Comcast, it seems, has a serious problem. They’re selling “Unlimited Access,” but again and again their customers tell us that they’re being threatened with “termination” for using too much bandwidth. How much is too much? Comcast won’t say. According to their Acceptable Use Policy, “too much” is defined as “where bandwidth consumption is not characteristic of a typical residential user of the Service as determined by the company in its sole discretion.” Reader Peter is one such atypical customer. He wants to cooperate with Comcast, but he can’t get a straight answer as to how much downloading he’s allowed to do. He can’t even get an estimate. Since he pays for the highest tier of access from Comcast, he figures that he should be able to download more than a “typical” user. Not true, says the Comcast “Abuse” department. Since his internet is “faster” he’s simply paying more for the ability to reach the bandwidth limit sooner.
Here’s Peter’s story:
Today, May 12th, Comcast called me at work to inform me that for the month of April I had excessive bandwidth usage and that if it showed up again in the May audit, I would have my service terminated. I was told I was in the “Top 1/10th of 1% of all Comcast users and that I was having a direct negative impact on 99.9% of Comcast’s 14 million nationwide customers”. I’m aware that I am a bandwidth intensive account holder. I am a nerd as are all of my roommates. Slingboxes, Xbox Marketplaces, WoW updates, Age of Conan install downloads, iTunes, Amazon Unboxes and torrents add up quick. I was not out to dispute the claim.
However, when I asked what I was supposed to cut my usage to, I was told “We don’t have a number for that.” When asked if I would receive any manner of compensation for the fact that I pay for their highest tier of access, but am limited on that access, I was told no. Stephen informed me that I was talking about speed and he was talking about quantity. When I asked if 99.9% of Comcast customers paid the higher rates that I did, he said, “I don’t have that number.” When I asked if he could send me my usage report, he said “No.” When I asked if he could show me proof that my paid usage was having a negative impact on the entire nationwide Comcast user base, he said, “No, that is proprietary information.” I asked if I was merely supposed to take these accusations on faith and assume that Comcast was not exploiting me, a higher paying customer, he responded with, “Why would Comcast want to exploit you?”
That was cute.
After roughly 15 minutes of trying to get some quantifiable answer as to what was non-excessive use, I was repeatedly met with the refrain, “Sir, this is all detailed in our online FAQ.” I said my goodbyes and returned to work. Once home I pulled up the FAQ, which is listed under the non-descriptive heading of “Hot”. There are 11 questions in the FAQ, 6 of which simply have no answers whatsoever.
I called their Abuse department back and spoke with a different man, Bill. I wanted to establish that I was not informed of this complaint filed against me until the middle of May, that I had secured my Wireless Network, that I had set up a net limiter and that I was actively trying to cut down my usage, but as far as I know I could already have exceeded “Fair Use” for the month of May. He informed me that I should have one month from the date of threat of disconnection to cut my usage of paid services, which was a slight relief. I proceeded to volley off him the same questions as before and received equally evasive answers. He said he had no quantifiable number to give me because it, “is proportional to all Comcast bandwidth for a month and is thus a moving target.” I proceeded to point out the inconsistency in their FAQ, which Bill proceeded to counter with the claim that information is there. I insisted it was not and he promised me he would escalate the issue. I’ll check later if there are any changes to it.
I once again brought up the issue of my higher priced service and was told, “I am talking about speed, he is talking about distance.” I could reach the same usage with their basic service as I could with their premium. His comparison was a “Ferrari to a Sentra” – They both reach the same destination, just at different times.
Now here is the twist. I called my local Comcast office to downgrade to the lower tier. I was met with a very nice woman who had no problem processing my request. When asked for a reason, I detailed all the above and she was flat out shocked. She said, “I have never heard of that before.” She went on to agree that my deal for Comcast was for “Unlimited Access”, or so we both thought, and that she was going to bring the issue up with marketing.
So, there you have it. Comcast’s own sales employees are under the impression that the services they are selling to consumers are unlimited. The Abuse department has a polar (and far more aggressive) stance, but refuses to commit to any quantification of it as well as a refusal to let you see any relevant documentation to your own paid usage.
Peter
(Photo: u2acro )
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Could someone please point me to the contract term which states that access is “unlimited?”
I can’t find a guarantee anywhere on Comcast’s site that states that they are selling unlimited access. I don’t think anyone sells completely unlimited access at residential service prices.
Enough is enough! Give the work company title to Comcast already!
I know I’m kind of stating the obvious here, but as long as they don’t set any specific cap numbers that the customer can see, then they can still market their service as unlimited. The moment they document any sort of hard limit, they are opening themselves up to lawsuits.
