard fought battle.

    Only thing I can suggest is to continually call and continue to escalate the tickets.

    Took me since last September about 25 individual tickets escalated and about 60+ hours on the phone. Only about 10% of those reached tier 3. The last time that was successful I think they were just tired of me and approved the transfer. You just have to be persistent.

    Also don’t try e-mail support that cannot do anything.

    Their terms and conditions are very clear. It is quite a stand they take with their ridiculous DRM but never the less it can be changed. Just continue to call and jump right over the first tier reps as they are about as useful as a bag of bricks.

  8. cybercjh says:

    With all the problems people are having w/ the XBOX, why do people keep buying them? You know what would be great? The government should mandate that companies post their customer satisfaction rating on their products. That would prompt Microsoft to provide better service. A sticker that says, “THIS COMPANY SCORED A 3 OUT OF 10 IN CUSTOMER SATISFACTION” would do wonders.

  9. Buran says:

    @Asvetic: Bingo. That’s just what I mean!

  10. evslin says:

    @Buran: The problem is that one of the key points in choosing which system to go with is what games are available – the competitor’s system doesn’t necessarily do “the same job”. I couldn’t play Lost Odyssey on the PS3, for example.

  11. Buran says:

    @dualityshift: You forgot MacOS, iWork, and OpenOffice. MS isn’t the monopoly it once was.

  12. His first console was a launch unit so he really had no idea (at first) that they were crap. Since it broke and it wasn’t the RROD and he opened it to fix it himself, the only thing he could do is buy a new one. It’s gonna suck for him but I’d say he should buy all his content again too. I have an Xbox 360 that’s just over a year old with no problems but I avoid buying online content so I don’t have to deal with this. My wife bought Ms. Pacman but that’s seriously the most downloadable content we’ve paid for because frankly, shit happens.

  13. Buran says:

    @evslin: So what’s wrong with all the stuff that DOES run on other systems? What about multiplatform software? Either deal with your repeatedly-dying MS piece of junk that will run nothing at all after it dies yet again, or learn to like the competition’s choices. I’m sure they’ve got plenty to offer.

  14. sleepwalkers says:

    @outinthedark: OP here (Mac). Yeah, I couldn’t believe that my content didn’t work even when signed into Live. Even though I thought being signed into Live and my gamertag let me access my content, I can’t play my XBLA games (but all of my Rock Band DLC works perfectly).
    The reps that were helping me were baffled, as well. The “Games Library” part of Dashboard will act as though the games are full versions (showing my achievements and such), but when I launch the game, it acts as though it’s still a trial version. It’s very strange.

  15. Techguy1138 says:

    @dualityshift:

    You misunderstand. The DRM is not broken and is working exactly as intended.

    DRM prevents you from copying your stuff to other places be it your or elsewhere. From the MS perspective the fact that you can not copy your content shows that DRM is working perfectly.

  16. Asvetic says:

    @evslin: There might be a few more exclusive titles available for the X360, but it’s not as many as people assume. A lot of it is marketing. Instead of putting their money into more customer service and a better product, Microsoft spends it on marketing efforts. Essentially covering up the negatives and pushing the exclusives.

    The PS3 has just as many exclusive titles and they both share a lot of popular titles. There are games of all genre’s on both systems.

    There are pros and cons for both systems. I made my choice and went with the X360. I had fun, but the cons are starting to show their big heads… time to move on.

  17. mergatroy6 says:

    a guy named “Mac” is having trouble with his Microsoft product? I smell a potential rat.

    X-Box really needs to sort out their account transfer problems. How many articles have to pop up on the internet before they fix it?

  18. sunmark007 says:

    A couple of things to try

    1. delete every thing you downloaded and go to your account download history(under the xbox live marketplace blade under account management) and re download it. This might make it work on xbox live but until Microsoft fixes the problem(which they have stated they are working on a program to transfer the link of xbox content from one xbox to another)

    2. make sure it is not your new 360 by trying a friends harddrive on your console.

    3. make sure that it is not your harddrive that is going crazy by trying it on another console.

  19. sleepwalkers says:

    OP here. Yeah, I realize now it’s very much a “buyer beware” situation with both the 360 and XBL DLC. I just think it’s a shining example of the terrible DRM scheme and terrible handling of it on Microsoft’s part. I had a launch 360 and ended up buying a fair amount of XBLA stuff before the first stories of terrible DRM really started to emerge. It sucked, but I really just hoped that Microsoft would be able to fix it. Unfortunately, they didn’t.
    I didn’t want to seem too biased in what I said or too outraged and yell “WHY CAN’T YOU DO WHAT I WANT, MICROSOFT?” but I did want to a) express my discontent and frustration at everything involved, b) let other 360 owners know that if they’re out of warranty or it’s void, *DO NOT* replace the console yourself, instead pay for the refurb they give you (with the inferior warranty, I believe) if you want to guarantee access to your XBL DLC.

  20. dualityshift says:

    @Buran: You forgot MacOS, iWork, and OpenOffice. MS isn’t the monopoly it once was.

    Until Intel Macs, Microsoft pretty much had the Monopoly. I also specified the PC market.

  21. dualityshift says:

    @mergatroy6: X-Box really needs to sort out their account transfer problems. How many articles have to pop up on the internet before they fix it?

    Not until it’s legislated, or they lose enough market share.

  22. Here_we_go says:

    @outinthedark:

    Exactly. I don’t believe that his content doesn’t work while he is online either. I have had three different 360’s and my content always works online no matter what Xbox it was bought under. This also works with all my friends.

    @Buran:

    I have all three consoles from this generation and I wil say the 360’s game line up is better than the PS3’s. Also, did you just tell him to learn to like the competition’s choices?

  23. Rogue Justice says:

    Thats really weird. I ran into a similar problem (except the problem with my 360 was that it wouldn’t read discs anymore). I decided that instead of paying $100 to get it fixed, not have it for 3-4 weeks, and get a crappy refurb that I would just buy the arcade version. I just put the hard drive from my old Xbox in it and it works fine. I haven’t had any problems with any of my downloadable content.

  24. sleze69 says:

    FYI – If you delete a purchased wii rom (like SMB), you can redownload it no problem.

  25. I am in the same situation… my box broke in June 2007 and I took it to a local repair shop to have it fixed. The extended warranty was announced 3 weeks later. Of course, the box crapped out completely in January, so I replaced it.

    I spent two hours on the phone with Live customer service on Saturday to have them tell me there is nothing that they will do. The supervisor I spoke with refused to escalate it further, claiming that it will not be reviewed and will automatically kick back. I have approximately $120 of downloaded content I cannot access when I’m not connected to Live (or when Live is down).

    They are currently transferring the licenses for people who had their boxes replaced through the extended warranty process. They will not, however, transfer the licenses for people whose boxes were “tampered.”

    Mr. Kevin R. Johnson, President of Platforms and Services Division will be getting a certified letter from me next week.

  26. sleepwalkers says:

    @mergatroy6: I know, I know. It seems awfully suscpicious that a kid named “Mac” has problems with Microsoft.
    But my name seriously is Mac, short for Mackenzie. I attempted to write this without bias, as I have nothing inherently against Microsoft.

  27. FLConsumer says:

    This isn’t just an MS thing — it’s a DRM problem. With many of the current DRM schemes, you’re at the mercy of the company issuing the DRM license. Unfortunately most companies which use DRM are large behemoths with very limited minds when it comes to how their products are used. MSN Music comes to mind.

