DirecTV is a lying pack of liars. They told Ian that if he moved to a place where he couldn’t use his dish, then they would let him out of contract without early termination fee (ETF). Well guess what? He moved to a place without a balcony or roof access. Double guess what: Now DirecTV says he has to pay an ETF and they say there’s no record of all those reps telling him that, and that that’s not part of their policy. Triple guess what: Ian called up DirecTV sales and recorded their sales rep telling him that they DO let you out of contract if you move to a new place where you can’t use DirecTV. Are DirecTV retention reps just not versed on company policy, or are they a pack of scumbags? I dunno, but you know what they say, never trust a company run by a man in a mustache. Ian’s audio recording and letter to the CEO of DirecTV is inside…
Dear Consumerist,
I signed up for DirecTV in September of last year and have, until today, loved the service. Unfortunately, my girlfriend and I are moving to an apartment without a balcony or access to the roof and are prohibited from bringing our dish with us. Consequently, I’m forced to leave DirecTV’s best-of-breed HDTV for Comcast’s worst-of-breed YouTube-quality mush.
When I first spoke with a representative (ID #410930) about the service and its two year commitment, I was told that if I eventually moved to a place where I was unable to use the service the early termination fee (ETF) would be waived. About two months ago I again called DirecTV and, while making a minor change to my account, verbally confirmed with a service representative (ID #413117) that the ETF would be waived if that happened to be the case.
Yesterday, after double checking with my landlord that there was no chance I could install the dish, I reluctantly called DirecTV to cancel… only to find out that they won’t waive the ETF. “Robby” (ID #402875) claimed to be the account supervisor despite being a first line representative and insisted that his own supervisor (ID #U2985) “doesn’t get on the phones.” He claimed that he could find no record in either of the previous call logs that I been offered a waived ETF. Another call this morning to DirecTV customer service found them in agreement: my ETF would not be waived. And, sure enough, the DirecTV Service Agreement makes no mention of moving to an apartment or area incapable of properly positioning the dish.
However, since I had already been lied to twice by DirecTV representatives I figured that I should call their sales department. So, this morning I called their sales number pretending to order new service and inquired as to whether or not there would be an ETF if I eventually moved to an area without service. Essentially, I replicated my initial sales call with DirecTV from seven months ago, but this time with a recording device.
Sure enough, the sales representative I spoke with repeatedly assured me that the fee would be waived if I were to move to a home that I could not get service at. So, at least DirecTV sales is consistent about giving false information. It should be noted that this representative was the rule, not the exception: all four times I have asked DirecTV sales people about the ETF waiver and all four times I have received the same incorrect response.
When I called retentions back and pointed out that I’d been told this repeatedly and had a recording, I was told that there was nothing that could be done except that a note would be made in my account and a higher up emailed.
If DirecTV’s customer service representatives had simply been honest with me I wouldn’t really have anything to complain about– I’d just pay my ETF without complaint. But the fact that sales and retention tell customers starkly different things about the service commitment is troubling, to say the least. I would have switched back to DirecTV the moment that I moved to an accommodating home, but why would I choose to do further business with a company whose representatives are apparently coached to lie?
Hopefully your readers won’t make the same mistake I made: make sure anything that any DirecTV representative tells you is backed up in writing. Because even if you record them promising something they won’t honor it. And if you do post anything about this, please remove my personal information.
Sincerely,
Ian
DirecTV Account #[redacted]P.S. Neither representative could tell me exactly how much my final bill would be, even after I gave them a firm cancellation date. I was told “around $200″, but at this point I have no reason to believe that this is the actual amount I’ll be charged.
P.P.S. The ID numbers were given to me over the phone by “Robby”.
Also, my service appears to have just been turned off– five days early (termination date was April 29). I confirmed that it was set for the 29th with two representatives. I can’t even access my recorded shows on my DVR since they are dependent upon an active service. I’m calling DirecTV again now.
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Pwned.
Ben – you may want to redact his account # at the bottom of his message…
EVIL!!!
I like how he recorded the rep…yet it didn’t matter.
He should compile recordings of a dozen reps saying this…just to show it wasn’t a fluke.
Ah DirectTV, bringing the customer friendly policies of the wireless providers to the television market.
