She writes:
When I went to pay for the order, I noticed a gratuity already included on the bill. I told the waiter, “this is take out gratuity is not included.”He looked at me and said “that’s how we always do it.” I sat there staring at my bill scratching my head wondering if i should sign this receipt. A few seconds later they told me that they were out of what i had ordered. Good I thought. Cancel my order completely, but I’m taking the receipt.
We called the Coconut Grove Johnny Rockets last night and spoke with a manager who explained: “It’s the law that we have here.” Even worse, the Coconut Grove Grapevine posted another Johnny Rockets receipt, and it looks like they are adding the 15% gratuity to the post-tax total. Let’s see what the Florida Department of Revenue thinks of the arrangement:
…Rule 12A- 1.011(11), F.A.C., provides that the unless the following conditions are met, a gratuity is taxable as part of the total sales price:
The charge is a voluntary gratuity or tip added to or by the purchaser to his bill or money given freely by the purchaser over and above the sales price of such food or drink product; and Separately stated on the purchaser’s bill or invoice as a gratuity or tip; and All such voluntary gratuities must be distributed in full to the employees at least every six months with no part accruing to the benefit or advantage of the dealer.
Even if the tip is legal, does Johnny Rockets really think they are worth a mandatory 15% gratuity? Stop pretending to be Per Se and earn your tip.
Restaurants and Bars Standard Industry Guide [Florida Department of Revenue]
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I’m not sure the servers would agree with you. My daughter is a server and can bring home $300+ on a Saturday night, there’s no way the Pub would pay her that much. There are always going to be creeps that don’t tip just cuz they’re creeps, but for the most part the servers make (and earn in my opinion) well over minimum wage with the tip system the way it is now. I’m sure your idea is well meaning but I think it would end up hurting more servers than it would help. When my daughter worked at pizza place (I won’t list the name but they had a hut like structure)she would regularly bring home $100 on a Friday night while some of her co-workers would walk out with $30-$40, the reason? she was a better server and therefore deserved it. If they all got paid the same, where would be the incentive for providing above average service? I will gladly pay over 20% for great service, but lousy service gets maybe 10% if that@Pithlit:
my daughter is fortunate where she is a server, she has actually told repeat non-tippers, she will not serve them, and her manager allows this. She works hard, she makes sure their drinks are never empty, makes sure their food is correct and on time, she deserves to be tipped. Her philosophy on serving food is “If I wouldn’t eat it, I’m not taking it to my table.” I know not all servers are like that, but for the servers that are very good, they deserve to be tipped accordingly..random required tips are crap in my opinion@TomPiltoff:
@Pithlit:
I tip for services rendered. What service pray tell, are they providing me when I pick up my own food, provide my own drinks, etc.? Preparing the food? Lol that is built into their cost structure. No…no tip unless I am being waited on hand and foot, and even then, if you want 15%, you’d better do a good job.
actually i am not in the states, i am in canada
/dont tip
//well sometimes i will tip a buck or two, but not usually
@cde: A large number of restaurants make it really difficult for the servers to actually collect that additional money. It’s illegal but common for places that aren’t large chains.
@Onouris: If you’re “too tight” to tip you shouldn’t be eating out. Period.
@TomPiltoff: I wonder how many non-tipper would actually do this? And then I wonder if the poor service they received would just reinforce their beliefs that waiters don’t deserve tips.
I’m always shocked by the distance people will go to justify their bad behavior.
@probablyawkward: And thats when you take them to court. And call the AG. And the IRS. Especially the IRS. And the press. Get public pity on your side.
i tip for good service only. if no service was provided hence carry out, no tip will be provided either. how is the restaurant going to sell food if they aren’t willing to pay people to bag it for me. i don’t tip at taco bell, because someone had to get it together and put it in a bag for me. carry out tips kill me! i have to bribe someone at the restaurant sell me the food?
i’ve never heard of tipping for take-out. Where’s the service, what are you supposed to be tipping for? I’ll tip the waitress if I eat in a restaurant, and I’ll tip the delivery person if I get delivery and there’s no delivery charge. (If there is a delivery charge, I figure that’s the “mandatory gratuity”.)
One might wonder if something else happened for them to “magically” run out of what the OP ordered. Surely just asking about the tip wouldn’t be enough to make them freak out? But then you read this:
The law? Really? Seriously?
Further proof that, even when being paid not to be, people are jerks.
Having been a resident of Florida, this isn’t at all uncommon. Food establishments, due to tourism being the central economy down there, were sick and tired of people not tipping the waitstaff.
