The full repair bill is posted on 8thCivic’s forums.
VTECnical’s Circuit City Road Shop installation [8thCivic.com]
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According to edmunds.com, a 2007 Civic si runs about 18k. I realize the labor and complexity of the problem makes this repair bill high, but he could practically get a new one for the 12k quoted. YIKES!
Circuit City did a significant amount of damage to a brand new car (that I had just spent $30,000 on) that I brought in for an alarm installation. They did this after upping the price from the initial quote several times. They also messed around with wiring around side impact airbags, which raised a safety concern. When I complained about it I was told “it is what it is.” I had to contact corporate and play phone tag with the store director who eventually agreed to pay for an inspection, and a manager did what he could to cover up some of the damage. They gave me a $20 gift card to make up for the experience, but weren’t really willing to do anything else.
Never again will I set foot into another Circuit City.
i like the 900 dollars for tax…that’s really brutal
@scoobydoo:
He makes it sound like the car was ready to explode, when in reality it was just some wire splicing to make connectors compatible. In the worst case the fuses would pop, but it’s hardly something that would go up in flames.
As a lawyer, I have defended property damage / fire cases on behalf of a major U.S. auto manufacturer. I’d say at least half of the 100+ cases I worked on involved fires caused by after-market modifications such as new stereos, roof-top lights, sirens (for a volunteer firefighter), speakers, etc. Trust me: the worst-case scenario does not involve a mere popping of a fuse. Worse case scenarios involve a fire sparking while the car is parked in a family garage and the fire spreads to the rest of the house. Word of advice to anyone who has work performed by someone like Best Buy or Circuit City: if anything electrical goes wrong after the work is done on the car, the manufacturer will point to the after-market work as a probable cause of the problem.
This is not 12k worth of Damage, Trough SIL, they will replace the Harness.
Understand people that those Double DIN Headunits rarely ever fit. I agree with him that they should have ordered the Metra 80 Series Honda Harness, then modified the harness, because the Video Headunit harnesses are different than standard headunits, I bet he is freaked out about how the VSS wire had to go to the Tachometer, like it says in the Manual, or the Video Brake Wire went to the brake, required by law.
speakers are not a problem, thats how they are done, minus the tweeters, those should have been glued in.
2k damage tops ….. maybe
Labor: 44 hours
Diagnostic: 5 hours
Sweet.
something doesn’t add up here, would not be surprised if the “victim” is trying to scam CC and the installers are in on it.
A friend of mine had a stereo put in by Circuit City… she was twenty minutes away when it erupted and gouts of flame came out of the heating vents at her. It’s be awesome in a film, but damned if it wasn’t a traumatic thing to deal with, especially since it was a new (used) car she’d just gotten *maybe* a month previously.
long ago…in a far away land… i used to install stuff at circuit city…. i got hired with no experience… didn’t know squat about what i was doing… and while most work was done decently by the staff and a few staff members where really good at what they did… I have seen a 30k disaster before…. lets just say that not only was the sound system done wrong, including alarm, multiple screens and a 6 15″ set up, some how a heater fan plate cover from the ceiling came of and did some serious damage to the vehicle… oh and some one used screws to long to drill speakers in and the guy had screws sticking out of his car….but hey its circuit city, so this isn’t surprising…Oh and I didn’t install it… it was the manager.
That’s too bad but it was an amateur job. It took a Honda dealer to do that much damage to my Honda and you expect that from professionals.
The original CC I worked at, had a good installation crew. Always got their stuff done, and the installers new the ins and outs of everything. Go 0450!
The second CC I worked at, was full of incompetent college kids, whom only succeeded in drilling a hole into a customer’s gas tank, and then denied any wrong-doing. Geniuses, I tell you.
@carterbeauford: I think this is standard operating procedure when dealing with insurance companies. The dealers all know the insurance companies aren’t going to be happy unless they bargain them down, so they start with an inflated estimate. It’s sort of like how you always overprice stuff a little at a garage sale because everyone wants to haggle and feel like they got a deal.
@Frostberg: And you think Circuit City really cares? lol
I work for Circuit City and I’ve seen some of the stuff that goes on. However, the installers at Firedog Car (which is now the new name of Road Shop) at my Circuit City are very knownledgable on how to install units into cars and they verify every needed material or equipment by taking a look at the customer’s car BEFOREHAND, to avoid such problems later on.