Personally, I don’t see why someone hasn’t sued them for false advertising already. Any cap, even an invisible one, would seem to constitute a limit. But I’m sure there’s some sort of regulatory loophole that allows them to get away with this.
I love how it’s a moving target which is based on the national average. So if they have a outage somewhere, You could have transferred less data but still hit the cap.
whats funny though is that if someone would actually sue comcast in small claims court, I bet this guy’s questions would be the first few out of the judge’s mouth. I don’t get why comcast would deny a usage report. They should at least upgrade their systems so users can log online and see how much they are using at any given point. That would help in these situations.
Hell, he must really be sucking up bandwidth like a freaking sponge for something like this to happen. I can understand where any provider of service is coming from though. If something like 1/10th of 1% is hogging up 30% of the bandwidth at any time, it’s a real disservice to the other customers. It’s pretty abusive really.
That said, it should be stated in the contract somewhere that this sort of excessive use can lead to termination. It should not be some sort of surprise they just spring on you one day. I have no clue what the OP’s original contract looks like so I don’t know if he was warned ahead of time.
>> His comparison was a “Ferrari to a Sentra”
Bad analogy. Regardless of your tier of service, the *speed* is the same.
The difference is the capacity. A better analogy would be a pick-up truck compared to a dump truck. Both vehicles may travel the same speed down a given path, but one vehicle has greater capacity than the other.
Regardless… mind yourself, the lady at Comcast that gave you the answer you wanted to hear is not empowered to save your account.
It’s not right, but you will have to decide whether you want to play by Comcast’s rules or not use their service at all…. at least until the FCC slaps them back into their place.
So basically, if they implement a cap and make the users pay for every bandwidth they use or worse terminate the users just because of exceeding the “bandwidth”.
I have one question, what about the Deaf/Hard of Hearing users? The only thing that makes me concerned for them is because they use video as a means of communication. I do not mean they use it lightly; they are the biggest bandwidth users in terms of video. I have several friends whom are Deaf/Hard of Hearing and they use this technology as an integral part of their lives.
Are we asking the Deaf/Hard of Hearing consumer to pay more for the bandwidth if it was ever implemented or Comcast sends them a letter outlining they will be terminated just because they use such bandwidth and cut them off of the means of communication?
I just had to put this one in the soap box because it is one thing that no one has ever thought about. I am sure Comcast has not even thought about the Deaf/Hard of Hearing users when they complain of someone using “too much bandwidth”.
” was told I was in the “Top 1/10th of 1% of all Comcast users “
wouldn’t someone always be in that top 1/10th of 1%? if he cuts down on his bandwidth, that just means someone else will take it place and the cycle starts over. stupid if you ask me.
If you’re dumb enough to pay comcast for anything then you deserve whatever shit they decide to shovel in your direction. There are other alternatives for internet service — USE THEM. If there isn’t another alternative available to you — GO WITHOUT.
Either one is preferable to dealing with comcast.
@MitchV: The internet isn’t a big truck. It’s a series of tubes. Of course, in that analogy, the OP is paying for a larger pipe, but only allowed to use the same amount of water.
@bravo369: If they keep pushing for the “by the byte” billing plans, they will have to log and show data transfers, just like your cell bill shows minutes used. It will happen, sooner rather than later.
The phrase “excessive usage” and the threat of termination indicate that a limit has been breached.
If you cannot quantify that limit, then it should (if not already) be illegal to hold someone to a policy that they can not and will not reveal.
@buzzybee: I don’t think that’s what is at issue here.
The problem is Comcast refuses to tell him what the ‘cap’ is that he has supposedly surpassed. Then threatening to cut services if he doesn’t lower his usage below a mystery number.
I would switch to whatever else is available: satellite, FIOS, anything. It’s just bad business to treat your highest tiered customers that way.
There’s only six FAQs in the “HOT” section that the link points to, not 11.
Call up Comcast to cancel. They will transfer you to retentions. Tell them the only reason you will stay is if they remove the “invisible cap” from your account and give you truly unlimited access
Not that it would work… It just might be fun.
@MitchV: It’s not a big truck. It’s a series of tubes!
@zimzombie: Jinx. you owe me a coke.
Begin the Comcast bashing.
@BPorche: I’m hard of hearing and I don’t use Comcast (thankfully I don’t live in their area) but I find text-based IMing very useful…
@Hellblazer: The Internet is no longer a luxury, so that doesn’t work so easily.
I wish OP would track his usage to give us a general idea of exactly how much he’s using. Not that I want to bash him, but because I’m interested in seeing how much usage constitutes being in the top 1/10th of 1% of all users.
I asked Cox if they had a limit on the amount of downloads you could make. I was told there’s no hard limit, but if you make an excessive amount, you could get flagged for suspicious activity or something like that.
