Julie found that only about half of her seat was available due to the size of the passenger next to her. The passenger was apologetic, but obviously couldn’t magically shrink her body mass and make more room. Julie asked if she could purchase a seat in first class but was told they were sold out, and there were no more seats available. “A flight attendant suggested that the only way to change my seat was to ‘find a cute boy or girl’ and sit on their lap.” Instead, she spent the flight half in her seat and half in the aisle. When she emailed a complaint to Delta and asked for a refund, they thanked her for her feedback.
Julie asked Christopher Elliott, ombudsman for National Geographic Traveler, for advice. His suggestion will sound familiar to Consumerist readers: escalate it! “You could have—and should have—appealed this to someone higher up.” When Julie took his advice, Delta apologized and gave her a $250 voucher.
As far as plus-sized passengers go,
Delta, and most of the other network airlines, tends to look the other way when someone unusually tall or wide boards their aircraft. At least one carrier, Southwest Airlines, doesn’t. It requires that plus-sized passengers buy an extra seat (but they get their money back if there are empty seats). I could find no policy regarding these above-average travelers on Delta’s Web site, which says to me that your seatmate wasn’t out of line in booking only one seat.
(Thanks to Jim!)
“Hey, where’s my airline seat?” [MSNBC]
(Illustration: Getty)
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I wouldn’t fault someone for being tall. It’s not something you can do something about, or at least not something you’d want to do e.g. breaking your legs off. On the other hand, most obese people can lose weight. And before I get comments, I said most. But even a lot of those who say they can’t, just don’t.
Most airlines require large individuals that cannot fit comfortably in a single seat to purchase two seats. It, in fact, happens very frequently, and is a source of complaint from the obese individual (and may end up on Consumerist as another article).
@johnva: On a flight I had from Dallas a few months back, a retired NFL lineman was in a seat on the little commuter plane. Now this guy, as you might imagine, is BIG. His knees are up to his chin, the ass in front of him is relining, and hes spilling into the aisles. THEN the flight attendent has the nerve to come to the guy and ask him to put up his seat, and when he says he can’t due to his size, she cops an attitude with him. I swear to god, that pissed me off.
Let’s look at what the Federal Government has to say on this topic of airline seats:
[edocket.access.gpo.gov]
[Code of Federal Regulations]
[Title 14, Volume 1]
[Revised as of January 1, 2001]
From the U.S. Government Printing Office via GPO Access
[CITE: 14CFR25.785]
[Page 409-411]
TITLE 14–AERONAUTICS AND SPACE
CHAPTER I–FEDERAL AVIATION ADMINISTRATION, DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION
PART 25–AIRWORTHINESS STANDARDS: TRANSPORT CATEGORY AIRPLANES–Table of Contents
Subpart D–Design and Construction
Sec. 25.785 Seats, berths, safety belts, and harnesses.
(a) A seat (or berth for a nonambulant person) must be provided for each occupant who has reached his or her second birthday.
=======
Reading this we could say:
a seat which is broken, or occupied by something or someone else, is not a seat
Therefore the aircraft is no longer airworthy.
Obviously the intent of the regulation is the aircraft must have a place to sit for every passenger.
Standees, people rolling around on the floor or people sailing through the air are pretty clearly a hazard to all others on the plane.
I guess the key here is that there must be a seat for each passenger, no matter what size the passenger.
Or on another tack, if the passenger’s assigned seat was occupied by a seat-belted piece of carry on luggage, the seat-belt would be undone and the bag would be moved or the seat could not be used.
What difference is it that the obstruction happens to be part of another person? If the obstruction was a detached artificial limb, that would have to be moved as well for the seat to be used.
Since the total number of seats on the plane has been reduced by one, the procedures for overbooking would then come into play.
======
Much more frightening is that apparently the law has not kept up with American weights as further down we see…(only 170 pounds!)
[...Same title...]