It’s odd to see i ton takeout but I can understand why they did it.
my daughter has the same problem, if people don’t tip her she loses money because she has to pay the runners, the hostess and the bartenders that make the drinks based on her sales, not tips. Also I don’t think anyone is forced to be a server, and I believe most understand how the pay works, if they are working in a decent place, they pretty much decided how much they get paid, by their service,I don’t think most servers would prefer forced tipping because generally they can make more the way the system is now. Where she works they get to decide on large parties whether to comp (I think that’s what it’s called but not sure) the tip, automatically adding it, or take a chance they’ll get more. 90% of the time she chooses the right way for that table and makes big bucks doing so.@itsallj:
excellent point, and no, most of them do NOT claim all their tips.@Michael Belisle:
@Antediluvian: Thanks for explaining the tax problem.
But Good Lord, I hope that was just someone pretending to be the manager on that other blog.
Managers have no business shouting at customers about how little the wait staff gets paid. Just because the law allows you to pay them so little doesn’t mean you can’t pay them more. Furthermore, a gratuity is voluntary by definition. Mandatory tipping is just stupid: if you want your employees to have a decent wage then give it to them.
@vladthepaler: Yeah, but the delivery charge goes to the restaurant not the driver.
Okay, not all states allow restaurants to pay their tipped employees below minimum wage. Also, if the employees are having such a hard time of it, they could get a job somewhere else. The reason they stay is that they make good money with tips. Otherwise they would all just go to work pumping gas and bagging groceries. Also, there are restaurants that have someone just for To Go orders, and they are typically paid more than the servers. At the restaurant I worked at it was about $3 an hour more.
What gets me is how tip % keeps going up. Inflation is going up so tips go up with it. A $10.00 burger plate 20 years ago at 10% would give the waiter $1.00. Now the same $20.00 at 10% would give the waiter $2.00. I don’t understand why the percentage is up to 15%, 18% or 20% today. It make no sense. What will it be in another 20 years….50%. I don’t see why I have to pay more on my food and a higher percentage on tips. It sounds like double-dipping from my pocket.
We had automatin 18.5% gratuity on room service orders at this hotel I worked at. When someone would tip me, I let them know that the tip was included. Most still tipped me anyway.
I know when I go to Sonic I don’t tip. They make minimum wage for non-tipped employees.
Here’s a compromise. Don’t call it a gratuity for takeout, call it a service charge. And say it up front, we charge $5 extra for takeout orders.
@probablyawkward: Tell you what, why don’t you just go down the street, find people doing their jobs, and just give them free money for the hell of it, good service or bad, like you do in restaurants for people who do nothing more than write down your order and carry a plate.
I started reading and thinking that the tip was bullshit. Now I think htat a tip on take-out is okay if the sides and etc. are included. That’s a lot of work. A full 15 percent? Gee. If I want a Johnny Rockets burger that bad, I guess…
But saying you’re out of burgers? That’s just kind of pathertic. And if the servers don’t get every penny, it’s illegal.
@Onouris: I actually tip based on service. If you don’t want to tip that’s your prerogative. Just don’t act like it’s some kind of moral or revolutionary act.
Anyone who says not tipping is somehow hurting the restaurant is delusional. No one is forced to wait tables but there’s no reason to look down on those who do.
@ snoop-blog: oftentimes when a restaurant offers to-go orders the servers are responsible for putting the order in, getting it ready and bringing it to you. So considering that I can be juggling five tables AND making sure you got your extra ranch dressing, I wouldn’t call a buck or two extravagant, nor would I compare it to fast food.
@ Onouris: you obviously have never waited tables.
Finally, I hate this attitude people have of ‘I don’t tip just for the sake of it’. What does that mean? Obviously if your server sucks you tip them less, but surely when you go out you have certain reasonable expectations. I always assume my waiter will refill my glass and bring my food out within a reasonable amount of time, and thus I assume I will be leaving a good tip.
I don’t even tip anymore since I moved to Florida. They always add that shit onto my total, and more than once I’ve felt screwed realizing I tipped somebody twice. Their loss. I tip over 20%.
It’s a good reason to quit tipping altogether, and incoproprate the cost of service into the price of the meal. Reserve tipping for truly exrtaodinary service.
But don’t withold tips as an excuse for being cheap–if you can’t afford the tip, don’t eat out!
interesting to see how many people seem to justify a waiters job simply by their service, when it’s the same thing at every other service job… but the employees don’t worry.