I asked the CSR if he could ballpark what that amount is, and he answered, “oh, don’t worry, it’s like, gigs.”
Boy was I relieved! Who could possibly download “gigs” in a month?!
From the Faq: “Currently, the median data usage by Comcast High-Speed Internet customers is approximately 2GB each month.”
Seriously?
“a…customer who uploads or downloads 1,000 pictures in a month may use 10GB.”
That’s such a ridiculous statement I can’t even wrap my head around it long enough to do the math. Do they really think that a picture is 100MB? No wonder they hit the 2GB cap pretty quick.
Based on Comcast’s current policies, here are a few examples of activities any one of which represents excessive use in one month:
* Sending 20,000 high-resolution photos,
* Sending 40 million emails;
* Downloading 50,000 songs; or
* Viewing 8,000 movie trailers.
Wow.
@BPorche: you bring up a great point. Not all bandwidth is used by kids downloading torrents. Besides the deaf/hard of hearing, other treatments use video through the web, as well as online courses which require you to download gigs of video and text, plus countless other legal uses. And Comcast would no doubt sell those customers their highest tier.
Another thing (to continue my rant), I looked up the FAQ and under “What is normal or typical use?” it says “Currently, the median data usage by Comcast High-Speed Internet customers is approximately 2GB each month.” Really, I just downloaded 2 movies I bought on itunes last night. I must be the new 1/10th of 1% for this month.
I too am a “Premium” speed Comcast subscriber and think that this is some serious bullshite.
The fact that the “Premium” speeds get you to the cap faster is UNEQUIVOCAL BULLSHITE and Comcast better stop pissing off customer who pay them more.
They need to first clean out the “regular” paying customer who hit the cap THEN move on to the “premium” customers. I have a feeling that Comcast financial department would agree with me too.
@Hellblazer: Lastly, Hellblazer Comcast is the only game in my neighborhood and no I can’t just not subscribe. My wife and I both work from home for a major PC/ Server manufacturer. VPN access to the corporate net is essential. So I find your suggestion unrealistic and geared towards luxury internet use and not business use.
Just read an article in the NYTimes the other day and they addressed this. Apparently Comcast is going to a 250gb/month cap so that they’ll have a number they can give people who ask. They’ll then charge a certain amount per gb after that (don’t remember the exact number, sorry). The article also said Time Warner is going to a 40gb/month cap.
I noticed that according to Comcast’s FAQ, “the median data usage by Comcast High-Speed Internet customers is approximately 2GB each month.” Downloading two demos off of PSN or a couple of movies off of Amazon Unbox will exceed that.
Personally I’ve gone over 2 GB in a single day. I’m not sure the maximum I’ve ever downloaded in one month (though I just added firmware on my router which keeps track of that now), but I’d say I’ve probably exceeded 20 GB in some months
Considering Comcast is thinking about implementing a 250 GB/month cap, one would think that anything under 250 GB would not be considered excessive. I still don’t understand why Comcast can’t tell you have much you’ve downloaded in a month unless they don’t actually know.
I really don’t understand what the harm is in posting these ethereal usage caps. Heck, it would give companies another thing to compete for. It would be something like this:
Imagine both Verizon and Comcast have a 3Mbps, $40 per month, internet plan. Comcast offers a usage cap of 90GB per month, while Verizon offers a cap of 100GB per month. Whose plan would you buy?
Besides, I believe it would be beneficial to each party (consumer & company). Sure, there are people out there who don’t give a flying f%^&, and would download all they please, advertised limit or not. However, there are those, like me, who would actually try and work towards the greater good, and monitor our usage.
@Hellblazer:
In some neighborhoods, you don’t always have a provider choice.
Check out this WaPo article:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/
article/2007/05/20/AR2007052001724_pf.html -
@bravo369: My thought exactly. Every month they appearently have to terminate the top 1/10 of 1% of their customers. Which is probably bleeding less customers than Sprint is.
Please no Comcast bashing. We now know that it’s Peter’s fault. As he indicated in his post “I was having a direct negative impact on 99.9% of Comcast’s 14 million nationwide customers”
Some day, all of life will be just as Comcastic!
Traffic Ticket: You were speeding, (how fast) I can’t tell you. (what’s the speed limit) That’s proprietary information.
Insurance: We are denying your clam (why) We can’t tell you. (what’s covered) That’s proprietary information.
School: We’re sorry, you flunked and cannot graduate. (why) We can’t tell you. (can I get a transcript of my grades) We are unable to provide that at this time. (did any other students flunk) That’s proprietary information.