(f) Each seat or berth, and its supporting structure, and each safety belt or harness and its anchorage must be designed for an occupant weight of 170 pounds, considering the maximum load factors, inertia forces, and reactions among the occupant, seat, safety belt, and harness for each relevant flight and ground load condition (including the emergency landing conditions prescribed in Sec. 25.561).
[...]
======
And come to think of it, I’m pretty sure that some carrier’s seats do not provide “a firm handhold”
[...Even further down in the same title...]
(j) If the seat backs do not provide a firm handhold, there must be
a handgrip or rail along each aisle to enable persons to steady
themselves while using the aisles in moderately rough air.
======
Food for thought…
I’m all for overweight people paying a premium. It’s bad enough on public transit when they squish all over you, but at least I have the option of standing up and getting away. I’ve been fortunate not to have encountered this problem while flying, but if it does happen, I’m locking myself in the bathroom and not coming out. That has to be more comfortable than being squished!
Obese people should have equal rights – they should be allowed to fit in the seat they bought. That’s equality. Asking for any more space is not equal rights, but special treatment.
If you eat the donut, live with it.
@Atomike: The overweight person ccupying the OPs seat is theft.
@jonnyobrien: No, I’m not advocating any tax. If you can’t fit in your seat without kicking the seat in front of you then perhaps your seat is not appropriate for you. I just don’t think it’s right to take it out on the person in front of you. They have a right to recline their seat. They also have a right to not be kicked by other passengers.
I’m not saying that their is a lot of leg room in coach seats, but that’s what you get for the cheap price. You always have the option of first class, and you often have the option of exit row or Economy Plus if you’re flying United.
@ManicPanic:
that’s not really true. Having owned and run a retail store for a few years, my suppliers disabused me of this notion. The bulk of the cost of most garments is in developing the pattern and sewing it. The cost of the fabric was not really the issue.
The reason that the next size range required higher prices is because it required a whole new pattern be produced. (usually for a more limited clientele) Generally, one pattern is created in a medium size, and then extrapolated to the other sizes in the range. Once you get in to plus sizes, the proportions are different and require a different size. Granted, the suppliers did say that by the time you moved to a 3x, the fabric costs did make a difference, but that’s a long way from a 20.
I am a very short adult of 58 yrs. I am always uncomfortable in planes. I’m not skinny, but I don’t overflow either. There just isn’t a comfortable seat I’ve found yet. As a rule of thumb I rarely fly since I have DVT which is aggravated by flying and being in cramped quarters for any long period of time. On occasion, I do have to fly and I always dread it. The seats are too high, too narrow, and not ergonomically correct for my body type.
It’s painful. I really wish that something could be done to alleviate this problem. As for overweight people, if we are worrying about too heavy luggage on board, I think we should be worried about overweight people as well. It’s a safety issue. I don’t know the answer.
@Edrebber: I don’t disagree with you. Read what I said, then read it again. Then feel silly.
What would they do if two overweight people ended up next to each other, or three in a row? And would that compromise flight safety, or make the plane fly in circles?…
This isn’t a matter of weight discrimination. You get what you pay for, and if a 20″ wide seat costs $100, then any ADDITIONAL space over 20″ costs you extra, whether it’s your elbow, your stomach, or your Louis Vuitton bag taking up the space. It’s just a matter of airlines being able to state clearly that they’re selling you a set amount of space, not the right to board the plane.
When I go to a restaurant and I’m still hungry after the entree, I don’t get a free desert because I haven’t eaten in two days. If you want more than what you bought, you pay up.
@IrisMR: I certainly do agree that what you think is simple. I’m a bit amazed, though, that you know 99% of fat people, and their situations.
I’m larger sized and I make sure when I fly that I’m sitting with my husband (who is tall and lanky) and my daughter, who is nine. They always have extra space and most of the time, my kid is snuggling up with me anyway.
I never want to make someone’s flight less than pleasant due to my weight issues. I wish more people just tried to be considerate on both sides over it.
