Reader Anjela writes in wondering if a certain employee of the Apple store has has a rare disorder that makes women invisible to him. That might explain why the employee spent the entire AirBook shopping excursion talking to her husband instead of Anjela—the actual customer.
Anjela writes:
Apple
1 Infinite Loop
Cupertino, CA 95014
408.996.1010Dear Apple:
Today (2/28/2008, at approximately 4:00pm) I walked into the Bellevue Square Apple Store (in Bellevue, WA) intent on buying a MacBook Air. I am delighted by the MacBook Air. I am the geek for whom the MacBook Air was invented. I am a lifelong PC user, and until now the leap to a new, unfamiliar operating system was a roadblock, but for a machine with a full-size keyboard and monitor that comes in at three pounds, I was not just willing to make the switch, I was genuinely excited. (The fact that I don’t want my next laptop to run Vista doesn’t hurt, either.) I’ve been waiting to get one since the day they were announced.
I had a horrific customer service experience in your Bellevue Square store that has me rethinking this idea. I will certainly never set foot in that store again, and I hope I never have to deal with any of your Apple Store employees in person, if this is how they’re trained to treat customers.
The Apple Store “genius” — and I’m offended that he was called that, given the stupendous idiocy he exhibited today — was named Bill. Bill was called over when my husband and I came into the store; I had told the concierge that I was interested in buying a MacBook Air.
Well, first of all, Bill DID NOT LOOK AT ME. He did not greet me. He greeted my husband, introduced himself, and shook his hand… and completely ignored me. He didn’t ask my name, what we were there to buy, or who the new computer was for. He did not make eye contact. He simply behaved as though I were not there, and steered my husband through the crowded store — ignoring me and leaving me behind.
When I caught up to them, he was commencing the hard-sell of “AppleCare”. After being told several times that I was not interested, he asked my husband if he was a Microsoft employee, and pointed out that he could get a 12% discount on it. My husband finally stopped Bill in his tracks and told Bill that the computer was for me. He asked Bill if the education discount, which I qualified for, or the Microsoft employee discount, which my husband qualified for, was a better deal. Bill told my husband that the education discount was better — but continued talking to my husband as if I were not there. Even after being told the computer was for me and that we’d be using my education discount on it, Bill did not greet me, make eye contact with me, or acknowledge my presence in any way.
After scrolling through a screen of peripherals and asking my husband — not me — about each one, and only giving up on selling us the items when my husband — not me — confirmed I was not interested, he muttered something I could not make out (I presume because he was, again, talking to my husband and not myself), and wandered off.
I did not wait for him to come back before leaving the Apple Store. As my husband was not interested in anything at the store, he left, too.
I am a grown woman. I am 29 years old. I was dressed in normal clothes — a plain blue t-shirt, jeans, a flannel overshirt, sneakers. I don’t know how or why this employee could not see me, but I was extremely offended by the way I was treated. I have a credit card. I use computers — in fact, I intended to use the MacBook Air for my volunteer position as a CSS/XHTML coder. I’m the person who walked into the store ready to buy myself a new computer, not my husband. Yet Bill could barely bring himself to look at me, and appeared more interested in selling my husband the peripherals that went along with the computer than in selling me, the actual buyer, the product I was willing to “make the switch” for.
I hope you’ll let the managers at the Bellevue Square store know that women use computers, too, and that if a couple comes into a store to buy one, perhaps it would be a good idea to ask which of them is making a purchase. And if the answer is “a girl”, please tell the employees to talk to her, and not her partner, brother, spouse, or some random guy standing ten feet away from her, as I believe Bill might have done.
I can honestly say I haven’t had a customer service experience this awful for several years (a fast-food restaurant manager who threw a pen at my friend when she asked for his regional manager’s name comes to mind). If I decide to get myself a MacBook Air despite all this — and right now, I’m not sure I will; if Bill’s attitude was typical of what I’ll face should I need technical support or any other sort of customer service from Apple, I don’t want any part of it — I certainly won’t be going to one of your stores to be ignored by an employee; I’ll be ordering it online.
Ew. What a jackass. You’re right to report this employee, and we also would have left without buying the computer, but the next time someone treats you like this—call them out on it right there. There’s no reason sexist jerks should get away with treating you like that. You don’t even need to be rude, just look the jerk in the eye and say, “I’m the one with the money, talk to me. Don’t talk to my husband.” Then, if they don’t get embarrassed and profusely apologize, feel free to calmly explain to them why they have lost your business. We don’t mean to suggest you did something wrong by simply walking out; we offer this advice because standing up for yourself will make you feel a lot better. Trust us. You don’t need to wait for someone else to let the jerks know what is up.