    This is one of the major reasons I run bootleg versions of XP despite having legal licenses for it. When I’m on the road, I can’t afford to suddenly have a DRM (Windows Activation/Genuine DISadvantage) pop up and prevent me from using my laptop. In some cases, I’m nowhere near a phone or internet connection and wouldn’t be for a few days. In other cases, the environment I’m in is so loud that you can forget about trying to get the phone rep to understand what you’re saying, let alone hearing the rep. I appreciate the company’s desire to reduce piracy, but that could be better-accomplished by making a product worth buying. I think it’d be a fair assumption to say there’s more legal (purchased) versions of OS X running on Macs than there are of Windows on PCs, even when you look at it in terms of percentages, and I don’t believe Apple uses the draconian Activation schemes.

  28. awolcfh5150 says:

    I’ve got all 3 of the current systems and the 360 is now in the midst of the RROD. I’m hesitant to contact Microsoft because of the issues they’ve had in even returning a busted system. I love the PS3! I use it for gaming, Blu-Ray, and even web surfing if a group of friends are over. That machine is killer and I got mine on the release date. Give MS the boot and go with Sony. No, there isn’t a guarantee that your system won’t have problems, but when comparing the 360 to the PS3, Sony wins hands down IMO.

  29. DJC says:

    Do you guys read the consumerist?
    Past article:
    [consumerist.com]

  30. ViperBorg says:

    Dude, that’s horseshit. I had the same problem after I got my 360 back from being serviced. After being a complete ass to them, they refunded me ALL my spent Microsoft points so I can buy them again. Call them back, and be a hardass if you need to.

    Microsoft and Sprint are the only 2 companies that I need to be a jerk to. Everyone else, politeness and logic works just fine.

  31. adamsummers says:

    I finally got my DRM licenses transferred after 6 months filled with BBB reports, written letters, EECBs, and various calls to customer support. Franky, everyone at MS can blow me. I’ve pretty much given up on my 360.

  32. outinthedark says:

    @DJC: Did you read the first comment?

  33. evenkevin says:

    @Buran: The multiplatform software is still platform specific, i.e. Call of Duty 4 for the xbox360 isn’t going to run on the PS3. You’d have to buy another copy of Call of Duty 4 to do so. If you like the games that are out for the 360 and all the people you play online games with are on the 360, then you stick with the 360.

    I had a problem with one arcade game when I changed 360 systems (same HDD): Streets of Rage 2. It still showed up in my games library, but was only the demo. Even if I wanted to repurchase the game, the system said I had already bought it, so I couldn’t use points on it again. I went through 3 tiers of horribly scripted MS “support,” and 3 weeks later they refunded me the 400 points spent on the game.

  34. Buran says:

    @evenkevin: Well, apparently you have to buy it all over again so why not just buy it for something that won’t break on you all over again?

  35. Buran says:

    @Here_we_go: I did, because the alternative is just going to be more of the same from a company that doesn’t give a shit about you and will never give a shit about you. The competition doesn’t sell failing junk, now does it?

  36. evslin says:

    @Buran: Hey if you’re interested in sports games and shooters that get released on multiple platforms, go right ahead. That’s not my bag though, and I’m not going to throw down hundreds of dollars just to “learn to like” something else when I’ve already given somebody else a stack of cash to play stuff I already do like.

    Raising hell with the company is a better solution for me – with the game developers and console manufacturers alike.

  37. lemur says:

    The first means of fighting back against DRM is to avoid buying DRM-infected products. However, sometimes we’re stuck with such products. Still, there is a way to fight.

    When the Mass Effect controversy happened, it occurred to me (and to other people too) that the companies perceive DRM as a means to improve their bottom line. Basically, they estimate that the money recovered through DRM is greater than the cost of DRM. Part of the costs of DRM is the support that must be provided to users who have a problem with DRM. So one way to fight DRM after the fact is to ensure that we cost more in support. We can call often with DRM-related questions or issues, pretend to be dense, make them repeat their instructions 10 times over, slow down the conversation, etc. Of course, there’s a cost to us in terms of time wasted on the phone but if we are not willing to bear that cost, we are ensuring the survival of DRM.

  38. UESC says:

    I had the same issue. my launch 360 crapped out on me in June 2006, since it was out of warranty, I bought an elite instead, and MS refused to refund my points. after 2 months of fighting back and forth, i gave up. I still can’t play my content offline, and i’ve lost access to several games because they were bought with another account. (the account is on my current 360, so i have to log in in order to get it to work)

    Also, I just found this link which might help. MS postponed the spring update to unroll a DRM fix.

    [next-gen.biz]

  39. jerros says:

    The guys who head up Xbox360 support are typically a few fries short of a happy meal if you get my drift. However when microsoft transfers data at their offices they are more than likely connecting the two hard drives up and transfering the data. This is not something that they are likely to have set up for online backup/data transfer.

    However your not fully out of luck. There is a data transfer kit, this cable either came with the 360 Elites or it was a seperate purchase. If you can locate one of these kits & get a working xbox360 that your origional hard drive has on it you can follow these instructions to copy the data over (1 time only) [www.xbox.com]

    If you call MS and ask them about the data transfer kit you might get someone who can help you out. You’ll still need to track down a friend, game store owner, or enemy who will let you borrow their 360 for a few hours so you can actually transfer the data though.

  40. evenkevin says:

    @Buran: The OP was told he has to repurchase downloadable media, the disc media still works fine. Also, his situation appears to be unique, most people can still access their previously downloaded media. Also, the most frequent problem is the red rings, which MS has given a 3 year warranty, so unless you’ve tinkered with your machine, you get it fixed for free. Though it can be a pain.

  41. @Buran: I’ll merely repeat EXACTLY what I’ve posted prior and prior and prior in every other post about X360 owners suffering problems. There are TWO other competing platforms out there. Three if you count the PC (if you’ve got that kind of money). People know the thing is bound to fail sooner or later. Move on to another platform.

  42. @Asvetic: Finally! Good man.

  43. jerros says:

    Correcton to my last post. It appears that the data transfer kit MS has connects up to the origional hard drive with out the need for your origional system to be functional.

    There are some warnings though.

    “Downloaded content that is purchased through Xbox Live is licensed to both your Xbox 360 and your Gamertag. The license does not switch with the transfer. If you have purchased an Elite and are swapping the content to the new hard drive for use on a new console, you won’t be able to access purchased videos, games, themes, or pics without being signed into Xbox Live. If you’re just upgrading your hard drive and are retaining the use of your original Xbox 360, your licenses will remain intact. Movie rentals will not transfer at all.”

    You can check out a review on the kit here if you want more detailed information: [gameinvasion.comcast.net]

  44. @Here_we_go: Don’t matter how good the games are if you can’t play them… Mass Effect, good game. Play it on the PC. Guitar Hero III, how about that PS3 and PC? Practically every game on the 360 aside from Halo 3 and some other third party games end up on the PC and PS3 sooner or later.

    @Buran: Exactly. Plus sell some of your old games to put forth credit since apparently your not getting it back.

    @Buran: 33% and counting (though my numbers based on polls done here on Consumerist and Kotaku put those numbers at roughly around 50.9% to be honest) is kinda difficult to beat.