The clothing metaphor doesn’t really hold weight. (pardon the pun) The cost of an item of clothing is almost completely seperate from the amount of material. Labor costs more than the material, and the majority of clothing costs is transportation, advertising, staffing, etc.
The reason PLUS specific merchandise is more expensive, is because the market of people over size 18-20 is significantly smaller than the rest, so the retailler makes up the cost of devoting sections of the store to its sole sale and marketing.
As to the airlines, when you buy a seat, you are buying space on the plane to sit. If you cannot fit into one space, it is not unreasonable to buy more space. The arm rest is really the border of your space, if it cannot be put down, you are to big for the space.
It may be embarassing to have to buy two spots, but I dont see it being less embarassing than the person sitting next to you calling the flight attendant to move their seat because of your girth. Why should the other person get less space than they paid for because you need more?
Height is a separate issue, since you cannot just buy another seat for more leg room, and is purely biological with out behavioral factors. The airlines should prioritize aisle seats and front rows for people based on height.
Unfortunately, this will all come down to the staff of each terminal and airplane to make proper on the spot decisions to satisfy the people involved. If the airline sells two seats, and one of the passengers is going to take up two full seats, someone will not be able to fly.
The airline should charge the man for the extra seat, and find someone on the flight willing to give up their seat in exchange for compensation like any other overbooked flight. If he is unwilling to buy the extra seat, he should be bumped to a later, less empty flight, and give his seat to someone on standby.
The airlines should come up with a policy of how these situations are to be handled, just as southwest did, or risk underpaid employees offending customers by saying the wrong thing to them and getting a consumerist article saying “XXX airline said I was too fat to fly” and we have to repeat this entire discussion.
@MDSasquatch: god yes. ziploc those reeking folks who insist on drenching themselves in scent where-ever they are: work, planes, buses.
literally nauseating & migraine inducing :#
@cwlodarczyk: amen to that. the level of virulent demonizing hatred towards anyone larger than average is disgusting & twisted.
I am not a very large person (a bit over 5 feet tall and of average build) and I can say that the last time I flew (2003) I felt the seats couldn’t be described as “roomy” by any stretch.
I really don’t have any solutions for this. The things is, large people…are people. They ARE human beings. I would certainly be very upset (and yes, I’d complain) if I didn’t get to use all of the meager seat I paid for.
We should remember that we are dealing with humans and not mindless robots. I would much rather be next to a very large person than someone with overpowering perfume (as mentioned above)
just threatened that you’ll file a complaint with the FAA and you’ll get some action fast. I had that happened to me once and it worked like a charm.
I was recently on a flight into Washington Reagan. The plane stood on its tail and accelerated just before landing missing a plane SITTING ON THE RUNWAY but less than 40′. When I asked Delta if this was reported to the FAA they said not their problem. When I advised them that this was distressing they advised it was a ROUTINE risk of flying. I never was able to even get a call when I asked for a Manager. I got the circle of email and gave up. I have over 100000 FF miles with Delta and fly monthly. This has never been ROUTINE and it scared the passengers greatly. Even the pilot was shaken. But guess its just routing for Delta Airlines.
It’s very simple. I paid for the use on one entire seat, which is the space between the armrests and between the gaps of the seat cushions. No other passenger may use the space I paid for, regardless of their size. It’s not personal, it’s not discriminatory, and I’m not interested in criticizing big people. It is the airline’s responsibility to ensure it does not defraud me by allowing other passengers to use the space I paid to use.
What’s wrong with some of you people? Being fat is not always a choice. I had 2 gastric bypass surgeries. I almost died both times from losing to much weight and becoming so malnourished that I couldn’t even walk. The planes need to realize that the seats need to be made wider or they need to offer 2 seats to the obese passenger. Thin people don’t understand because they have never had to go through what us heavy people go thru on a daily basis. If you can’t say something nice, please just keep it to yourself. Or at least figure out how you can say it without offending anyone. SHEESH!!!!!