Apple owes you an apology for this employee’s behavior.
(Photo:Plankton 4:20)
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@COELACANTH: I agree completely. This was escalated inappropriately. It was reasonable for her to complain, but it should have been directed to the employee himself or — if she couldn’t bring herself to deal with him directly — the store manager.
@Randal Milholland: P.S. Love your comic
@e-gadgetjunkie: The thing is, guys in the technical community see technically-inclined women as their equals. It’s the joe sixpack misogynist who sees “some girl trying to sell electronics.”
@jeff303: Yes, every single woman who has reported this apparently very widespread problem MUST be mistaken. There’s NO WAY we could be sure that there’s any sexist bias at work in big-box stores even if EVERY woman has trouble getting male sales clerks to talk to her and not any accompanying male. Let’s STICK TO FACTS and not listen to these silly silly women and their anecdotes.
@picardia: Well, every woman DOESN’T have this problem (I’m a woman and I haven’t). Jeff303 is right to point out that there are other possible explanations besides sexism. I don’t get people who are so quick to embrace the victim role.
Well lady, you are buying a Macbook Air so you are a fool anyways.
You should be thankful you got poor customer service and hopefully it keeps you from buying it. Get yourself a Macbook Pro instead!
again, i just don’t agree with this being posted on consumerist. it’s totally the wrong way to go about things. don’t complain to the sales guy himself, or even to his manager – make the assumption that all apple store employees are sexist and send an email to the CEO!
i’ll bet the hot 20 year old secretary steve jobs has reading his email is really fed up!
@redhelix: You may not fault the guy for playing the averages, but I sure will. The man is doing sales, for goodness sake! How good sales people operate is by finding the unique way to treat every individual customer. Order takers and register jockeys can treat customers en masse, but sales people focus on the individual and fulfilling their needs and desires.
If the genius can’t explain to her, regardless of her level of technical comfort or expertise, what options fit her needs and why, then he sucks. If he chooses not to do so because her plumbing is internal, he’s a sexist cad, no matter what prompts that choice (fear, hate, assuming she’s just going to turn the show over to the boy anyway so he’s cutting out the middle man.)
As for me, well, I’m an outspoken wench. Depending on my mood and judgement of what’s causing the rudness, I could do anything from jolly the guy along until he relaxes and treats me like a person to having a heart-to-heart with the manager. I don’t know that I would send my SO away, mainly because he’s not a puppy to be called and sent. He’s the shyer of our little pairing though, so I can see him hanging back while I explain the facts of modern existance. You know, like we can vote and own property and stuff now.
@rochec: Or just save a thousand dollars and buy an equivalent-performance non-mac, heh
@curmudgeon5: agreed. everyone will encounter some bias based on some physical attribute that’s out of their control. humans being human. blaming everything immediately on sexism is unnecessarily inflammatory. she didn’t even attempt to correct the problem at the source, how would she know what was going on with the guy?
Ummm, just another reason to buy an X300?
Sorry, that’s Gizmodo flame bait. Just couldn’t help it…
Meh.
@bdslack: I love it…people want to give a product you’re so slavishly devoted to since the dawn of time a chance and you’re chastising them for asking stupid questions.
You’re like the tool that tells everybody about the awesome new band you’ve found only to get pissed off when everybody else finally discovers them and they ‘sell out’.
I bet your prefer the smell of your own farts to regular oxygen too hmmm?
Back to the topic at hand…sadly this isn’t just an apple thing…it’s an issue with Personal Computer sellers as a whole. My wife and I went in to a shop with a good reputation to buy a PC where I tended to ask most of the question (being more knowledgeable about PCs and being the primary user). The guy was great, the product was great and things were going fine until my wife asked a simple question about something or other and he treated her like a she was about 3 inches tall….At that point, had we bought there, I’d be sleeping on the couch…
I too just had a horrible customer service experience at this exact same store. The woman who “helped” me was extremely rude to another customer who asked for help while she was waiting for me to whip out my credit card. He said he was in a hurry and wondered if she could ring his macbook pro up. She said, “Oh, you’re in a H-U-R-R-Y? That’s why I had your computer brought out from the back so quickly, because I saw that you were in a hurry.” By the time she passed him off to the next employee, she made the fact aware again, that he was in a hurry. By the time my transaction had been completed I had several more rude/awkward situations and was eager to get out of that place. As someone who works retail myself, no matter how bad of a day you’ve had or what may be going on in your life, you can never let your customer know. I filled out the survey on the bottom of my receipt and a manager from the store called me and talked to me about my experience. Bellevue apple store is just not the place to find friendly help I guess.