Sorry to hear about the damages to your car VTECnical, but I hope this problem gets stored out quick. I’m a member on 8th Gen and I’m glad Consumerist wrote up about your problem. I have brought up this problem to the managers at my Circuit City, and I will be informing my district manager as well, so that managers can avoid their Firedog Car installer’s problems such as this.
Good luck to you bro!
@schwnj: Um they kind of destroyed the dash. Do you have any idea what a replacement dash, all the wiring, plus labor is worth? Try putting a small ding in your car and take it to the dealership for your four figure surprise. I can PROMISE you that the dash alone is probably several thousand dollars from the dealership and most of the front end of that car is going to have to come apart to replace that wiring harness. This is a HUGE job.
Holy shit…
Why the hell would you go to a place like Circuit City for something like this?
Other than buying a product from them and taking it home in my own car, I wouldn’t trust anything they offer.
@sled_dog: This information has only been discovered recently. It took the awhile but they finally linked all the pieces together when they noticed the 747′s wire insulation is cracking throughout the airplane.
@spinachdip: whether they are or not (I don’t know—I like my non-performance Volvo brick), we’re dealing with power tools used to cut up things inside the car. Wholly different thing from performance tuning, or even working on the interior with caution and respect for the vehicle.
@Buran: they’ll mount to the dash, but not safely enough to stay there in a wreck that will cause it to fly off with a suction-cup mount. My garmin has been through one wreck. The suction cup stayed on, and the GPS came off the mount. Sample size of 1, but I doubt the dash mount is any safer. Also, it’s a little 5oz piece of plastic 4x or more the size of my cell phone.
I’ll worry about many things in a wreck. Whether anyone got hurt by my Nuvi will not be among them.
I will never ever let CC install anything, I paid $300 bucks to have them re-install my old stereo and amp and 12″ sub into the my new-Used civic, crappy install, dash cover kept coming out, various holes that were not there before suddenly were there after the install. 80% of the clips were busted so the bottom panel of my dash (its a panle that removes) hangs now.
Crappy, crappy, crappy never again. I will install it myself if I have to because at least I know I wont screw up my car. Though it will take me longer to install it.
Ouch. That’s why I’m never getting rid of my 42-year-old VW. Less stuff to go wrong and if it does I can fix it myself.
I’d kill for an Audi R8 though, to be honest.
@uberbucket: Yeah, but if you had an R8 there’s no way you’d let a grease monkey at Circuit City touch it.
@MustyBuckets, @timmus:
I think all of you who are bashing the dealership and vtecnical are absolutely ridiculous. He’s dumb for letting a supposedly reputable company install a nav system via there trained “professionals”? Sure it isn’t brain surgery, but it is a brand new car, why risk damaging something you may not know about? I’ve done dozens of installs, but when it came to my new commander i left it to the pros. I’d much rather see them at fault then me. Secondly, you honestly think the dealership is inflating the price? It doesn’t matter if it takes 16 hours to build it, it has to be gutted just to replace the harness. You clearly don’t understand the type of work that entails, ie breaking spot welds and removing permanent fixtures etc to remove the harness. That car is going to be completely torn apart in the process. The new civic is digital everything and completely computer controlled, so bashing honda for building an exceptional product is out of line as well. vtecnical posted this to warn you fellow “educated” consumers about the shoddy work CC did to a trusting customer, not open up a bashing ground for him and those trying to repair the damage sustained to his vehicle. Go bash shit on your little blogs, not where people look for advice.
I am the shop manager for a small box store. We specialize in aftermarket accessories and we do a LOT of dealer work. Many vehicles are ordered in lots by dealerships based on what the sales manager thinks might be popular options and than the dealership will simply have the features the customers require/desire added. This is one reason why simply ordering the car with Nav is not always an option. Especially with desirable cars like Civics (I don’t like them but I know they are popular).
It wouldn’t matter if your new vehicle came with a sound system designed by EAW or Crest. Someone would want something different. That is why Circuit City and its varied competitors like myself exist.