Guantanamo Bay: You’re under arrest (why) We can’t tell you…………
@highmodulus:
I think the Comcast bashing was well under way before you made your comment :p
@buzzybee: Actually, I thought the speed at which one can download WAS a download cap.
How about this. Any of you who are still Comcast customers decide on a time, say, 9 PM EDT this coming Friday night, which ought to be close to peak demand time, and just throw several metric kiloshitloads of stuff into your download queues. Everybody, all at once. I think some of NBC’s stuff is downloadable ([www.nbc.com]). Update your WoW. Put Windows XP SP3 in there too. Bring the whole motherfucking network to its knees. Post a message to every blog you read and spread the word, starting with this one. That’ll learn ‘em.
It’s interesting to note one thing: if the limit is based on using more than 99.9% of other users, if everyone stopped using their connection for whatever reason, if you downloaded even one byte you’d be screwed over. And I doubt that Comcast would be nice enough to be reasonable about that.
@sgodun: try reading a little better. the faq for bandwidth limits is the third item on that last. click on that and you will see eleven items, not all of which even have answer.
FTA: It’s amazing that Comcast admits that 1 user with a premium account can have a “direct negative impact on 99.9% of Comcast’s 14 million nationwide customers”.
1 customer can bring down Comcast.
And I thought losing a war for lack of a nail was pretty bad.
@SkokieGuy: That kind of thing could never happen in this country….
wait.
Median usage is 2gb a month? Who are these people? Do they even turn their computers on?
I now have comcast since they bought out insight in my area – and got a similar thing from insight.
Comcast can solve this issue (for me and I guess may others) very simply: Tell us what the limit is.
If Comcast says you should not upload more then XX a month (a day/hour/etc…), it is easy enough to put a tool in place to limit that to what comcast wants.
But Comcast will tell us once when we are over, threaten to discounted us if we go over again…. but WILL NOT tell us what the number is that takes us over?????
I’ve read somewhere else that they mostly look at upload amount – so I’ve basically been a VERY big downloader, and not as much uploading…. and I have not gotten a call from Insight/Comcast since.
…. but still would be nice to know what that limit is instead of me just guessing what might and might not be acceptable in their eyes.
@SkokieGuy: You’re right!
Waitress: You used to much sugar/catsup/? (how do you know) I can’t tell you. (how much is too much) That’s proprietary information.
@MitchV: Actually, the tier’s for Comcast provide you with a faster download speed and upload speed. Most people are never able to take advantage of the maximums, but they do provide better upwards limits.
That said, I find it hard to believe one person could be adversely affecting the entire country. Is that really how Comcast works?
Interesting how this works in the US. I find download limits ridiculous, but have to live with them in Belgium. Here you get higher limits if you have a higher connection speed, additionally, at any point in time can I see how much for that month I have used of my 30Gb limit and I can by blocks of 5Gb extra download for that month if I need / want to. Also, you are not cut off if you exceed the limit, they just throttle you down to 256kbps until the end of the month. For some “slower” connection subscription, unlimited really means unlimited, as you can never exceed x GB based on your speed of connection. Pretty neat and very transparent!
@SkokieGuy:
Your example:
Guantanamo Bay: You’re under arrest (why) We can’t tell you…………
Actually, this one’s true…oops!
Some people brought up a great point of deaf/hard-of-hearing people using a lot of video; another missing piece is people using the Yahoo Voice Messenger to talk with family members around the world. A lot of people that I know spend hours on end talking with family all around the world with Yahoo or MSN or similar products. They’ve got to be using a significant amount of bandwidth as well.
until they actually implement the supposed 250GB cap, using their own FAQ math, it would appear that the cap is 200GB:
1) 1,000 pictures = 10GB
2) excessive use = 20,000 pictures
Therefore, excessive use is (20,000 pics/1,000 pics)x10GB = 200GB
@AraCBR: I’m assuming you mean “worst company” award.
No, they can’t get it. I have Ticketmaster beating them out in the next round!
I honestly believe Comcast doesn’t know. I’m convinced that when a company stonewalls like this it’s because they don’t have the info and they know they should. Admitting they don’t have it means they can be sued for enforcing a cap they can’t verify.
Their whole system is bullshit. In today’s day and age you can kill that median of 2GB in no time. Any savvy household with a couple of computers, a couple of computers running various apps and maybe an IPhone or two running off the wireless router and you’re done.
It would be so funny to watch Comcast try to explain why they don’t have the answers and why they are enforcing a cap they can’t establish or justify.
This company is an evil, soul-sucking pile of crap and I hope they fall head first into some sort of scandal soon.
All I can say is… Peter’s right bicep must be HUGE.
HUGE.
Oops, that sentence should be “a couple of consoles, a couple of computers running various apps…”