“service” is completely relative folks. like it or not, the quality of service does NOT guarantee good tips for the server. there are just as many cheap people who dine out as there are ‘bad’ waiters.
when it comes to bars (and often restaurants too), attractive women make more than men do.. plain and simple, even if they can’t make a drink or server at all.
food service is an anomaly. every other service sector pays minimum wage. when you tip the dude at starbucks for pushing a button, he’s not worried you’re going to tip. do pay him a dollar less if he doesn’t kiss your butt? no. same should be for waiter/waitress service. MINUMUM WAGE FIRST. then give them tips, just like every other service industry.
waiters RELY on tips as the MAJORITY of their wage. that’s the difference.
This place has gone to the dogs.
@TomPiltoff: it’s not my fault your restaurant is understaffed. if you can’t handle five tables plus carry out mayber you should give away some tables. when i was a server i was more than happy to lighten the load for a crappy server.
if your restaurant offers carry out, guess what so does kfc, do i tip them? no. for friggin sake, you didn’t cook sh*t, or clean sh*t. is it too much to ask to put my food in a bag at no additional cost?
let me get this straight, i’m expected to give you a tip because you were way too busy with other people otherwise? the restaurant gives you an opportunity to make a tip and you are required to do things by that restaurant regaurdless of weather your tipped or not. one of them may be carry out.
For those arguing that tipping should be kept, otherwise prices will go way up, you have to remember, the flip side is that gratuities will be subtracted, leaving possibly a small net increase in price. At the end of the day, there will be a nearly dollar for dollar trade-off.
cguess who just got a postcard inviting them to read this post!
the johnny rockets group inc
25550 commercentre drive
suite 200
lake forest CA 92630
@DeltaPurser:
Or maybe, because as you point out, most people in that place are foreigners. Guess what, foreigners generally don’t realize that tipping in the US is the “law of the land” because they don’t do that where they are from. So, for a place like that, it’s actually probably extremely appropriate for them to automatically include it and deal with the American customers on a case by case basis. I’ve recently been rereading Nickel and Dimed and she talks about foreigners not tipping in the 1st chapter.
Yeah, I don’t agree that there should be a mandatory gratuity added, because then it’s not really a tip. Tipping is something you do, not because you have to, but because you felt they did a good job (or feel guilty, whatever). I’ve only completely stiffed a couple of extremely rude waiters/waitresses in my entire life of tipping. I’ll generally let things go, but if the service is REALLY terrible then fuck them, they’re lucky to get the lint in my pocket.
I always liked that Larry David idea (it was him right?) where you put out like 25% of the expected bill in 1s and as the service continues, take a dollar everytime they fuck up. Then again, that’s also a good way to end up with a tube of vaseline in your stuffed pork chop.
@Pithlit:
I’m sorry, but I have to disagree strongly on this one. First, most restaurants don’t have the regular wait staff handling take-out orders; that job is usually handled by the host, or by someone working at a dedicated take-out station.
Second, even if the particular restaurant doesn’t have a separate employee handling take-out orders, a tip is still (almost always) unnecessary. The custom of tipping is *not* a means by which consumers are required, in an erratic and subjective way, to compensate for below-market wages. Rather, tipping is a means of expressing gratitude for a personal service.
When you walk into a restaurant and purchase a take-home meal from a counter, you are not receiving a service of any significance; you’re receiving goods. Fortunately, it is not a prevailing custom in the United States to tip for a simple sale of goods involving little personal service.
All of that said, if someone carries the food out to my car, or makes special efforts to separate and package the items for better transportation — or if someone is especially friendly — I will still tip. But it’s not required of anyone, nor should it be expected.
1) Take out would be incredibly easy to do. If its so hard to do then you are doing it wrong. Also if you are having so many problems how about you just leave the orders under a heatlamp and let the customer dump it into a bag. Since it is so easy and offers no extra service but the bare minimum I will not tip them (under normal circumstances).
2) Tipping should be for service staff that has exceeded the expected level of service. Work for your paycheque just like everyone else.
3) The argument that wait staff should get a normal wage is far from hollow. I say they get a normal wage and if they are still a great server they still get some extra monies. Furthermore, since when do people who work in restaurants deserve anything less than anyone else? Are they sub-human?
4) For all those that are tipping just because convention demands it but would rather not: stop. You are not helping matters. You can’t change something if you meanwhile support it in its current state.
5) Waitstaff: You know what you signed up for. Deal with it, or change it. Either change the culture that has forced you into this bad situation or change your job. Try retail, its just as hard but most places won’t let you accept tips.
6) Finally, the matter of automatic tipping. Its dumb. There is no moral reason to put an automatic tip on your receipt. Ever wonder why foreigners don’t understand our culture? It’s because its dumb, and makes no sense. It is the employer’s responsibility to pay their staff a reasonable wage. If you want to tip someone its a choice that should reflect on the service, not a guilt trip handed down through the generations.