  45. Ex_EA_Slave says:

    Do your research before stoking the troll boys, Consumerist. The DRM issue has already been solved and will be fixed next month. Here’s a quote from this article, [www.next-gen.biz]

    There have been some high profile complaints on the web about how difficult it is to transfer things like XBLA game licenses to replacement 360s in the wake of an under warranty hardware failure. Would these changes to DRM policy address these issues, letting people who have experienced such failure re-license their purchases on their new Xbox so they don’t have to be connected to Live to play? Are there any other sorts of changes to DRM policy being made here that would affect the end-user experience?

    Yes, this new tool will officially launch next month on Xbox.com and will allow you to be able to consolidate these licenses onto one box so you can access things like Xbox LIVE Arcade games and TV show you have downloaded even if you are not online. Because this involved allowing users to re-download licenses for content that belongs to our partners it has taken some time to work out the agreements with them to allow this, but we have heard the concerns from folks about DRM and are happy to announce that everything is nearly in place to roll this out in June.

  46. thefncrow says:

    @ViperBorg: Unfortunately, that probably won’t work for him. Microsoft will transfer the licenses on consoles they change out because they have a record of doing so. Here, they don’t have a record that the other console isn’t still in use, and so they won’t deauthorize that console in order to authorize the new one. The reason is that the authorization that exists, for offline use, could mean that he’s sold off his old 360, and that the new owner is using that content offline with copies of the downloaded content with the original DRM authorization on it.

    As for fixing it? Press Microsoft, and you might get somewhere, but the real key will be coming soon. Check out this interview on Next-Gen with the Xbox Live GM Marc Whitten. If you read into it, it says that, rather than releasing a spring dashboard update, as they usually do, they’ll instead be releasing a DRM tool that will allow you to migrate your existing content. For those too lazy to go over there, I’ll quote the relevant portion(first part is the interviewer, the second part is Whitten):

    There have been some high profile complaints on the web about how difficult it is to transfer things like XBLA game licenses to replacement 360s in the wake of an under warranty hardware failure. Would these changes to DRM policy address these issues, letting people who have experienced such failure re-license their purchases on their new Xbox so they don’t have to be connected to Live to play? Are there any other sorts of changes to DRM policy being made here that would affect the end-user experience?

    Yes, this new tool will officially launch next month on Xbox.com and will allow you to be able to consolidate these licenses onto one box so you can access things like Xbox LIVE Arcade games and TV show you have downloaded even if you are not online. Because this involved allowing users to re-download licenses for content that belongs to our partners it has taken some time to work out the agreements with them to allow this, but we have heard the concerns from folks about DRM and are happy to announce that everything is nearly in place to roll this out in June.

    So, if you can’t get them to do it for you, you might be able to fix it yourself soon, once the DRM tool launches.

  47. adamsummers says:

    I’ll believe in this DRM tool when I see it. Microsoft has been “looking into this DRM issue” for years, and frankly I don’t trust in them to be able to create a tool that won’t be buggy and a pain in the ass to use.

  48. MonkeyMonk says:

    I’ve never had a problem with DRM and don’t ever expect to have a problem. My solution is simple:

    Don’t buy products with DRM. Nothing. If nobody bought products that contained DRM we would see a hell of a lot less DRM.

  49. uncle_fluffy says:

    FWIW, my 360 RRODed and the replacement process went smoothly, no issues, and all my video content and XBLA games work fine.

    What’s interesting is that this guy saved them money by paying for a new console instead of getting it replaced, and this is how they thank him. Nice.

  50. RedSonSuperDave says:

    This is nearly the exact issue that got me to become a Consumerist commenter in the first place. I, too, had the 3RLOD with my first 360, and approximately a hundred bucks worth of downloadable content wouldn’t work on my replacement console while I was offline. The first dozen or so times I called their helpline, the agents gave me blatantly incorrect information, telling me that the problem was that I needed to delete and redownload my content, it was only a month after I received my replacement 360 that I talked to one who told me that the license for my DLC had to be swapped to my new 360.

    It took four months, a letter to the BBB, and posting my experience on Consumerist before Microsoft got off their asses and actually fixed my problem. The utter uselessness of the so-called “customer service” personnel on 18004MYXBOX created such a negative experience for me that I’ve pretty much sworn off “downloadable content” forever.

    Now, there’s several games available on Live Arcade that I really want and would be happy to buy at the current price. Mutant Storm Empire, Metal Slug 3, Rez HD… There’s probably fifty bucks’ worth of games that I’d go buy RIGHT NOW, but for one thing.

    I simply don’t trust M$’s terrible DLC scheme. I’ve seen signs that my replacement console might bite the dust. If it does, am I going to wait another four months for M$ figure out that my games actually belong to me and tell my new console so? No, what I’m going to do is never spend another nickel on games that don’t exist somewhere in a PHYSICAL form in my possession. I just can’t make myself convert dollars to M$ points anymore, I can’t shake the feeling that by doing so I’m throwing money down a hole.

  51. chenry says:

    Actually if he and everyone else can wait about a month, MS is supposedly releasing a tool that will consolidate licenses to one xbox.

    We’ll see though.

  52. lostalaska says:

    I’ve been riding the hate wagon for Microsoft after my 3rd 360 red ringed on me. I was totally hooked on Puzzle Quest when my first 360 died, I have been unable to play it since. Sure most of the games will allow you to play them so long as your connected online, but Puzzle Quest wont let me play it and always says it’s a demo version of the game that won’t let my level 42 character advance since with the demo you can only go up to level 20. It even shows the achievments I’ve unlocked for it before going into the game.

    I honestly don’t have the extra money to sell of my 360 and games and buy into another console, so I’ve been thinking about modding the 360 and taking it off line. Sure it’s illegal according to Microsoft, but I tried to legally purchase their games and have only been punished by their DRM. I figure at least if I MOD it I should be able to play the damn games I purchased. Thanks Microsoft your shitty DRM just made me decide to go and do something illegal [MODDED 360] so I can play a game I legally purchased.

  53. iMe2 says:

    @Ex_EA_Slave: You’re right, it’s totally “Mac”‘s fault that he didn’t find this tremendously prominent and revelatory interview and complaining about going through proper channels to solve an issue that the company rep refused to fix. Nor did the rep offer this information, which would have been slightly more acceptable. No, you’re right, if he was a true fanboy he would have known about this ages ago, what right does he have to complain?

  54. fostina1 says:

    omg. he bought one and it broke, omg omg omg he bought another. i say buy it again you seem to like to waste money.

  55. Noris says:

    @Asvetic: Owning a PS3 will make you feel like a second-class video game citizen and you also pay a premium for the privileged of no games, a 10-year-old controller, etc… =(

  56. Noris says:

    @Papa Midnight: Those polls are NOT scientific in any way, meaning they’re garbage at telling us anything other than “an undetermined amount of people experience RROD.” Stop quoting random internet poll numbers.

  57. Asvetic says:

    @Noris: I’ll be happy to get off the ever souring teat of Microsoft and their continuously failing products.

    BTW, your dedication is adorable.

  58. jimv2000 says:

    I don’t know why they don’t just do something like Valve’s Steam, where once you buy a game, you can download it onto as many computers as you want…you just can’t play it unless you are logged into Steam. It sounds like MS is keying the software to the xbox, rather than the person’s account, which is an absolutely foolish way of doing things.

  59. parad0x360 says:

    Its wierd, when I bought my Elite to replace still working 360 I did an account recovery on the elite and downloaded all my games and had no issue playing them. I dont get why it happens to some and not all.

    However the good news is MS is fixing this something in the next month I believe. The update will make it work more like Steam wherein you buy the content and then can relink it to whatever 360 you are currently signed in on. In effect they are just dropping the serial # DRM and going by Gamertag so as long as you are logged in (dont have to be online) you can play.