The only sleazy trick they need to add is the “high pressure pitch for an extended warranty” and/or “we involuntarily extend your contract any time you contact us” and their evil company Bingo card will be a winner.
I hope they don’t give the Cable companies any ideas. . .
But Mr. DirecTV needs that ETF money. With the cost of oil these days, mustache wax prices have gone through the roof!
Sounds like a good time to pull out the old EECB. Maybe companies are going deaf to it, but with the recording of their own rep telling a customer that, maybe it’ll work. I also hope he lives in a state with one-party consent for recording those things. The courts are still kinda up in the air about whether those are admissible in court….
This is so disgusting. It makes me sick. Hey DirecTV – You think your customer service is better than cable? I guess it’s not too hard to high jump over a garden hose – but guess what…you still suck!
If this isn’t a case for small claims court, I don’t know what is.
DirecTV is a bad, bad company. I’m not surprised at this at all. Great post!
Quadruple guess what – it’s illegal to record someone without their consent.
Quintuple guess what – he should have requested it, in writing, when the first rep told him that he would not have to pay the ETF.
that moustache is FABULOUS.
I like how in a letter about DirectTV, the OP still manages a dig against Comcast. It must be a Consumerist pre-requisite.
“DIRECTV” is a pile of shit company and needs to go away.
Fun fact: I sent my two receivers back in mid-December. One of them took a little while longer to get there so I was charged for it. Phone call in early January gets me a refund promise. Phone call in late January gets me another refund promise. Just last week, refund comes.
Directv used to be no hassles (like 10 years ago) then they started forcing people on contracts and they stink worse than the cable company.
“Thank you for your comments! We take all customer feedback very seriously. Even though you have chosen not to receive a response to your email, be assured that your feedback will be reviewed by the appropriate department.”
VERY seriously.
@thesabre: And that written request would either be “on its way” and never come after you sign up or “one its way” and never come while you wait to sign up.
@thesabre:
Actually it depends on the state your in as to the legality (1 or 2 party) recording…..see
[www.rcfp.org]
Assuming the OP wants to stay with DirectTV, kinda guessing c ause they praise DirectTV in the beginning, thanks to the FCC, their landlord is required by law to let them mount the dish on an exterior wall, so they shouldn’t have to leave at all.
@thesabre: Quadruple guess what – it’s not illegal to record someone without their consent if you’re in a single-consent state such as Texas.
plus, if they say “your call may be recorded for quality assurance” doesn’t that mean they are giving permission to record?
@Troas: no. we already went through this. go back through the archives.
Even if it’s two party consent, because the call opens with ‘your call may be recorded for quality assurance’, the rep, by taking the call has given his consent.
It would only be illegal if the DirectTV rep somehow could be proven not to know his own company may be recording the call. – IMHO
@SkokieGuy: IMHO = IANAL
when misinformation like this is given through a call center you can always ask that your calls be reviewed for accuracy. many times when errors are found on behalf of the company they will correct them, hopefully in a timely manner. either way, this complaint should be sent or faxed to the company… and labeled as a complaint.
My mom recently got DirectTV and the person she initially talked to promised her she’d get local channels. It even said so on the brochure. After it’s hooked up, she notices she’s not getting local channels. When she calls to ask for them, they explain that she couldn’t get local channels in her area. She was then told she would have to pay to terminate the contact, even though she was lied to. It’s ridiculous that they get away with this. I will never get DirectTV.
STOP THE HIJACK!
i justlooked at the agreement here –> [www.directv.com] for an escape clause/remorse clause…SOMETHING that might help this guy out. no dice.
& incidentally, even if you don’t have to pay the ETF, there’s a DISCONNECT fee. bastards.
however, i would consider mentioning to some higher ups at DTV that you are considering making a statement to your state AG’s office & including the tapes b/c you feel their product has been misrepresented.
@chalpin: What if the other person is in a two-party state?
Diabeetus!
Escalate, Escalate, Escalate… He needs to keep going up the ladder until he gets a proper resolution to this issue.
@thesabre: Bub, you fail. There are 31 states with single-consent recording laws, the remainder have dual-consent laws. The only exception is in the case of a tap with a duly assigned warrant.
@macinjosh: I recall from discussions in previous articles that there is some disagreement on this one: Most people would think (perhaps correctly) that a call across state lines would invoke federal laws (one-party consent), but the courts in at least one of the two-party states (can’t remember which) have indicated that the more conservative state law must be followed if the recording is to be used in legal proceedings in that state – i.e. if any party to the call is in a two-party state, everyone must be notified that the call is recorded.
