“This year I moved in May 2007. My new housemates and I decided that we wanted to share wireless internet in our house. We order Qwest wireless the first week of June 2007.
When I received the modem and start up disc, none of the codes would work for my computer, nor my housemates. I called Qwest and was told that it was because I had a MacBook. During the month of June I called Qwest over nine times, and was repeatedly told in both polite and in rude terms that the problem was my Mac, not Qwest. During one call to Qwest, an employee told me that he could get it up and running in 30 seconds if my computer were a PC. When I asked him if any of his colleagues were trained for Macs, he told me that hardly anyone uses macs and Qwest should not have to train its employees in a practically obsolete system. He then transferred me, against my will, to the apple support line.”
My computer is a 2007 Macbook that receives wireless at every coffee shop or business with wireless; i is not a problem with my computer. The apple support line should not have to pick up the pieces for Qwest employees.
The amount of time spent on the phone with Qwest in June, transfers directly to my cell phone bill. I went over my minutes for the first time in my cell phone contract by exactly the amount of time I was on the phone with Qwest. I admit, I do choose to have a cell phone instead of a landline. This means that 1-800 numbers cost minutes on my plan, yet if Qwest employees had been trained sufficiently in both Macs and PCs, I should have only had to make one phone call, and thus not go over my minutes. I do believe that part of my $57.54 monthly Qwest bill is to having access to customer service.
After this cell phone bill, I asked Qwest for a new modem to rent. I was sent a non-rental and charged roughly $100. I did not learn this until my bill at the end of July.
After receiving the new modem, I had the same series of problems with wireless not working in the household. After three more phone calls, I got a Qwest employee that knew Macs. He got the wireless up and running in under 30 seconds.
Shortly after the wireless got working, I got the bill for the charged modem. I immediately called billing and asked if I could have it transferred on my account as a rental. The first person I talked to did not think they could do it, but then I got them to transfer me to the Loyalties Department. The first person I talked to in loyalties, told me that they could change it to rental status, and because I was a loyal customer, he would give me three months for half price in recompense for all the previous trouble. He told me to wait three days to pay my bill, because he would start the discount that month. I was much relieved. Yet when I called to check on my bill five business days later, it had not changed.
When I called to check with billing they had two different computer profiles for me, one gave the information that loyalties had told me, the other had the higher bill. They could not rectify it, so instead of Qwest figuring it out its own internal error, they forced me to talk to Loyalties, billing, and customer care. I spent over two hours on the phone that day. I should not be the one communicating to each department in Qwest about Qwest’s own internal error on my bill. Qwest should be taking responsibility for making sure their profiles on the customer’s is correct. I believe this is what costumer service entails.
I canceled my service that day. This was the middle of August. I was told by Loyalties that my plan would be terminated, and essentially erase a month of service from my bill for all the inconvenience, and that she would send me a label with reference number for the modem, so that I wouldn’t have to eat the cost of the modem. I never received a reference number. It took the final bill until mid-September to arrive. Loyalties was able to give me the one month discount. Yet the modem had not been credited. I had to call again for a reference number to send the modem back. Again I was told not to pay the bill for the modem.
I sent the modem back near the end of September. On September 26th, I received notification that Qwest was going to send my bill to a collection agency if I did not pay or make arrangements for payments. The bill in question was the combination of the $100 erroneous charge for the modem, the non-credited month of service and a partial month of service. All of these charges I had been told by three separate employees to wait to pay, yet apparently interdepartmental communication had failed again. I called on the 26th and paid everything except for the modem cost, asking if that would stop them from sending it to collections. The Qwest employee told me it would.
One week later, I got another notice to pay the $100 for the modem, or it would be sent to collections. Again, I called and asked to put a stop on the transfer to collections. Again, I was told it would not be sent. Yet today, I got both a collections notice for the $100, and a phone call from collections. It was both the rudest letter and phone call that I have ever received, and it was due to the fact that I waited to pay the bill because Qwest had told me to wait. I paid the collections agency in order to save my credit rating, then called Qwest. I was told that the $100 had been credited to my account and the collections notice was a mistake.