Vehicles get more complicated because of this industry. Manufacturers produce a car that is popular, people buy the car, they add stuff to it then they sell it and when they go buy the next one they say hey I had this item installed in my last car can I just get it from the factory that way, the salesman says let me check, he makes some calls and somewhere along the lines the information get to someone in corportae marketing who passes the Idea off to an engineer. the following year… somebody else buys it and says this system is cool but can you make it do this… I am sure you see where this is going.
Of course this design cycle is fine if you don’t mind waiting for the latest creature comforts and are willing to pay (in many cases) several times what the aftermarket equivalent would cost you.
Documentation for new vehicles often does not become available for six months to one year from when they hit the market. In some cases this will be right at the beginning of the year as companies like Chrysler will release the next model year of vehicles as dealer demos as early as January of the previous year. IE I worked on a ’07 Jeep in Feb of ’06 (I Sh*t you not).
There are many cases where an installation requires cutting a harness (and usually splicing in something like a diode) to prevent back feeding or high quiescent draw. Also there are still other cases where plugs simply are not available.
Aftermarket shops are getting a bad reputation and not all of it is undeserved, the trade of auto electric is not terribly profitable, to do the job well you actually have to understand how electronics work. And most people who do have degrees and don’t work on cars. I don’t care if you go to a big box store or a small box store (or even a dealership for that matter) there is always a chance that you will end up with an idiot working on your car. Circuit City does pay it’s people next to nothing but… so does everybody else. This industry is a very small pie divided into a LOT of very small pieces. Everyone wants to do the work, everyone thinks they know what they are doing and everyone thinks they can do it for less.
Most dealership technicians went to some sort of tech college or at the very least some company sponsored training that teaches them the basics of electrical trouble-shooting. After this they use programs like AllData which uses step by step procedures to diagnose and fix the problem reported. This is a lot like when you use the Microsoft help problem solver to fix a printer problem (only this works). You don’t really have to know anything to use these procedures and in many cases they will fix the problem. When you don’t use a skill set you lose it. It is not that they are being userous or even that they are incompetent, the system is set up in such a way that understanding and rational thought is not required. I troubleshoot many problems for my local dealerships, many of those problems are with factory integration of aftermarket components and repairs of just this sort.
The dealerships is there to make money, they are almost certainly a corporation and corporations are bound by their charter to be as profitable as possible. The dealership pays their technicians on commission (usually) and the more labor items they can generate the more their technicians make. The service writer will in many cases get a sales commission on the labor dollars he bills out for his technicians. They wont generally replace something that isn’t broken or at least suspect but sometimes replacing one thing necessitates replacing other things and some things are actually cheaper as assemblies.
Now if I were a service writer and this job came my way there is one of two ways to handle this…
I could do the bare minimum and replace the harness (or sublet a repair if it is simply a wire diked out of a connector) and any other broken or non repairable Items such as heater controls and vents and bill straight time (the actual time required to do the job). I might have the scratches polished out of the glass (yes, you can do this). Also sublet the panel scratches to a paint-less dent guy who can probably repair them (I have been very impressed). This is most likely what I would do if the work was being done directly for the customer.
I could also nit pick what is broken and scratched Itemize it and bill book time for what is to be replaced. This is what I would do if it is a warranty job. It is more profitable and the warranty company won’t balk at the price. My guess is this is what happened.
In some cases a dealership will use justifiable labor Items that they would normally wave to inflate a bill to a specific number like 10’000$ because this will change which insurance company processes the claim (an umbrella policy insurer instead of a general warranty company). They will also do this if they feel that there is a defective part that they cant really justify replacing like the casing of a transmission or a sub-dash assembly. If a dealership feels the vehicle may come back for something else in the future relating to the repair they may also use this technique to walk the job so they don’t incur liability for the problem.
As for spelling, grammar and arithmetic… very few of the tech savvy people I know can spell or understand proper grammar. Still not terribly reassuring that they cant add.
Factory parts are expensive because no-one wants them. Yes… no-one except the warranty company, who doesn’t question price. Most things like alternators and brakes are very quickly offered by a third party manufacturer insuring that there will not be a high demand for these factory Items which are usually manufactured at the same time as all the other components which comprise a new vehicle they and then stored someplace for an indefinite period of time, where as the aftermarket parts are made in lots in a sort of quasi on-demand sort of fashion or they are simply remanufactured (possibly being substituted for another *cheaper/more available* part as a retrofit kit).