    MS signed the content by GT and Serial# before to help prevent copying of data between multiple 360’s via memory card copying trick wherein you copy your GT to a mem card, backup the mem card and then reload the GT back onto a 360. When you put your GT on a mem card it removes it from the 360 until you load it back on, that way you cant easily copy games. The new way it will work is just by GT. So you will have to sign into XBL at least once to authorize the 360 and that 360 will be the only one allowed to use the content but at least it wont have to check everytime like it does now.

  60. Trai_Dep says:

    Could you imagine the outcry and 10,000-comment uproar if, every time someone bought a new iPod, Apple said, “We hate you – buy all your music all over again. Cheapskate.”
    Not that I’d ever buy DRM’d content, but since Apple was forced into it, it’s telling that they extracted concessions from the labels to make it as consumer-friendly as possible. Even shamed some labels into offering DRM-free tracks later. Kudos where it’s due compared to MS’ shining example.
    Of course, in that imaginary universe, Microsoft would have to give a damn about end users, which: ha ha ha ha. Ha.
    It makes no sense what MS is doing. Par for the course.

  61. Ex_EA_Slave says:

    @iMe2: I never blamed Mac. I blamed the Consumerist for being irresponsible and printing this without all the facts. Mac is not completely without fault however. Anyone who only goes to customer service without investigating online for other solutions is way too trusting. He probably takes his car to the dealer for service also.

  62. thefncrow says:

    @jimv2000: Actually, it does work like Steam, but there’s a second component to it.

    Lets say I purchased Rez HD. I can use any Xbox 360 in the country, log in to my gamertag, sign in to Xbox Live, and be able to download and play Rez HD.

    The problem is when you’re offline. If I recover my gamertag onto a friend’s Xbox 360, we download Rez HD, and then his internet goes down for the evening, I cannot play the game anymore, because now we have to revert to the offline mode of authentication. The offline mode of authentication is “The Xbox 360 where this game was originally purchased is allowed to play the game offline.” Since I bought the game on my 360, not my friend’s 360, offline authentication will fail, because the signature in the DRM is for my 360 and not his.

    The problems being described here are people having trouble with offline authentication.

  63. Phunk says:

    @Noris: I haven’t console gamed in quite some time, being primarily focused on the PC at the moment. That said, saying you feel like a ‘second class citizen’ because of a controller design thats pretty much the pinnacle of gaming controllers in all of history..and really doesn’t need to be changed, is quite foolish.

    The PS3 is also a work of art from an engineering/design standpoint as well.

    Maybe you should have bought a Wii?

  64. satoru says:

    @Noris: Even without polls you can pretty much infer what the repair rate is from their financial statements. They wrote down $1 billion in future warranty claims due to the 3 year warranty concerning the RROD. Even if you assumed an astronomical $1000 cost per warranty claim, it means that they expect warranty claims of about 1 million 360s which would be about 10-15% of the install base at the time. More realistically the warranty program should only cost them at most $500 so its really more in the 20-30% range. That’s extremely high for a consumer grade product, which should have 1 year failure rates more in the sub 5% range.

  65. satoru says:

    @Trai_Dep: Actually this happens quite often. If you don’t backup your iTunes files and your computer shits the bed that’s pretty much what Apple tells you to do. I think Wil Wheaton got an exception once because he was pretty vocal about it.

  66. rochec says:

    Well that’s good to know. I have a launch day 360 and was considering buying a new one to get a bigger HD and just avoid the eventual failure of this one. No to mention the hardware in the newer ones have been upgraded.

    I don’t have a lot of DLC, but I play Rock Band and have purchased nearly every song for that. Would suck to have to rebuy all those already overpriced tracks. Guess I’ll be sticking with my launch day 360.

  67. Ashground says:

    @Trai_Dep: Well, reality is close. Unless I’m mistaken, if you download music from iTunes and your HD craps out on you, you have to re-purchase your music, since you can only download a song once, even though it’s very clear on your account what songs have already been purchased. Or am I horribly wrong about that?

  68. Snullbug says:

    Sheep buy DRM products. Products cause massive blood pressure raising incidents of non-service from vendor. Sheep continue to buy DRM products. Vendor laughs all the way to bank.

    Only way to stop this is to stop renting content. That’s right, renting. When you are treated this way, its obvious that you don’t own it.

  69. Buran says:

    @dualityshift: I interpreted that as just “personal computer” which macs are as well, but point taken. I’m glad to see more choice, don’t get me wrong.

  70. DoktorGoku says:

    @Phunk: He didn’t say he felt like a second-class citizen just because of the controllers. You should probably actually read his post.

    Calling the PS3 a “work of art” is a little strange, too. Mine serves as a Blu-Ray movie player and PS2 upscaler. If I hadn’t bought the 60 gig, I wouldn’t have got one at all.

    Also, what do you mean by “should have bought a Wii”? You mean, like the majority of seventh-generation console owners?

    @Buran: “learn to like the competition’s choices”… uh-huh. “You’ll learn to like what this corporation gives you, so sit down and take it!” You’re ballsy.

    Why should somebody have to learn to like what what’s on a system? How about they just get what they like in the first place?

    Buran, here’s a pro tip- the things you’ve said so far, and the amount of responses you’ve got in this thread (which aren’t directly helpful to the victim’s situation, which is getting his 360 content back), mean that your console fanboyism is showing. You should probably keep that to Kotaku. Telling people to “learn to like” things like this is crossing the line.

  71. InThrees says:

    So if Joe Blow somehow steals these downloadable games and plays them without paying, that’s theft right?

    Microsoft, if Joe Blow has a paid-for license and needs to transfer that license to a new device, which is possible, and you refuse… that’s theft too, right?

    And nevermind the fact that from a customer service standpoint, this guy has paid for TWO of your shitty consoles and REALLY deserves some… customer service.

  72. katylostherart says:

    probably shouldn’t have cracked open your box voiding your warranty. at least when you go through the hassle of them fixing it everything becomes their fault and their responsibility to fix.

    if you hadn’t opened the original one that all the content was on, then it would be extremely fucked up to not give you your content back. it really really sucks that you lost all your stuff, but i don’t think anyone who really thought about what standard warranties for electronics almost always have as a clause (do not EVER open the machinery and tinker with it) would open their xbox.

    @Ashground: i know people who’ve lost their music and apple gave them back everything. it doesn’t hurt to ask.

  73. Buran says:

    @Papa Midnight: That’s exactly what I’m saying. I do my gaming on my PC, and own a PS3 for Blu-ray use. Never a problem with either.

  74. dalejrfanfreak says:

    This is a perfect example as to why digital downloads for movies or games is a bad idea unless there is a good backup in place whenever malfunctions happen.

  75. eben56 says:

    Microsoft has really gone to hell in a hand basket lately.

    I recently tried to download a template for Word, and got the notice that my software key was registered to someone else.

    I have been using this version of Office for 4 years and have gone through the “authentication” process several times. always passed just fine and got my download. Now: 4 years later, they tell me I am using a pirated copy.

    Sorry bub. I have the original disks, etc.

    (unless Staples was selling pirates)

    They want me to spend for an upgrade because 2003 isn’t new enough for them.

    Have switched to Firefox for browsing.. As soon as a good Office clone is there, I’m gone.

  76. Geekybiker says:

    The spring update is supposedly fixing this. IE allowing you to reliscene your content to a new console.