I am dumbfounded that this went to collections despite my communication with Qwest. I feel harassed by this continued ill treatment, and blatant irresponsibility by Qwest. This irresponsibility has added up to a $100 collections bill, a threat to my credit, a $89 charge in overage minutes on my cell phone, and two months of bills paid to Qwest for wireless service when no wireless service was being received in our house. My main complaint is that as an individual paying for a service, I should receive that service in exchange for my payment. I that service should malfunction or not perform with in the bounds of its contract, then the company should be responsible for fixing it. It
is not the individual’s responsibility to call every department of a corporation to make sure they are getting proper customer service; it is the corporation’s responsibility in exchange for monthly payment to give proper service to the customer.My house has switched to Charter and they had us up and running immediately. The one time that we have had a problem, Charter came to our house, and fixed it for us, free of charge. They did not force us to stay on the phone for multiple hours, or try to tell us that it was our computer’s problem.
Thank you for your time.
Sincerely,
Lindsey Case
The game is called customer service hot potato. Each department receives a request, processes it, then figures out which other department to dispatch it away to, with the problem never getting solved. Lindsey did the right thing and voted with her dollar. It just sucks that she had to go through such hassle on all ends of the transaction. Well they got one part right. They had no problem signing her up as a customer and getting all her billing information.
(Photo: Getty)
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@Pylon83:
Sorry. I would have read all of you comment, but it was WAY too long. People need to learn to be concise with their comments if they want people to read them.
Well, as one of the few who actually read the entire complaint, some of you are sort of missing the point. He finally DID get a tech that understood macs and got the system running in 30 seconds. The real issue was how nobody at Qwest knows what anyone else is doing. he spends the majority of the complaint discussing billing and how they screwed him. He also talks about how he ran up over $50 in cellphone bills talking to Qwest and yes, he knows that 1-800 calls are free from a landline.
I did this little summary because as much as we all love the Mac vs PC vs Linux debate, that isn’t the question here nor the main issue. Props to Consumerist to attempting to get their article dugg by using that quote in the title. However it doesn’t even seem like he is that much of a mac fan.
It’s unfortunate that the author of the complaint didn’t detail what kind of service he’s buying from Qwest. It *appears* it’s DSL with a modem and a wireless access point.
If that is the case, then the sole reason they couldn’t get it working is probably because the quick installation method isn’t available for a Mac. I’m sure dslrepors.com has all the information you need on how to configure your DSL modem without using the setup CD. Regardless however, Qwest should have a couple technicians who can instruct customers on how to plug into the device with an ethernet cable and use a web interface to set the thing up.
Many thanks to those who have turned this into yet another Mac/PC debate. Please, can we just grow up? If your life is measured by your operating system, you’re seriously compensating.
A more general and problematic issue is that the processes we, as consumers, want to enable often integrate two different systems. In this case it’s DSL with a home network. And, just as often, neither company is interested in helping set up this integration if it includes another company’s system.
Verizon DSL often refused to help me when they deemed it a Mac issue (and I was often connected to Apple without being asked). While this is incredibly frustrating (and I’ve got some IT experience) I can understand the problem. Hence the rise in companies like Geek Squad who are set up to connect these systems.
BTW, while a lot of negatives can be said about Circuit City, I once got a floor staff person to help me set up a complicated TiVo/TV/Home Theater/VCR set of connections over the phone. That’s the best service I ever got with a multiple system integration problem and I only spent a few dollars at CC.
I’m a rare case- I bought a PC and installed Mac OS on it (takes a bit of skill, but not too hard if you like to tinker around). I do this knowing that I will not get support for the OS. However, I do expect support for things not related to the computer no matter what OS I use. If a company can not give me support on the Mac side then I won’t boot back into Windows for their convenience- it’s a principle that I like to stand firm on.
And nearly obsolete? Compared to XP, Tiger *flies* on my laptop. I bought it accepting that it was a low-powered POS, and Mac OSgave it oomph I never thought it had (1.2GHz Core Solo, 512MB). But enough of that.
@CaliforniaCajun: EXACTLY.
I don’t know how hard it is to set up DSL, but in the worst case, Qwest should have sent one of their install techs out to get it working. There’s no way it’s that hard, unless it all relies on Windows software (unlikely, as they claim to support OS 9+).
@eelmonger: Apples and oranges (pun intended). Installing software for platform X is not the same as configuring a separate networked device with a web server on it on platform X. If the DSL modem has a RJ45 on it, any computer with a NIC and a web browser has everything that should be necessary to set it all up.