Anjela, take a look at the Sony SZ series. It’s made of sex and win, though I suppose Sony treats their customers like shit too, so I guess it’s your call.
It could be the case that this man has some anxiety issues which prevent him from being able to speak with women he finds attractive. Its not that uncommon.
@miramesa: Ignorance. Pure pathetic Ignorance. Shame on you.
Hate most certainly does not equal fear.
The young men with these anxiety problems would do anything to be able to act normally around women, they do not hate them, they do not disrespect them.
They are deeply scared to death of them. It does not matter how much they want to talk to a woman, they just freeze … they can’t help it, its an anxiety disorder … not hate.
My wife and I have dealt with similar situations. Sometimes the salesperson’s choice of who is the stakeholder in the purchase seems to correlate with what an imputation of sexism would predict. Sometimes not. Sometimes, it seems that they are just flipping a coin mentally. I wonder why they don’t just ask us who is more invested in the purchase. It is not rare that one of us has done the research and is more invested in the details of the purchase and the other is just tagging along with a “right of veto”.
This is not an unusual incident. Any woman has faced this issue when purchasing a car or anything related to a car, a computer or any electronics equipment, and any type of sex toy (even if it’s ribbed for HER pleasure).
But srsly, when WILL society accept the idea that women truly ARE equal?
“mac-club”?
You’re a douche-bag.
@InfiniTrent: Truer words were never spoken. This goes for cars, computers, electronics, and anything else that’s for sale here in the US of A.
Even BestBuy, the epitome of customer disservice, recognized this fact and has been training their employees to be more “women friendly”.
[www.usatoday.com]
Apple better recognize!
Quit your bitching!
If a female Apple Store employee came and talked up your husband because HE were buying a computer you’d probably be complaining about how she flirted and cajoled him into a purchase and didn’t pay much attention to you. It could have been the GUY in the store was more comfortable talking to the GUY in your party. There are a lot of people who get weirded out when dealing with the opposite sex partner in a couple situation. They don’t want to appear too forward. It’s not a big friggin’ deal. And it’s not sexist. Maybe he was intimidated by your overwhelming beauty. Or maybe he’s not a Nirvana fan and your Kurt Cobain attire threw him off. Get over yourself.
What your husband should have done is excuse himself to go and look around that store. They say the Apple Store is a great place to meet single women.
Okay, I admit, as a single woman, I will not go car shopping unless with another person, usually male. Yet, I have had three female friends who’ve asked me to go car shopping with them so I guess 2 females shopping together for a car probably happens a lot too–but I have known no woman to go car shopping by herself.
That being said, I have gone into Apple stores by myself, bought computers/software by myself and have never had a problem with any male employee. I will admit though there were usually a 2 males to 1 female ratio of employees in the store, but I don’t think that’s unusual, in most clothing/department stores I shop in there are usually 3 females to 1 male employee ratio.
In fact, I recall a time when I went in to buy a laptop in college and took my dad with me. The employee talked with me, dealt with me, helped me choose my ibook, a printer, accessories, etc . . . and then the employee asked me how I was paying. That’s when I told him to ask my dad. =)
I had a female friend take her daughter in to purchase a iMac, she said it was a great experience because both were pc users and the salesguy was incredibly helpful.
It sounds like this woman had a isolated experience with one bad employee.
Could be the “largest moving object” factor. I’m a large gal, and when I eat out with the girlfriends, end up with the check more often than chance would indicate. What were the relative sizes of Anjela, her husband, and the clerk?
That being said, it almost never goes this far. I don’t accept being ignored. And if they continue to do it, it goes straight to the store manager – not the CEO. If you make a fuss, make it in the appropriate place.
@humphrmi: Hey, watch it! I really like (good) Bourbon, drinking Bourbon doesn’t necessarily make you enough of a prick to write what he was spewing.
I’m ALWAYS having that problem when I go around buying computer stuff. Either they treat me like a dumbass and try to sell me shit and babble nonsense I KNOW is not true, either they are just plain rude in a “You’re a girl, you’re wasting my geek time!”
I’m a woman, and I go into Apple stores to ask questions and yes, purchase products. I am the Mac user in the house; my husband uses Windows for work and Linux for personal projects. It wouldn’t occur to me to bring him along to an Apple store when he isn’t interested in the products. I don’t drag him along to buy my clothes or cosmetics, either.