  77. @Noris: Did I say they were scientific? No. And did I quote “Random Internet Garbage” – as you so put it? No. Please check yourself before randomly spouting useless statements. Thank you, Sit Down, Put Away The Keyboard, Shut Up, Open Your Ears and your Eyes, and Have a Nice Day.

    @Noris: Ah, this explains your comments. Another fanboy sighted.

    @Asvetic: Indeed it is. Give him a medal. Perhaps he can play with that when his 360 fails…

  78. axiomatic says:

    @Asvetic: I own all three consoles. (Wii, 360, PS3)

    My whole family plays the Wii.
    My 360 gets used every day.
    My PS3 sits there and folds proteins with the folding@home client.

    Not sure about your game play needs but XBOX live is where the “fun” is. PS3 online is worse than PC gaming in to 90’s. Seriously.

    Not trying to fanboy. Just telling you what gets played in my house.

  79. @eben56: Open Office worked well for me, though I still run Windows XP Professional (Service Pack 3) so I still use Office 2003.
    @Buran: I also find it funny how they can charge for membership to XBL considering they paint the damn screen with advertisements as well as the nice little in-game advertisements. “NBA Playoffs Tonight at 8 Only On TNT” – Can I get paid now, Microsoft?

  80. @axiomatic: Whoa, now, need I remind you of what life was like BEFORE DirectX?

  81. axiomatic says:

    @Papa Midnight: I agree with you actually. I don’t like to “beat the drum”, but I am a contract 3d animator for games in my spare night time. I live by DirectX rules for my art development.

    Side note: The PS3 is really gaining speed lately, but developers need to really get to equal footing with the 360 regarding frame rate and display resolution. Once again, the cell processor in the PS3 is still proving hard to develop for apparently.

  82. josh42042 says:

    the xbox’s DRM has been broken and crappy for awhile now, but just last week they announced that it will be fixed next month:

    [www.next-gen.biz]

    There will be an online tool for people to use, to be able to transfer their liscenses to a new xbox.

    I have a similar problem, since i upgraded to an elite 360, i need to be signed into xbox live to be able to access the DLC that i’ve bought. Hopefully this tool will fix this problem for all of us.

  83. RedSonSuperDave says:

    @Papa Midnight: Yeah, seeing ads used to bug me back when I would pay for Live Gold. I’m paying for the privilege of accessing P2P servers, and yet I’m force-fed ads? Live’s such a festering cesspool of trash-talking teenage douchebags that I don’t bother anymore, I just play System Link if I want multiplayer.

    Not to mention Live is rife with hacking and cheating. If anybody wants to see video proof, look up AtmaDave’s file share on Halo 3 and download the video “Shenanigans”.

  84. Geekybiker says:

    @axiomatic:
    Woot! Another animator. I’m a technical animator (think rigs, etc) for one of the larger console devs.

  85. Chaluapman says:

    I’ve replaced two consoles and have not had any trouble getting my content back. Content is tied to the gamer tag, not the console. When I recovered my tag, I was able to re-download all my stuff.

  86. Chaluapman says:
  87. RedSonSuperDave says:

    @Chaluapman: Have you tried playing your stuff while NOT connected to Live? I bet you that your Live Arcade games will magically become demos again once you unplug your 360 from the internet.

    That’s my experience, anyway.

  88. Chaluapman says:

    @RedSonSuperDave:

    I’m wireless, I never unplug.

  89. aka Bitter says:

    @sleze69: True, but that applies only to the console you purchased the game on. If for some reason your Wii is stolen, lost, etc. you are just as screwed as this guy with the 360.

  90. DoktorGoku says:

    @Papa Midnight: Wow! Telling other people who question internet polls to “shut up” is an excellent example of maturity and critical thinking! Hats off to you!

    I also hate advertisements in things I pay for, but shouldn’t you seriously be leveling that criticism at the cable companies first? Do you want to be paid for watching TV, too? Nobody should be surprised here.

    I also note that you’re calling others “fanboy” while agreeing with Buran- who’s made an excessive (the most? not sure) amount of “fanboy” posts in this thread, even going to far as to say others should “learn to like” the games the competition (Gee, could he mean Sony?) offers… I suppose the concept of just getting the things you like from the get-go doesn’t sync with a fanboy’s mind.

    Heck, how many posts here bashing the 360 have you made? …and you’re calling OTHERS fanboys?

  91. Osi says:

    Another clear cut case, this is known as FRAUD in the USA. They took your money, and refused to provide you access to the product and services you paid for. Take them to court …

  92. Buran says:

    @evslin: Alas, with companies like this that doesn’t work often. You can’t get blood out of stones, and that’s all Microsoft is… a stony faceless monolith. The only thing that makes companies like this change is money — as in, customers going to the competition instead of giving them money.

    Saying “MORE MORE MORE!” is only going to make the problem worse because they can then say “why should we change? we’re still profiting because they just keep coming back for more”.

  93. Buran says:

    @DoktorGoku: Excuse me? I’m a “Fanboy” (how sexist, I’m not a fangirl, which is the more appropriate word, either) for saying “the competition doesn’t make shitty breaking crap, why not buy from the competition?”. That makes me SMART because I bought something that I know isn’t going to die on me…

    Don’t you think a “fan(boy/girl)” would be the brand-name diehard that buys Brand X no matter how many times failure reports are published, then whines and yells and screams when their Brand X widget dies, just like the thousands of other reports out there, then screams “NO NO NO NO NO NO NO I’m NOT LISTENING” when told that the competition doesn’t have the probelms that Brand X has? No, Brand X or nothing for the fanboy/fangirl!

    Judging from the comments I’m getting, a lot of people in here can’t see reason and their blinders are stopping them from seeing the blood-pressure-lowering way out — patronizing someone else that knows how to make good products.

  94. Buran says:
  95. Osi says:

    And there are no competition, PS3 and Wii both use DRM …

  96. Buran says:

    @Buran: Oops, sorry, didn’t realize I’d replied twice. Sorry, Doc!

  97. satoru says:

    @Buran: It’s not so much that the ‘others’ make good products, really Microsoft just made a really bad one. Realistically a 5% failure rate for a consumer goods product would be considered on the high end. There’s a reason Peter Moore left the Xbox division. He left because he did a royal screw up with the design process and MS forced him to resign (he cost them $1 billion after all). Considering the original xbox was a pretty solidly designed, it’s hard to know how they could have gone so far off the beaten path for the x360.

  98. satoru says:

    @Jinx: I think the Wii DRM is a bit more liberally implemented. When the original WiiWare hacks came out, you were able to re-download the software because the ticket in the game was valid so it authenticated as valid and allowed a re-download. Now my understanding is that they basically look at your download history and just check if you paid for it and let you re-download if necessary.

  99. Buran says:

    @satoru: I don’t understand it either. Contrary to some posters’ beliefs, I don’t know much about consoles (mine is for movies ONLY, owning an upgradeable blu-ray player apparently makes me a fangirl? um OK). However, I do have friends who use consoles, and a few of them have original Xboxes — and NONE of them have said a word about them failing. So what happened? I don’t know. I haven’t had a problem with other MS hardware I have (two different Sidewider joysticks) and while they still made gaming hardware, it had a pretty good reputation.

    Anyone know?

    But until they can fix whatever went wrong, I still can’t in good conscience recommend anyone buy their current console (and I have tried to warn friends away from buying them — not because of some imagined fangirlism but solely on the bad reputation they’ve got due to these failures).