Their techs should know how to get things working without installing special software (even though said software should work, according to Qwest’s website). If he had been scheduled for a tech to arrive and do it, chances are he would be happily using his broadband service, rather than complaining to consumer advocacy blog.
I work for an ISP who also works with Qwest. The setup process we use for setting up a Mac is no different than a PC. Log in to the web interface and configure, it’s just that simple. I can’t figure out why Qwest is insistant on having people install more useless software on their machines.
@almaden: “expecting Qwest to provide support for every platform is unreasonable.”
Wrong (sort of).. I expect any major TECHNICAL COMMODITY providing entity to provide competent staff to at least try to work through any Windows/Mac hardware. I’ll grant you the opinion to let them waffle on Linux or OS2, etc etc….
I’m not saying they need to be 100% savvy in both Win/Mac, but the settings (for the most part) used/needed are generally the same, it’s only the control panels/preferences icons to get there that are different.
/Helpdesk staff at a bank that provides phone support for both systems. That’s OUR competitive advantage.
The difference between a technician and a technically inclined sales representative is troubleshooting. A technically inclined sales representative won’t do the work necessary to resolve a computer issue. A technician will. A technician will figure out what the errors are, figure out varying methods to fix those errors, and then resolve them. A good technician doesn’t need to know every OS to fix it; they need to know how to use Google and use it well, not to mention use reasoning to solve the issue.
I’m a tech, and I have never run across a problem I can’t solve with enough effort and thought. The problem is likely that Quest’s router has firmware that is not compatable with the Mac wireless card, and a Linksys or something similar will work. The technician themselves must take the time to eliminate all possibilities in order to resolve the issue, and clearly here they didn’t.
It doesn’t matter that it’s Mac OS X. It only matters that the technician didn’t do their job.
This seems to be SOP for wireless companies — when I called Verizon about a speed problem with my DSL, it took me three calls before I found a tech who said “Let’s fix this together” instead of “Sorry, can’t help, it must be your computer.” I run Windows XP on my very old laptop, but the hardware on the consumer end is a convenient thing to blame.
@Falconfire, Front_Towards_Enemy: i’d be happy to let you guys come over & fix it. =)
actually, this problem happened awhile ago, so until FTE mentioned encryption, i forgot to mention that we set up WEP (i know, i know – but we have a couple DS’s in the house). & i think we determined that was the problem. methinks os x no likes the WEP.
@Pylon83: Her lengthy comment was readable
and interesting and to comment with such haste is irresponsible.
Obviously from your lack of proofing/editing skills, you fired off your
tirade without much thought. More on topic, however, I loathe using a
Mac. That being said, it is a viable system for any consumer and more
and more the choice to use a Mac is the convenience of the system. If
you are a major technology company dealing directly with a public that
has a large share of Mac users, yes, they should definitely have
someone, somewhere, with training in Macs. Furthermore, their business
practice of ignoring the Mac user and simultaneously proverbially
slapping them in the face is reprehensible. I may hate the Mac but I
respect the users. Sorry for your inconvenience Lindsey.
My little ole’ macbook connects to just about every wireless network it can find. In fact, when you’re running Leopard, it not only connects to the wireless network, it allows you to view the contents of any computer connected to that network. Of course, that is if they are not password protected. I now know that some one of my neighbors has a computer named “Erection”.
@grundy: Um, shes attempting to setup the WiFi on her Mac (most likely so that she can, you know, be wireless) she is not attempting to configure the DSL modem. The Qwest Techs most likely were able to setup the DSL modem with the PPPoA UN/Password and enable the WiFi but were not able to configure her Mac.
I used to do support for GTE Internet (back in the mid-90s when GTE still existed). I was one of a handful of people on the Mac helpline; I think the ratio was about 10:1 PC to Mac support people. At any rate, I was told by several adamant Macs users that I’d be out of a job in no time because “Mac users don’t need support.” Add that opinion to the big company opinion that 10% isn’t worth spending money on… well, you end up with service like this letter.
I still use a Mac. I rarely call tech support — but when I do, I lie and say I have a PC. Otherwise, the “techs” will give you the blow off, even if you’re only asking for something simple like a dial-up number.
Sounds like Qwest is a “practically obsolete system.”