Also, I don’t think the issue of “the machine voice saying ‘This call may be recorded’ = permission to record” has been resolved in the courts at all.
And finally, just to nit-pick a bit…it’s not really about one-party vs. two-party laws…it’s actually one-party vs. all-party. I wouldn’t want someone to think that a 3-way call with 2 of the 3 people getting notification of recording is legal in an all-party state, just b/c we all refer to it as a two-party state.
@macinjosh: If the person doing the recording is in a single-consent state, the status, intent and location of the other party is irrelevant.
Wow, makes me appreciate DishNetwork that much more. My wife and I had it, and loved it, but we had to move out of state to an apartment that would couldn’t mount a dish at. DishNetwork not only waived the early cancelation fee, but sent us shipping paid boxed to send the leased equipement back in. And since I have Timewarner now, you can image who I’ll be going back to as soon as we’re back in a house.
The old adage: “Get it in writing”.
IANAL, but the real question to me isn’t one-party vs two-party, but rather who the parties are (and arguably, what you consent to). If the parties are the rep and the customer, the rep has consented to recording as a condition of employment. (Whether this applies to recording by the customer is a potentially sticky issue, however.) If, on the other hand, the company itself is considered a party to the call, then it’s much trickier. (Does recording the call yourself grant implied consent to record?)
@B: True. However, the dish also needs to be able to point to the satellite, the OP may not be living on the right side of the building or there may be trees in the way that the landlord doesn’t want to trim. Not sure exactly what the OP is having difficulty with here.
@thesabre:
Sextuple – In 38 out of 50 states, it’s not illegal to record a call without both parties consent. Only one party has to be aware.
@Pithlit: I hear you. I was promised the same thing and I raised holy ruckus. I called them beforehand, and asked if I would get locals, which the answer was yes. I bought and installed the dish myself, called to activate the box and they told me no locals for YOU!!
I got them to put thru a waiver for NBC and FOX out of NY and L.A. Works for me, all I wanted to do was watch Nascar and House, haha. I also got them to give me a $4.95 credit every month, because my package included locals and I couldn’t get them and I had to pay for NBC and FOX seperately. So it all worked out, sorta.
@mtaylor924: They tell you “this call may be monitored or recorded” so granting you permission.
@pithlit & verucalise: Keep fighting this. They told my parents the same thing, but they now have local channels, so it CAN be done. They just don’t want to.
Mustache rides!!!
Comment on DirecTV Makes You Pay Termination Fee Even If You Can’t Use Their Service Regarding the early termination date, my parents cancelled DirecTV in
favor of Comcast (don’t even ask me why, I don’t know). DirecTV,
which had been awesome up to that point, cancelled their TV and
internet services not five, six, or seven days, but ten solid days
early.
Of course, when my parents called Comcast to see if they could get
someone to come to their house sooner than previously arranged, they
not only said not a ice cube’s chance in hell, they never showed up
on the arranged date and didn’t manage to hook it up until a week later.
Well, you win some, you…
Okay, really? You lose them all. But people gotta have their teevee.
@weakdome: I participated in the discussion, and I don’t think we resolved what effect “this call may be recorded for quality assurance purposes” has in an all-party consent state.
As mtaylor924 points out, this hasn’t been resolved in *any* state.
My $0.02 is that (1) there’s an available interpretation of that recording which *does* give permission, (2) the legislative intent of all-party-consent laws is simply not targeted at this type of commercial conversation, and (3) the fact of third-party monitoring by the call recipient’s supervisors further weakens the the expectation of privacy that is driving the intent of these laws.
When you combine what is arguably permission with the very weak claim that such caller recording is related to the motivation for the law, I’d be very, very surprised to see someone be prosecuted, much less convicted, for recording this type of call.
Moreover, think of the blowback on the company pursuing such a claim. This, more than anything, probably explains why this has never been litigated.
Here’s Illinois law. My reading of it seems to imply that one party can record, however you basically can’t use the information in any way, and the person recording must delete within 24 hours, unless it meets the exemptions listed.