  100. mmmmna says:

    Microsoft recalled certain XBox power adapters by the millions, but not the consoles? Hmm. Which costs more? They won’t transfer your licenses? Hmm. Could money POSSIBLY be involved?

    Money is all Microsoft cares about. That is why the folks deep in Linux circles call that company “Micro$oft” and “Microshaft”. I agree with that nick because I’ve felt their hands in my pockets: my PC hardware was obsoleted not once but twice by Windows upgrades. Then, when I wanted to buy a copy of Windows 3.11 at Staples some years back, 3.11 was retailing (at that time) for $83, Windows 95 was next to it selling for $85, and Windows 98 was just released that week, was above those other 2, and was selling for $87. 1 current OS and 2 obsoleted OS, for essentially the same cost?

    It’s ALL about the money.

    In Moores defense, I’ve worked in electrical engineering for over 25 years, marketing types will make life miserable for EEs because they demand that projects have a time based completion point, despite design obstacles that need time for a proper solution to be developed. That means marketing and sales types will have the upper hand: “it’ll be out by Christmas or heads will roll”. So, if you got a defective commercial product, try to blame sales or marketing… most EEs I’ve known would NEVER deliberately send a defective product into the field – that would be unethical.
    Well, everyone except for that ONE lying EE back in 2001… that EE would be happy to lie.

  101. @DoktorGoku: I’ve bashed every console there is. You expect me to count every single one? I’m not even going to bother replying the two page long comment I have. Here’s a quote for you. “You’re not worth it”.

  102. DoktorGoku says:

    @Buran: I apologize for the confusion in gender. I’ve never before known a female to engage in this level of fan-person-ish behavior.

    What makes me reference you a fan(girl) is that you are in here repeatedly putting down the one console in favor of another. Look at how many anti-Microsoft/360 posts you have… in this very thread. Seriously- count them, then see if anybody else comes close. That’s enough on its own, but…

    …what really makes me say it is that you have the unmitigated gall to tell other people to “learn to like” what the competition offers. This shows absolutely zero respect for the concept of people getting what they like most in the first place. Further, it shows an implied disdain for their tastes in entertainment. On top of that, it shows an incredible arrogance, showing an assumption that YOU know what entertainment is so much better than others. If you genuinely can’t see that, I don’t know how further to help.

    Aside from my gender assumption, which I’ve now apologized for, my facts are very straight. I can respect other people’s choices, even if I disagree with them. I can also apologize when I’ve made an assumption. Can you?

  103. DoktorGoku says:

    @Papa Midnight: Congratulations on proving me correct. You not only cannot actually debate your points, but you feel that it is perfectly valid to tell other people to “shut up” in a discussion. Further, upon realizing that you can’t actually debate said points, you have to make personal attacks (“You’re not worth it”, you said) to cover up your utter lack of understanding of the subject.

    Like I’ve said before, trolling behavior like that usually isn’t welcome here. Maybe you’ll learn to debate with maturity and self-control in the future.

  104. BBF_BBF says:

    Send an email to major@xbox.com stating your problem and with a link to this consumerist post. That’s the email for Major Nelson (aka Larry Hryb). An email to him is probably more effective at getting XBOX issues solved than one to Billy.

    Oh, in the Major’s last blogcast, he did say that user directed transferring of licenses from an old console (or multiple consoles) to one new one will be added to the xbox live system some time in June. It won’t be available from the console itself, but will be from xbox.com… it’s supposed to be similar to the refurb transfer of licenses that MS has been doing for a while now.

    [majornelson.com]

  105. @DoktorGoku: Actually, now that I’ve considered it, I will respond to your post.

    One: Yes, It is an excellent example of maturity and critical thinking. I thank you for your brilliant observation, John Madden! Hats off to you, indeed! Okay, now that the sarcasm is past. Yes, I told him to “shut up”. Why? Because unfortunately, that seems to be the only way to get through to people these days. A reasonable debate cannot be held. Obviously posting an opinionated comment cannot stave off the diatribe of some users (as evidenced in the very comment sections of the entire Gawker network) so therefore, yes, I indeed did declare for him, or her (as we cannot assume), to “Shut Up”.

    Two: Do not attack me for posting comments which may display a lack of maturity and then go around and do the same. It’s called being hypocritical. Yes, I do use the term fanboy, though quite sparingly. If I dare declare someone a fanboy, typically it is not without merit. If someone wishes to target me and attempt to flame me for posting my opinion, while themselves posting comments in which they call others, and quote: “Second Rate Citizens”, then chances are more than naught that the individual is a fanboy and therefore will be declared such.

    Three: Yes, I do agree with Buran on many issues in regards to consoles. Is that wrong for me to cite a console with a reported 30% and higher failure rate as having a problem with both competing platforms are reported as having less than a 1% failure rate (PS3 | Wii)? Now I’d consider that good empowerment of a consumer to know what risk they may be engaging in by choosing to purchase a 360, a PS3, or a Wii.

    Now I want to make things perfectly clear. From a business relationship standpoint, I loathe Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo. Perhaps I should be a little more specific. As a journalist who writes for and operates two seperate small media outlets, both in the field of new media and both with a focus on electronics (See: Game Politics, Gizmodo, Jalopnik, and Kotaku), I hate dealing with Sony Computer Entertainment of America, Microsoft, and Nintendo of America. Even more specifically, their Public Relations departments. Not pointing any names, but a certain individual who we will call “J” at Sony failed to render various units (I say “units” broadly). Microsoft and Nintendo never bothered to return one inquiry email or phone call. Funny how the world’s largest Publisher / Developer (Yes I am referring to Electronic Arts) is willing to help out a small media outlet but Microsoft nor Nintendo isn’t even willing to return a phone call or email. Even a copy and paste response would be reasonable. Hell, I’ve gotten tons of them from Sony. So from a business standpoint, I hate these companies.

    Now from the other standpoint, the consumer standpoint. As a consumer, I’ve been dissapointed with Nintendo over the past decade. While I loved my N64, I was not happy with the GameCube. That has a whole reason in itself and this is not the forum for me to render my opinion on why. Then comes the Wii, which as someone once stated, had the power equivalent of “Two GameCubes duct taped toghether”. Now lets think longevity. The Wii as it stands has roughly the power equivalent to the original Xbox (Except that it can only output a max of 480p but thats not even a relative point right now). This may work for casual, Role Playing, and party games, but won’t get very far with action and extended adventure games – and even a role playing game will be limited in it’s total capabilities. Therefore, from a consumer standpoint, this can only last so long. The Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3 will have a much longer life expectancy than the Wii. I do not own one.

    As for Sony… Sony had me sold with the PlayStation. I can find nothing wrong with it (though I wonder if they intentionally limited the size of memory card storage – and yes that includes the PS2 memory card). Now for the PlayStation 2: I liked this unit… For a while. Then something happened in 2003… Something that would make me weary of Sony products since: Disc Read Error. Of course, Sony would not repair it but I fixed it myself. I still cannot play some games and others work with shoddy performance. But it’s playable; though Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas is somewhat difficult to play considering at times, sections fail to load and I have to stop driving while waiting for textures to appear. I like what I’m able to play so I have no true complaints. The unit still works. Now as for the PlayStation 3, I do not own one. I will get one when my college student budget allows for me to do so. As a unit, it appears to have a similar life time expectancy (barring any unit failures) to the Xbox 360. The appeal of expandable storage for reasonable prices in conjuction with native support for Linux and a drive supporting the next-generation optical disc format is an attraction as well. Forgive me if as a consumer, I see something that looks to be cost effective. From my observations of the unit, a larger library is needed as is a more proactive corporation. Though some of the first party games and subsequent third party games have proven to be quite fun.