I own Mac, Windows boxes, and a couple Linux boxes, but my main machine is a MacBook. I have VAST experience with Qwest “customer service” and DSL. I also knew someone who worked as a supervisor in Qwest’s local customer service department, their local head of consumer affairs and their vice-president for our region. Didn’t help. And frankly, I’m not sure it’s a “Mac v. Windows” issue, but more of a “it’s outside the box and therefore we can’t fix it” issue.
My most recent encounter was to upgrade my DSL speed and get a new modem/router (the old one was routinely dropping the DSL connection 4-5 times a day). I was told that I was using an old protocol, and that I’d be sent a new router, and my phone line would be re-provisioned. The modem/router came in 48 hrs (amazing!) and I hooked it up. It fired up just fine, I was able to get into its status screens, figured out where it’s log files were, and….nada, zip, zilch.
Phone call to Qwest, got a tech in India. After running through their standard questions, they blamed the problem on my ISP (a third-party ISP, not Micro$oft: they give me a great deal on a fixed IP connection and I know the local techs). Talked to my ISP’s local tech: no signal from the Qwest circuit.
Called back. Got India again, oh…the line hadn’t been provisioned for the new service, but the old circuit had been taken out of service. “We’ll have it up by Monday.”
Monday: No service. Tuesday: called and asked status. New service has been provisioned. Check circuit from my end: no PPP connection. Asked to talk to their local tech guy (our local Qwest POP is 4 blocks from my house). One person comes over, tests all lines outside, finds a problem. Says to wait until he fixes something back at the POP. Next day, nothing. Ask for another tech to come out. He says everyting is ok. While he is here, we call my ISP. Turns out that the Qwest process for re-provisioning their circuit caused them to initiate a new account, for that circuit and they created a new username/password login. Get the right PPP user/password, get a connection. For 24 hours. Then it’s dead as a doornail.
Now I’m getting to know the Qwest local escalation engineer (Mr. Tuttle?) by his first name, and have his personal cell phone number. He comes out on his lunch break 2 days later. Sure enough there’s a noise problem on the line. He brings a replacement modem/router. Signal slightly better. He gets a cherry picker out and narrows the problem down to a connection between my house and the local POP (about two blocks away). Since then, my connection has been mostly fine (though not anything like the connection speed I’m paying for).
None of this had to do with my being on a Mac: it had everything to do with Qwest’s process for dealing with tech questions, how they treat third-party ISPs, and how they communicate internally. Every step of the way, the techs stated that the problem was a Mac. My only salvation is that I could read the modem/router logs and knew enough about DSL to throw the failure to connect codes and log language in their face. Finally, only though the persistence of a local engineer (who had a Mac at home BTW) were we able to figure out the problem.
Total time to solve the problem: 10 days. Workdays down: 8. Hours on the phone: 12. Hours with onsite techs: 5. How long would it have taken had I connected with the engineer in the first place (or someone with a requisite skill level)? Significantly shorter. And it would have cost Qwest a lot less in the long run.
The only thing that allowed me to thread this needle was my own knowledge of what was going on. Had it been my wife dealing with this, we’d be using a cable modem.
The Funniest thing is
” he told me that hardly anyone uses macs and Qwest should not have to train its employees in a practically obsolete system. He then transferred me, against my will, to the apple support line.”
Why because 6 of the last Qwest TV commercials in the last year have been made on with Macs. I worked on them and I only own Macs!
If you see the Qwest ad that shows some windows photos loading and a person installing Qwest one click install software it was all run on a Mac Running Mac OSX using Quicktime and was not really even windows it was a program I call CurtainsX which looks like Windows but is built in Apple Shake and played as video!
As a PC user of over ten years I made the switch to Apple a few years ago… I seriously dont know what the issue the poster is having could be?
Mac doesnt really view wireless in much diferent of a way than Windows does. Its a very slight difference in setting up… in fact, I find my Mac easier to set up for wireless than my Windows PCs.
There isnt any real “configuring” to be done. Turn on wireless on the Mac(if it isnt already on), view available networks (click the little wireless icon in the upper right) and select one. Youre connected. If you can connect to coffee shops, then you can connect anywhere.
In reality, the type of OS should be beside the point. The access point should be broadcasting a signal, and short of some encryption key you might need, you should be able to connect. If it isnt broadcasting a signal, then it is a hardware issue with the modem/access point, not the computer being used.
I have mixed feelings about this post. Maybe qwest isnt providing good service, but it seems as if the poster maybe does not have basic knowledge of OS X. Qwest should be able to help set up your service, but they arent responsible for teaching you your OS. I think some facts are missing from this story.