Considdering that it is the ‘right’ parts and a dealership technician… 12K$ I don’t find this figure surprising or even unreasonable. It is probably a bit userous but I don’t think it is as bad as everyone is making it out to be.
There’s no doubt in my mind that the money they already refunded him would cover the repairs. Circuit City messed up, but there’s some major BS going on here.
i have not ONE IOTA of remorse for anyone who takes their car to a box store with an illiterate 17 year old to go monkeying about in their dashboard. it serves you right cheapskate. too bad CC won’t come correct and pay for the damage they caused.
caveat emptor. YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR.
I’m not even arguing about the cost of the car or the cost of the damages, but you can’t charge tax on the labor.
So assuming 6009.75 for parts, Glen Head has a tax rate of 8.625. Tax then is 518.34. Labor is 49 hours X 95 (standard rate) an hour for 4655.00. I’m not sure what that 300 dollar charge is for, but without that it should be 11183.09.
That all being said – CC will not cover for scratched moon roofs or scratched windshields. That’s probably his own fault anyway.
It’s painfully obvious that most of the people leaving comments here don’t know much about car stereo installation.
Is it a bit half-assed? Yep. Should they have ordered a wiring harness adapter? Sure. However, if you don’t have one on hand and your customer wants the instant gratification, what are you going to do? You’re going to do what we did for years and years before they even started making harness adapters: splice.
There’s absolutely no obvious reason to think that’s a fire hazard. Could it be? Sure, if it’s blatantly mis-wired and had the fuse replaced with something substantially bigger (like a foil gum wrapper, MacGuyver…). Otherwise, it just sounds like the dealer is wildly overstating the issue.
Why would a dealer overstate things? 1) To scare the customer into using the dealer’s services now and in the future, 2) To get an assload of money out of it via the customer suing Circuit City, and 3) To give themselves an ‘out’ if *anything* crops up under warranty.
As for the supposedly ruined heating duct. That was another low-quality job, but what are you going to tell the customer? “Sorry, it just don’t fit.” Nope, you’re going to make it fit, and patch it up so that it’s functional. They could have fiberglassed it, but I suspect he wouldn’t be happy with the labor charges involved.
Finally, regarding the door panels, it’s *completely* normal to cut off the stock, proprietary door speaker connectors and use some quick connectors to connect to the aftermarket speakers. Claiming that this damages a car is just plain silly and blatantly inflammatory. And it’s pretty inevitable that you’ll break a few tabs when removing all the interior body work. If you don’t believe me, try doing it yourself.
This really sounds like a dealer that’s happy to overstate things to make a buck, a wholly uninformed and inflammatory costumer, and an installer who did an imperfect, but functional job.
Apologies if it’s already been posted….
Can’t the OP call the police and file charges against Circuit City for vandalism?
Or call a lawyer…Circuit City did NOT fulfill their contractual obligations…didn’t install the unit.
Finally…who is in charge of auto garages? File a complaint with whatever board or industry regulates or licenses people to work in that field. Worth a shot.
@ElJefe: Sounds to me like you just described a shitty installation, sir.
@ElJefe: Also, your point about “Well, the customer would’ve been mad if we had taken the time to do the job properly with the tools that should’ve been available in the first place” just makes you sound like an overall dick.
Could the dealership also be exacerbating the situation. Yeah, that’s what dealerships do. But don’t think that annuls CC’s crappy job.
Blame the victim more.
@Riddler: As a former installer of mobile radios, police sirens, emergency lights and that kind of thing, I assure you I’ve seen some really scary things…like unfused 10 gauge wires running right to the battery through jagged metal holes cut in the firewall. It’s a wonder that half the nation’s emergency vehicles don’t spontaneously erupt in flames.
The only connections I’d ever make to the vehicle electrical system were to a switched 12 volt point in the fuse box using a piggyback fuse tap at the electrical panel (and possibly to the headlamp system for cruiser headlamp flashers.
In ever single case, if there was an electrical malfunction, the dealer would instantly point the finger at the aftermarket equipment.