    Microsoft… I have mixed opinions for. I must admit that I preferred my PlayStation 2 to the Xbox though there were some games on the Xbox that drew my attention. However, most of these made their way to the PlayStation 2 so I did not complain. The Fatboy didn’t do much to attract my hands either. Having to pay to play online was also an extreme turn off causing me to once more redirect my attention to the PlayStation 2. The Xbox 360 has done nothing so far to change my mixed feelings for the console. I like some games on it. To be honest, if we’re comaparing controllers, I have no problem with either the PlayStation controller (If the design works, don’t change it… drastically) or Xbox 360 controller (Extremely well designed in terms of ergonomics and easability to reach controls). However, I still do not like the fact that one, Microsoft finds some justification in charging $179.99 USD for a 120GB HDD (Somehow, I can get nearly 1TB for the same cost), $100 for an 802.11g USB Adapter, nor do I like having to pay to play online. Perhaps this is why I cannot get into MMORPG’s. However, I have paid for approximately 3 months worth of Xbox Live as I have borrowed a friends Xbox 360 since December. Yes that does indeed mean I went 2 months without online play (One month of gold is granted free). I have other reasons for my dislike of the Xbox 360 unit (such as constant freezing during gameplay, etc.) and I have witnessed problems occuring with others units like shotty drives (which they were told by CSR’s didn’t apply under the Microsoft Extended Warranty). A friend of mine from college owned a 360, a PS3, and a Wii. He sold all his 360 games and started buying games for the PS3 instead. When I asked him why, his response was “Because I know my 360 is bound to fail one of these days”. Guess what occured in no more than 72 hours… RRoD.

    So yes, I have bashed the Xbox 360, with merit. I have bashed the Nintendo Wii. I have also bashed the PlayStation 3. Add this post itself as a ticket to the counter. So to respond to you, let us recall what a fanboy is: Someone who blindly follows a company and raucosly defends that company even though said company couldn’t give a crap about him and is frankly only interested in how much $$$ he produces for them. For the closure of this post, please see my previous one directered at the other person whom you so readily and blindly defended. Who’s the true fanboy?

  106. @DoktorGoku: What does it mean to assume?

    Side note, sorry Jimbo, I fed it.

  107. @Papa Midnight: Bad link. Here we go. How about that edit button?

  108. bbqninja says:

    It’s been WIDELY reported on gaming sites (including by MS themselves in the latest Major Nelson podcast) that a “DRM transfer tool” is being released in June. This tool will allow you to fix exactly the situation detailed here and is designed for people who have changed consoles but still have the same xbox live account.

    While it’s annoying that the CSR didn’t know this, a simple google for “xbox 360 DRM update” shows tons of info on it.

  109. DoktorGoku says:

    @Papa Midnight: Thank you for typing out a well-thought out post. Unfortunately, despite all of that, you’re still missing the point.

    I didn’t defend the other person- I described how your responses were inappropriate. Show me where I said that what he said/did/whatever was good or defendable. Go ahead.

    Oh, you can’t.

    “What does it mean to assume?” You should probably ask yourself that question- assuming that I am hypocritical, eh? Show me where I told another user to “shut up”. Go ahead. Show me where I told another user that they “weren’t worth it”. Go ahead.

    Oh, you can’t.

    You talked (typed) a lot- but you didn’t say anything. The point is, you’ve made an inordinate amount of posts here trying to bash something. Show me somebody else in this thread who’s made as many angry videogame posts. You seem to be under the mistaken assumption that it’s ok to tell others to “shut up” in a debate. You seem to be under the mistaken assumption that it’s ok to personally insult others, saying that they’re “not worth it”.

    This brings us back to your question. Who’s the true fanboy here?

    Looking at all the evidence above… it’s you.

    It was a nice try, but you should really learn to address the points that others make, instead of regressing to personal insults and “shut up”s. Like I said before- maybe you’ll learn to debate with maturity and self-control in the future.

    By the way, you should probably learn to use the “Preview Comment” function there, champ- helps prevent triple posts and all that, y’know.

  110. I’ve made my point. No need in continuing to feed the trolls. Such is how you’ve already proven it. Thank you, and as I said, Have a nice day.

  111. eelmonger says:

    @satoru: Wii DRM is actually worse than 360 DRM. If my 360 breaks out of warranty and I buy a new one I can use my gamertag (and future online tool) to recover all my downloaded content. However if I buy a new Wii, the games are tied to the console you bought them on, moving them over to the new system on a SD card won’t help. Maybe you can call Nintendo and they can transfer the license, but they’d have to have a way to prevent abuse.

  112. DoktorGoku says:

    @Papa Midnight: Uh-huh.

    The guy who tells others to “shut up” and then personally insults others (because he can’t answer them), telling them that they are “not worth” a response is calling others trolls when they ask him to actually provide evidence for what he’s claiming, or to at least debate in a mature manner.

    Yeah, that’s the ticket! Obviously everybody will believe you now!

    The only point you’ve made in discussion here is that you’ve yet to grasp the subtleties of an intelligent debate. Have a good one.

  113. @DoktorGoku: And yet he consistently proves my point. Funny how that works, isn’t it?

  114. adamsummers says:

    @BBF_BBF: The fact that you used the term “blogcast” makes it obvious that you are a plant for Microsoft. Get over it, the accepted term is “podcast”.

  115. Buran says:

    @DoktorGoku: You misunderstand, entirely, apparently (as far as I can tell) assuming that I’m some kind of fan of a particular game or platform or something.

    I’m not.

    I’m “putting down” a product that repeatedly breaks and is “supported” by a company that has shown a repeated failure to take care of people who have experienced issues and has shown a repeated failure to actually fix the issue in the hardware to prevent future errors.

    I’m supporting the idea of not supporting such companies and supporting, instead, those that do their job right, make reliable products, and take care of customers when problems DO happen.

    Somehow, this very simple piece of very straightforward logic that seems to reign elsewhere on a site named CONSUMERist, not “support the failing idiotic company that can’t get its shit together”-ist, makes me a fangirl.

    That doesn’t compute. If I, in a story about how bad Home Depot is (to draw on a recent example) started talking about how I’d patronize Lowe’s, and tell others that they should do the same and that both Home Depot and Lowe’s serve the same purpose, because they have a reputation for better service and don’t spawn horror stories, would you call me a Lowe’s fangirl?

    If I suggested that people wanting to register for gift lists for special events do so with, say, Nordstrom’s rather than Target, due to Target’s consistent behavior of refusing refunds even when it’s clear that the items were purchased from Target, demanding ridiculous and rude behavior from gift recipients, and due to Target’s total lack of any sign that they will fix these repeated horror stories in the future, would you call me a Lowe’s fangirl?

    Sounds rather logical to me, in all three cases. And yet, mud gets flung at me for being LOGICAL? Like I said, sure looks to me like the irrational fanpeople are the ones slinging mud to look up and use the logical part of their brains.

    (and I wasn’t actually angry about the gender mix-up. Don’t worry about it).

  116. Buran says:

    @Buran: second should say “Nordstrom’s fangirl”.

    And I’d like to take this “edit” to again say that I have no idea why I’m being bashed all of a sudden for sensible advice to go with more worthy companies. It really doesn’t make one whit of sense to me.