OK, admittedly stupid statement. But to be fair, I had a ‘Genius’ at an Apple Store tell me (within the last 6 months) that they don’t work on Windows PCs ‘because we don’t like to mess with IRQ settings’. I asked him if TRS-80s and Commodore 64s were on their support list.
“Obsolete”?
AHAHAHAHAHAHHAHHHAHAHHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAA.
Really? Then why was a new OS revision released just at the end of last month? Then why are Macs based on the latest standards? And so on?
Sounds like Qwest is too stupid to realize that not everyone is a Windows user and fails to appropriately train its workers and won’t admit this oversight. Yes, I said oversight. A negligent one.
@mac-phisto: Thanks phisto. The encryption is where wireless typically breaks. Always configure the SSID to be OPEN first. Once it works properly, then cut in the encryption.
As for Wireless, since I build large coroprate wireless networks for a living, I do speak from experience.
If you need help, please make an appointment.
Oh yes, for everyone else, friends don’t let friends configure linksys/Cisco wireless devices. That is the road to the dark-side.
Since about 85% of the worlds graphic design is done on Macs (as in publishing etc), maybe they need to get a grip on reality. I was told something similar by the NPG cable company.
The hot set up is to maintain other Mac users as contacts for help and to join a MUG if possible. Most Mac issues are easily resolved unlike PCs aka the machine of the devil.
Sorry, if i duplicate the answer. I never got through all the comments. I believe it is something with QWEST modem (actiontec) not having initial support for IPV6. You need to update the modem.
I did and it solved for my Wii as well.
looks like you solved through another provider but just thought I would share.
Sorry man but vote with your wallet and change from quest. Oh and reduce the verbage. Not sure if Quest is the only option as I never read anything so long unless its to purchase a house or something. good luck
Cart
@sonichghog: Saying that a knowledgeable technician needs to be familiar with all the major OSes is infinitely less ridiculous than saying they only need to be familiar with the biggest one. You’re talking (I assume) about ignoring EIGHTEEN PERCENT of the market in that case, according to the link you posted.
I wouldn’t expect anyone to be an expert at any given OS, necessarily, but I would expect a tech to be able to complete an easy task with any of them. Qwest failed to do so. They are not competent techs. Swalve cannot use a mouse. He shouldn’t claim to be a tech.
@darious: Guess you didn’t do your job then, unless you were being paid by Microsoft to further some nefarious monopolistic goals. A 6% market-share OS that, for the purposes of networking, follows all the standards but simply uses a better GUI is hardly “non-standard.”
@Jasmo: Yes.
ironically, but seriously, i ask…what’s Quest?
they need to get with the times and stop hanging out with my dead grandfather and sharing stories about 1929.
As an earlier poster said, setting up a Qwest modem is as simple as plugging in the Ethernet cable and using a web browser to go to 192.168.0.1 – then following Quick Setup or Alternative/Non-Windows Setup, depending.
To not support OS X when setup of the modem is through a web browser is ridiculous.
Also, it should take a competent trainer an hour to fully explain how to setup Internet Connections on a Mac, Ethernet, Modem and Airport included. Being able to support most major operating systems means better support, which means customers that stay with the company. I say that’s win/win, even if it costs an hour per employee to train…
To all those above who say using a PC is easier than a Mac, that is an absurd statement, and you have zero credibility. Just stop.
The “obsolete system” excuse is a smokescreen for “we’re too cheap to hire support techs who have used other systems, and we’re too paranoid to face the odd lawsuit for ‘officially supporting’ OS X but failing miserably.” Buck-passing at its finest.
@swalve: I smell a troll. The “one-button mouse” argument is a red herring, and the guy doesn’t bother to respond to comments.
Come to think of it, I generally don’t come back to a post after commenting. Hmm…
Saying that Qwest shouldn’t have to support Apple products because they are only 10% of the market share is just like saying that Qwest doesn’t have to support 1 out of 10 Windows users that might have a minority issue crop up.
Not to mention, calling them obsolete when they were recently valued as the top dollar computer manufacturer by stock price. Hmmm… obsolete?