I haven’t had any problems with Apple salespeople talking or not talking to me. But now I’m almost tempted to drag my husband in, just to see what happens. I would venture that employees feel a bit nervous about talking to customers of the opposite gender in the presence of their partners – let’s admit it, Apple stores look like social spaces more than they resemble stores, and one magazine even recently advised women that they make for good pickup spots. Bill was clearly dumb for not talking to the female customer when the couple indicated that she was the one he should be talking to – but I can understand hesitation to begin the conversation without that indication. Once it’s given, though, it’s just plain rude to ignore it.
I’ll probably catch flack from this from sales types on here, but basically if you can do something better than retail sales you will. If you like sales and want to make money, commercial sales is much more profitable (but more competitive.) I don’t understand why sales attracts so many dregs, but that’s why everyone remembers when they come across a GOOD salesman who’s polite, professional and honest.
Car salesmen have a long reputation for ignoring women, often to their detriment. A colleague of mine is a short woman with long blonde hair, a cherubic smile, a penchant for crazy-high heels (because of her height) and (to be coarsely blunt about it) she’s stacked. She’s also intelligent, professional, independent and VERY tough-minded, and a car enthusiast.
Some years ago she was in the market for a Mustang GT with a manual transmission. As it happens, she and her husband actually like each other a lot and spend most of their leisure time together, so they were together when she went car shopping. They actually left the first dealership they went to because after SHE corrected the salesman who kept talking to her husband, HE corrected the salesman once and she decided she’d buy her car elsewhere. She ordered it that day, so it cost the first dumbass a sale.
@gingerCE: Not to ascribe my personal faults to you, but friends take me car shopping with them because I’m a bigger jerk than they are and know more about the process. In your case, you friends must be asking you because you know more about the process.
If, rather than being in charge of the situation from the get-go in order to get what you wanted, you feel even the most remote need to instead write a two-page(!) whinny letter to a company CEO, complaining that you didn’t get the emotional stroking you desired deep down in your heart when purchasing a material commodity from a store, you’ve pretty much just confirmed your inequality and justified the good reasons someone might avoid you like the plague.
If you need attention that badly, yet can’t command it in person with your behavior, body language, and vocal presence, maybe you ought to just make an appointment to get your nails done. I’m sure your manicurist will spend the whole time gabbing with you, unlike that mean old Apple Genius.
You’re not ignored because you’re a woman — you’re ignored because you are *you*.
The husband is a twit for perpetuating it. This has happened to me when I went with my (ex) girlfriend to buy a car. I nipped it in the bud and told the salesman that SHE was the customer and to speak to her.
I don’t think this lady did the ‘wrong thing’ in writing a letter to Apple instead of setting that guy straight directly.
Sometimes we tolerate or things and address them later, or don’t think about what really happened until after.
The major problem was that the salesman did not greet her and did not ask who he should deal with.
Whether she corrected that salesman there or not, it was good that she called attention to this problem with the higher-ups. It’s something every salesperson can learn from.
@deserthiker: You can make this about insulting her and theorize on why it happened, but despite what you think about what *might* have happened the definite thing here is that she was part of a party that approached the salesman, was not greeted, and the salesman did not ask who he should deal with.
hmm this really makes me appreciate my DH, Yesterday we went shopping for furniture for our office. The sales-person asked how “we” were doing to my Husband, and he immediately said “Look buddy she’s the one with the money, I am just here to carry the stuff to the car”
He’s not sexist. He just doesn’t know how to deal with women. They scare him. That’s the trouble of hiring nerds sometimes. Now a geek, a geek would have paid more attention to you than your husband.
This is a problem with the culture. I’ve seen plenty of people from Microsoft [where your husband works] who have exactly the same problem.
Good luck. Try the University Village outlet. They drool over girls. I take my wife and can’t get service, but they bend over backwards to do everything for her – including free merchandise. Probably something to do with being right next to the University.
@maztec: I know plenty of nerds/geeks, kind of goes with my field of work.
Some of them are the MOST sexist people I know! I don’t buy this “he was too shy to talk to the woman” crap.
Yes of course, the guy gets the wrong idea, thinks its for your husband, and it’s instant sexism. Of course it is. If a woman did the same thing, how many of you would think the same? If she did it and ignored the man, how many would think the same?
Get a spine and SAY that excuse me, the computer is for me.
The great thing about the ‘genius’ bar at Apple is that if I go in and need to get something fixed, I sign up ahead of time, and they know I’ve got the questions when they call my name. They don’t talk to my fiance, they talk to me. Whenever there’s something more complicated, computer wise, I take the lead because I know more….whenever we walk into an electronics store, I’m usually ahead going to the right section. If they start talking to him, he’ll defer them to me. It’s about teamwork – having a person recognize who calls the shots.