I work for a municipality now and I’m still having a hell of a time convincing the installer to fuse the equipment right at the battery terminal, NOT under the carpet. Nothing scares me like 5 feet of unfused wire fed directly to the battery AND having it run under the passenger’s side carpet.
Remember the Ford recall? The cruise control switch would short out, sparking a fire which (if I recall) took several houses with it because the truck had been parked in the garage.
Whatever possessed this guy to take leave of his senses and have such damage done to his car? Whoa. 12K is a bit much, need at least two more estimates and what after-market stuff did the owner put in and what damage pre-existed?
@blueboxer: Usually an adapter harness can be found that plugs right into the original harness. I can see the damage happening as most modern cars interiors were designed to be put together once, not taken apart, especially by unskilled labor. It is why I live with my left speakers not working. It’s just not worth it to tear it apart.
@carterbeauford: I get that too, smell an inflated estimate.
First off, that is far from a fire hazard. This guy drove around for months with this in his car. Now he goes to the dealer to have it checked. Where was his complaint over the past couple of months about the interior having scratches? That part is bogus on the repair order. This guy is trying to rebuild his car. As for that harness, give my a new pigtail and I would solder that dude to the other harness with some shrink tube and it would be good as new. The only expensive thing in there is the heater box that got cut.
This guy must have forgot the repair order he signed. Most install shops have a disclaimer on it that states you agree to any modifications of the vehicle for the equipment you ask to be installed.
I think Circuit is being generous in giving him $3500. The dealers tech is a douch for asking for 5 hours diagnostics when you can clearly see he has about 30 minutes in it. And the repairs would take about 6-8 hours at the most. Glad that dealer is listed on that repair order so I know where not take my car.
And yes, find someone MECP certified to do any electronic installations in your car.
You are really going to want to update this story. Turns out the guy agreed to everything that was done, and its been a while since it happened. He is just trying to get some help now that the ebay M3 guy got some.
I am one of the installers who did the work on this car. I am MECP certified and have been installing for 10 years now. During the entire installation, the customer was either in the vehicle or standing right beside it. After my other installer removed the dash, we noticed the AVIC-Z2 would not fit due to its depth. I informed the customer, who was watching us work, that the airvents would have to be cut and moved back in order for it to fit. He said to go ahead with it, and was marked on invoice. The vehicle being a 2007, required a new style Honda radio harness that Cirucit City did not carry in stock. We informed the customer that it would have to be ordered, usually taking about a week. The customer told us that he was going on a trip, to St. Louis if I remember correctly, and did not have time to wait. So we told him we would hardwire onto the harness, which is a very standard procedure when the harness is not available. Every wire spliced into is fused just as it was from factory, infact Pioneer has additional fuses inline, so the wires were fused at the fuse boxe, and inline before they went into the radio. Replacing a radio plug in no way makes it a fire hazard. I spoke with the installer who installed the speakers; the front door speakers were screwed in just as any other car, and the tweeters were glued in to the tweeter pods. That installer has been installing for over 5 years and I would trust to work on any of my own cars.
I can go on and on about how redicoulous this entire situation is, but it’s not worth my time. Most of you have already made up your mind about it. I’m just asking that if you choose to believe the dealer (who profitted over $10k from this), and you think I and these other installers do not know what we are doing, please do categorize all Circuit City installers by what one Honda mechanic says about one install.
There have been several comments about Circuit City and MECP certification. I am an installer at Circuit City and have been for more than three years. I have and Advanced MECP certification (thats level 2 of 3 for those of you who dont know) and I will be taking my master exam this year.
Do not assume that all the installers of a particular company have the same training and experience. As the supervisor I would never let horrible work like that leave my shop.
Its unfortunate that my reputation as an installer will go down becuase I work for a company who employs an installer who caused this level of damage.
Why is it that when someone is looking for a mechanic they ask questions about experience, training and previous customer experiences, but when someone needs an accessory installed they just drop it off and hope for the best?
I would hesitate to let a true auto customizer cut holes in my dash let alone Circuit City. Was the guy blinded by the bright lights in the deceptively hightech install garage bay?
SUP DAWG. WE HEARD YOU LIKED TO EXERCISE SO WE KILLED YOUR CAR.
You need to sue Curcuit City if they are not going to handle it. They say it’s not their problem anymore??!! Huh, I’d make it their damn problem.