This is actually pretty typical of the Qwest experience. If a Qwest rep tells a customer incorrect information, or if a sales rep just plain lies about prices, the response is “Sorry you were given misinformation”, but you’re still held responsible for the charges. The notation system only allows up to about 105-110 characters, so no matter how complex and numerous the issues you may have dealt with during the call, the notes the rep can write have to be shorter than a text message. This leads to completely unreadable abbreviations, where spaces, vowels, and every other consonant are removed, and still much of what was discussed in the call is left out. It is possible to go into a legacy VAX/VMS system to leave more verbose notes, but to do so after a call is likely to get the rep in trouble for call avoidance. Anyone who can’t deal with the constant unfair treatment of customers quits in disgust, making it so the only people who are still there are the ones who don’t really care too much about the customers. If you have to call, be sure to be polite, as the reps are human and they will do their best to help nice people. Be obnoxious, and there are about 15,000 different ways to either not help you or make your problem worse, and you can rest assured that no matter how much you make a stink about the service you received, the rep won’t be held accountable. Remember? The people who would care already quit. The supervisors had to make it through being a rep. The people that are employed by Qwest are union employees, and it seems to be their main goal in life to avoid talking to actual customers. (Who can blame them? The customers are always pissed off about the previous rep lying to them, or something else that is probably Qwest’s fault.) The people you talk to on the phone are “vendors”. Otherwise known as outsourcers. They are getting paid 1/2 to 1/3rd of what the Qwest employees get paid and deal with 10x the BS. Oh, and by the way, their MSN internet service officially doesn’t support Macs. You can get basic internet only (same speed, but without the MSN extras, with throttled bittorrent, and for more money), which supports Macs. When you think about it, it does kind of make sense that the MICROSOFT NETWORK (MSN) would not support Macs, doncha think? It will still work just like any other wireless setup. Heck, their online help files will even tell you how to set up a Mac to work with the service. I, ahem, know someone who used to work for an outsourcer for DSL loyalty. “He” would get people with Macs that tech support couldn’t help, and would read them the online help file ( from [www.qwest.com] which is the same site tech support directs people to for more info) step by step, and get their service up and running. It’s not that hard, as it’s really hard to screw up wireless networking on a Mac. I have no idea how the guy who wrote the article did it. Oh, and the modem – good luck getting your money back on that. Over 30 days they won’t credit it unless there are notes saying it was to be returned. See above about notes. Your best bet in dealing with Qwest directly is to write to their executive complaints department. They can even access the recording of your phone call if you talked to a vendor. Qwest internal employees are only recorded about 1/8th of the time, so good luck if it’s an actual Qwest rep that lies to you, but then again, it’s unlikely that you’ll talk to one of them anyway. I don’t know how they respond to BBB, FCC, or PUC complaints, but I’m surprised they don’t get more of them. Oh, but try not to get too mad at the individual reps you speak with – they probably work for a vendor, and can only do what they’re allowed to do. The supervisor is still an employee of the vendor, and the vendor can only do what Qwest will let them do. The vendors have no way to get you to a Qwest internal agent. They will get fired for even attempting to contact one. The executive complaints department is a vendor too. The company is a model of bureaucratic inefficiency. For example, orders that are placed in the computer system are not really computer generated – they go to ORDER WRITERS who then RE-WRITE the orders in the coded system that is compatible with the old VAX/VMS hardware that runs everything behind the scenes. The computer ordering system writes the orders that way to begin with, but to process the order without an order writer re-writing it would be too efficient because it would reduce the number of employees required to do the job. Unions hate that sort of thing. It’s amazing the company actually managed to turn a profit recently. They are only open from 8am-6pm. The reason they can’t have individual departments (except sales, which can’t do anything other than sales) open after hours is because to do almost anything would require a call to another department (or two or three) that would be closed. Their internal policies are so numerous that to even find the official policy on an issue is often nearly impossible, and when you do it is usually not the way things are done in practice. There is an internal atmosphere of entitlement in the company – the internal employees believe they deserve to be paid very well, and the customer is always wrong when it comes to billing disputes, even though their VMS-based billing system is often in error. Often only the loyalty department will issue credits for legitimate billing errors, and to speak with them you have to threaten to disconnect your service. They are making a major effort to turn the company around – and went from last place in customer service to 1st or 2nd in a survey, but I suspect part of the reason is that people with higher expectations have already changed providers. The attitude of us against the customers is still very strong within the company, and as a mostly regulated utility facing limited competition, they can continue to due business this way.