Here’s an excerpt. The activity is criminal unless it meets the following criteria:
(j) The use of a telephone monitoring device by either (1)
a corporation or other business entity engaged in marketing or
opinion research or (2) a corporation or other business entity
engaged in telephone solicitation, as defined in this
subsection, to record or listen to oral telephone solicitation
conversations or marketing or opinion research conversations
by an employee of the corporation or other business entity
when:
(i) the monitoring is used for the purpose of service
quality control of marketing or opinion research or
telephone solicitation, the education or training of
employees or contractors engaged in marketing or opinion
research or telephone solicitation, or internal research
related to marketing or opinion research or telephone
solicitation; and
(ii) the monitoring is used with the consent of at
least one person who is an active party to the marketing or
opinion research conversation or telephone solicitation
conversation being monitored.
No communication or conversation or any part, portion, or
aspect of the communication or conversation made, acquired, or
obtained, directly or indirectly, under this exemption (j), may
be, directly or indirectly, furnished to any law enforcement
officer, agency, or official for any purpose or used in any
inquiry or investigation, or used, directly or indirectly, in
any administrative, judicial, or other proceeding, or divulged
to any third party.
When recording or listening authorized by this subsection
(j) on telephone lines used for marketing or opinion research
or telephone solicitation purposes results in recording or
listening to a conversation that does not relate to marketing
or opinion research or telephone solicitation; the person
recording or listening shall, immediately upon determining
that the conversation does not relate to marketing or opinion
research or telephone solicitation, terminate the recording or
listening and destroy any such recording as soon as is
practicable. Here’s the link: [www.ilga.gov]
@nursethalia: Mustache rides: five cents*
*Per month, with purchase of two year mustache ride contract. Actual price may vary, depending on options, state and local taxes. $175 Early Termination fee charged for cancellation of the contract for any reason.
@salguod_senrab: I pretty much agree with what you said. I think that, in general, it should not be illegal to record the telephone conversations that one has with a business when acting as a customer of that business. It simply would help to provide some form of communication record or accountability in the same way that a saved e-mail conversation can.
It seems to me that the law in question was written when specifically thinking about telephone communications between two private parties (with no business relationship), which I think still probably should be covered.
But that’s just my opinion
A buddy of mine worked in sales for Earthlink about five years ago. At that time the salespeople were given a bonus based on the number of subscribers they had added that month.
Here’s the kicker, if the salesperson lied to get a the sale (offering services that were not available for that area for example) and the account was soon closed, the sales person still kept the bonus. There was no retroactive accounting.
Basically, once the sale is made, they get credit for it even if the entire sale is fraudulent.
Seems like the same thing is going on here.
Almost the EXACT same thing happened to me! My apartment manager wouldn’t allow me to install the dish at my new place, so I had to cancel 1 year early. Directv tells me that’s fine, but to write their legal dept.(Attn: Billing Disputes P.O. Box 6550 Greenwood Village, CO 80155) and ask for a waiver. 1 week later I get a message telling me how sorry they are and that I’ll be free of their ETF.
Guess what? My next bill has the ETF charged directly to my credit card. So, I call, tell them that legal already exempted me, and to refund me immediately. My next bill has a “Fee Reversal” shown, but no credit back to my card. The bill after that shows a “Programming Adjustment” negating the refund.
Call after call over 5 months and they wouldn’t send my refund even though they agreed to. So I took consumerists advice sent the dreaded Executive Email CB.
Triple Guess What? Carey’s assistant in the “office of teh president” calls me personally the very next day to tell me that indeed I would be receiving a credit to my card within 2-3 days, even though I was “charged correctly”.
I guess they didn’t want to be charged for mail fraud. Escalation is key my friends.
[www.dearchase.com]
directv are lying, predatory, evil scumbags.
They tried the same thing o me. I wanted a one year contract because I expect to be moving to Canada at the end of the year. They assured me (supervisor approved) that under the circumstances I would be able to cancel the contract after 12 months with no penalties. They came to install and of course I was asked to sign a 24 month contract. I refused to sign since I could not committ to 24 months and I certainly did not want to pay the hefty cancellation penalty that does not decrease even if you have paid for 23 months. I escalated to the president, and his lackeys called back. They apologized for the confusion and did not know how someone could have agreed to 12 months. They ONLY Have 24 month contracts, I was told. So I bought myself an HD antenna and I get great reception for free.