I’ve walked into video game stores (I’m talking to YOU, Gamestop) and have gotten the cold shoulder from sales people. I suppose they don’t WANT my money, but when it comes to video games, I know more.
Though, not surprisingly, the biggest geek realm of them all, comic book stores, have always been extremely welcoming toward me. I don’t think it has to do with the fact that I’m a girl, I think it has to do with the fact that I walk in and either I know where I’m going (everything’s in alphabetical order, it’s not hard) or I ask for a specific title.
Retail is a weird beast. He’s a douche for not introducing himself to both of you though. Anyone knows that if you don’t win both parties of a couple you’ll never get the sale. If you fail to sell one of them often times you’ll lose it. I learned this the hard way plenty of times when I was a salesman. Even if this salesman had bias from previous couples over his career you never ignore both parties.
I’m wondering if the concierge told him that there was a woman who wished to purchase a macbook. *sighs* Anyway people often will run off of the same racial and gender bias that perforate society. You happened to fall victim to it, but it always happens. Trust me I know I’m black and no matter how nice I dress and how I carry myself people hardly approach me for help.
ok i kind of laughed at the comment about the large gal receiving the check more often than not. i can’t actually recall any restaurant experience where the server didn’t just place the check in the nearest open spot on the table regardless of the gender or size of the patrons. that’s kind of odd.
should have spoken up right then & there. I don’t feel sorry for her one bit. her allowing him to ingore her for as long as she did only reinforced his notion that she was invisible.
Women use computers?
I **HIGHLY DOUBT** that this story happened as this woman explained it to happen. It’s just not a true story.
@scotty321: And why not?
This reminds me of my trip to TriState last month with my husband. I bought an iMac and to keep my cats from knocking it over, we decided to fasten it to the desk by putting a small metal bar covered in rubber tubing (to prevent scratching) over the base and screwing it into the desk, so it wouldn’t damage or scratch up the machine.
Well, we head on over to TriState to buy some rubber tubing. The guy who rushed up to help my husband had a nametag that said, “Dick”. When he asked us what we wanted, I explained that I was looking for a foot of 1/4″ clear rubber tubing, and he completely ignored me and spoke only to my husband. Once he got around to taking us to the right aisle and was cutting tubing for us, he said, “I’m sure your wife will like this. If not, you can always hit her with it!”
I said, “Excuse me?” and he looked at me and said, “Ah, I take it you’re the wife?” (when I’ve been tagging along all this time) so I nod, and he says, “Ha, I’m just kidding, I would never tell anyone to beat their wife.”
“You just did,” I said, grabbed my husbands arm, and walked off. I couldn’t help but throw a, “Thanks for your help, DICK” over my shoulder as we walked out!
@NameGoesHere: Actually, it pays to be polite to the person asking the questions. First time I came across something like this, my mom and I were shopping. I was 17, had an after-school job, and was buying a new jacket with my own money. We walked into the store, and I asked a couple of questions. The saleslady kept answering to my mother, rather than me. It was annoying, but I really liked the look of one jacket. I asked her to unlock the one jacket (they had them attached to the rack) so I could try it on, and she looked to my mother for confirmation.
At which time, I politely but pretty firmly told her that she was looking to the wrong person, it was my money, I was making the decisions, and if she wanted the sale she needed to talk to me. My mom just looked at her. At which point she apologized and actually talked to me through the rest of the sale.
@brent_w: Then he really needs to get over it or get a job that doesn’t rely on commissions.
Personally, I kind of wonder whether he might also have had some kind of religious “don’t speak to women who belong to another man” issue – but if that’s it, he also needs to get over *that* or get a different job.
Petrarch1603: Hurf durf
Just to elaborate a bit on my experience – I talked to Mr. No49 this morning about it – and yes, the guys were pointing at me and saying “ask her, its her computer! she knows the specs.” But still the tech faced them and barely acknowledged me.
I’ve learned since then that if the techie or salesman plays that game to get in between him and Mr. No49 so that I’m in his line of sight and he has to look at me, or to state very loudly “I Guess You Don’t Want This Sale Since You Aren’t Even Talking To Your Customer!”
Another incident, also at an Apple store where I was ignored even though I was doing an errand for our Mac loving friend. I was sent in to buy a peripheral of his that came in and a 3 minute wait – cause the person who came in behind me, also a woman, was waited on before I was – turned into a half hour wait until one of the other techs was free.
Once again, I was livid. Once again, I read them the riot act, especially about how not only did I come in before the other customer, but that if he had served me in line instead of skipping me over, he could have one definate sale instead of just a possible one.
and yes, the other woman was slim, trim and model type, whereas I’m the earth mother type.