    Why is it that people (not pointing fingers at anyone in particular) are suddenly reacting to this sensible advice with namecalling, when that doesn’t happen in the Lowe’s or Target threads and no one gets called fanboy/fangirl, accused of being biased in favor of (or against) a company no matter how many times the person being accused states that that’s not what’s going on at all and that the whole thing is based on logic and not any bias for one company over another beyond one sucking and one not?

    And why is it that having to repeat the truth multiple times doesn’t stop the false accusations and insults? It’s like the truth goes in one ear and out the other.

    Like I said, I’m not the fan(boy|girl) around here from the looks of things.

    Take off the blinders, people, and THINK about why people might be saying that it’s a good idea to drop the bad ones like a hot potato and get to like the competition that can serve the same function as the idiots!

  117. Difdi says:

    Small claims court. You paid money for the content, they won’t let you have it. The state Attorney General’s office ought to be a good option too.

  118. microbefox says:

    Out of Warranty? I got my Xbox 360 at launch and I was still in warranty when I asked them for repairs. Did he know about their 3 year warranty extension? In any case, I got a replacement 360. I haven’t checked my downloaded content. I’ll have to get back to you on that. I just want to say this dude wasted his time and money getting a new 360 when it broke down. The system came out in Nov 2005 and the warranty is still good until Nov 2008.

  119. BBF_BBF says:

    @adamsummers: No, I’m not a microsquid plant. I hate them as much as I hate any company that applies overly restrictive DRM all over their products. That applies to Sony, Apple, etc, etc, as well.

    I just don’t like using a term which implies the recorded audio broadcast has anything to do with the iPod or any drm infested device… I’d rather be brand agnostic and hence “blog”cast rather than “pod”cast.

    Sheesh… conspiracy geeks are so paranoid. So by your own logic, *you* must be an Apple plant then. ;-)

  120. nXt says:

    You should be able to play your games that you purchase if you’re logged into Live.
    If not, hang tight, Microsoft announced a “DRM TOOL” that will fix all the DRM issues with buying a new system/transferring hard drives, etc.. It’s coming out within 1-2 months.

  121. hibbit says:

    @Asvetic:

    If you are switching to Sony because you are expecting less DRM and more customer support, you are about to get a brutal awakening. I don’t have either console, but Sony’s track record speaks for itself. It includes proprietary formats for things that should be universal (ie- the memory stick), DRM to the hilt (ie – the sony rootkit fiasco), membership in RIAA, and more.

    You *really* expect a company that puts a *rootkit* on customer hard drives to save you from DRM?

    Unlikely.

  122. Bakkster_Man says:

    Wasn’t part of the terms on the extended RRoD warranty that they would replaced an RRoD console EVEN IF you had repaired it yourself, including paying for the initial repair cost?

  123. Jaysyn was banned for: http://consumerist.com/5032912/the-subprime-meltdown-will-be-nothing-compared-to-the-prime-meltdown#c7042646 says:

    @MonkeyMonk:

    Same here. I don’t have much sympathy for anyone who gives a coporation this much power over them.

  124. kabes says:

    This smells like BS. I have used my same hard drive on 3 seperate 360’s and the content is always accessible when logged into Live.

  125. thefncrow says:

    @kabes: That’s right, because you were logged in, and so you could use the online method of authentication to unlock the content.

    Take your hard drive, put it on another 360, any 360 other than the one where you purchased the content, and then sign in to your gamertag without internet access. Your Xbox Live Arcade games will revert to demos, and game content DLC will disappear.

    What’s being complained about here is the offline mode.

  126. Buran says:

    @BBF_BBF: I do agree that the “do you work for (x)” comments can be a bit much (though I’ve done them occasionally, I admit). However, “blogcast” is, as pointed out, not the accepted term for what you are talking about. I doubt you’ll get far trying to get people to change — about as far as Hormel has gotten in trying to get people to change how they talk about junk email. (read: not one bit). People/entities who try to change language after it’s that established are basically tilting at windmills — but best of luck all the same…

    I also think “podcast” sounds better, personally.

  127. crichton007 says:

    This is why Microsoft’s DRM sucks. Apple and Real have it right.

  128. BBF_BBF says:

    @Buran: I agree “blogcast” not the accepted term. Did anybody *not* get what I was tTalking about, though?

    I certainly don’t correct others when they use “podcast”, so I expect others to respect my choice as well.

    Anyways, when specifically referring to Major Nelson’s blogcast/podcast, both terms are appropriate because that’s what he refers to them as.

  129. lestat730 says:

    @Buran: Let me just say that I and a few friends have had launch 360’s and have experienced no problems at all with them. True it has a higher then acceptable failure rate but the fact is angry people speak louder then happy people. This makes the severity of the problem appear magnified. It also didn’t hurt when MS extended the warranty for 3 more years when a console experiences hardware failure. People continue to buy because the 360 has a truly awesome library of games and I think that developers are just now tapping the true power of the system. So for me, I have no regrets in my 360 purchase. Also I feel it’s worth saying that I believe my opinion is unbiased as I also own and enjoy 2 Sony systems. Just my thoughts…

  130. Buran says:

    @lestat730: Oh, for those who have them and haven’t had problems, I hope you never do. My issue is with the reaction I’m getting… you’d think people are actually TRYING to get screwed over/bent over by big business — which makes no sense on a site named “consumerist”. If you want big business to change, which this site is all about, don’t patronize the bad ones. It’s not like people don’t have choices.

  131. @microbefox: If you read, it stated that he voided his own warranty because he was out of the warranty when it broke the first time so he fixed it himeself. Thus when it RRoD’d and the new 3 year warranty was instated, he was not applicable for it due to already voiding his own.

  132. logikil says:

    I understand the plight the guy who sent this in is going through, but I’ve recently had my licenses transferred from a launch box to a replacement system that I got using the Best Buy PRP. It was a pretty simple process and took about a week. Basically I gave them the info for my second box and a receipt that showed I had it exchanged at Best Buy. There was never a warranty question, nothing whatsoever.

    I think the bigger question is why transferring the hard drive didn’t work. Even if your system is different you should at least have been able to play while online. And even if they didn’t work while online you could have deleted the games and redownloaded them while logged into live. It just makes no sense that you wouldn’t have been able to.

    Anyway, yeah MS screwed the pooch tying your content to a specific console. At the very least each company should adopt an apple style authorization policy, where you have like 2 or 3 consoles your content is able to work on, but hindsight is 20/20.

  133. Meathamper says:

    This isn’t fair. You pay for stuff and the XBOX 360 breaks, and you’re expected to pony up for the things again?

  134. rchrza says:

    Hey all, i just signed up today to give you my experience.

    1. Brought a launch 360, got xbox live gold, sold it after 8 months.

    2. Brought another 360 about 6 months ago, used the SAME nickname and account details.

    3. Remembered the xbox live games i had brought before (they had a tick next to them) and just downloaded them again, and it worked fine..no licence transfer stuff, this was a clean xbox 360 “falcon” and all i did was download the games again, and they were the full versions, as purchased on xbox live.

    So i haven’t had this problem, but just thought i’d share a positive experience.

    Thanks, Rob C (Australia)

  135. Jack Moody says:

    this is annoying, i was actually searching to see if I could call up microsoft and replace my xbox 360 for a new one because my old one is just saying ‘to play this disc put it in an xbox 360 console’ and then when i put it on it bottom so upwards it wont let me open the disc thing.
    any ideas?