All this bitching and moaning is missing the point. This isn’t about whether you “should have to” support one OS or another.
The problem here is simple: Networking hardware, by its very design, is 100% platform-independent. There are no “system requirements” for Ethernet, nor for 802.11a/b/g/n. There’s a STANDARD. And if you make or distribute hardware that supports that standard, and your customer has hardware that supports it too, then that’s ALL that’s needed. What’s fucking this whole thing up is that now EVERY vendor has to stick in some proprietary, nothing-to-do-with-the-standards CD, whose main job is to muck up your Windows settings to drive traffic to the telco’s “portal” and install adware and crap on your computer. They also try to make it so you “have” to use this CD to initialize the “modem” device, or your Internet connection itself. Or at least give you the impression you have to, even if you can do it another way (You know what I mean, the stickers they put over all the ports that say “ZOMG RUN CD FIRST DON’T JUST PLUG IN YOUR COMPUTER!!!”)
IT IS NOT HARD TO PROVISION BROADBAND USING NOTHING BUT HTTP AND WITH NO EXTRA SOFTWARE REQUIRED.
IT IS NOT HARD TO PERFORM SETUP ON A ROUTER OR WIRELESS GATEWAY USING NOTHING BUT HTTP AND WITH NO EXTRA SOFTWARE REQUIRED.
WHY the hell can’t the telcos (this includes cablecos) just provide instructions without making frankly rude assumptions about what kind of computer you have?
e.g.:
Step 1. Plug everything into power.
Step 2. Plug an Ethernet cable (included, see figure 1) into a router port marked “LAN” and your computer’s Ethernet port (illustration, figure 2).
Step 3. Restart your computer.
Step 4. Open a web browser.
Step 5. Click Stop and ignore any error message.
Step 6. Go to [192.x.x.x]
Step 7. Follow the prompts.
There, I just did it. Instructions that will work for any computer from Win98 to Mac OS X to Mac OS 9 to Linux to RiscOS. And hell, I did it for free. Why can’t the companies who are paid to do this, do it without resorting to crummy custom software that only runs on Windows?
When Qwest was USWest I had that job. The lack of service is entirely sales-driven. The more people you can get to activate using your sales code the more money you make and the fewer threats of being laid off you will receive. Can’t say I never had to do the same just to save my job. I had bills to pay and quotas to meet. Sucks for sure. You wouldn’t believe the amount of pressure that management can put on agents. We were trained under the rule of if it won’t generate a sale in 30 seconds get them off your line, it’s no longer your problem.
@Falconfire: Ignoring the rest of the comments, but I fail to see how being able to play a silly memory game means anything.
Then again, a lot of people like making everything difficult. “Hey, why bother using this easy set up dialog, when I can do it in only 17 commands on the terminal! derp derp derp”
But then again, I think Linux is absolute shit for usability and I hate Macs with a passion, so what do I know. Blah blah blah.
But, but… But, it just works!!! (sob)
Lindsey, thank you for the post, and personally I didn’t think it was too long. I am running two Macs with Qwest DSL, but I don’t use wireless. I bought my own router/switch (a D-Link), and “avoided” Qwest’s smoke and mirrors charges for multiple computer home computing.
It can be quite helpful to have a DSL modem and a separate wireless router/switch. This allows for easy isolation of problems. Lindsey, if you got a combined “Advanced Network Modem” I’d HIGHLY recommend returning it and getting a standard one (without router and switch). Then buy your own wireless router/switch. You can ask around for recommendations of a good model.
With separate components you can troubleshoot the individual parts of the connection. You can test the DSL modem communications by hooking your computer up to the modem directly with an Xbase-T cable, and you can test the wireless communications between systems in your LAN through the wireless router/switch independently from the DSL connection.
As for all the other comments, folks, Qwest SAYS EXPLICITLY that they support Macs. Thus their tech support MUST support Macs. NO DEBATE. END OF STORY. See [www.qwest.com] (just click on the bracketted link)
Note how local ISP requirements are IN ADDITION to the ones listed, and don’t EXEMPT them from supporting Macs. FYI, I had no problem in AZ getting Qwest DSL support for my Mac setup, and I’m not even using a “standard” configuration!
If you watch any of the crime programs that feature DNA information, many of the geological/earthquake computers, Sell that House, ads for Rosetta Stone software, you will notice they are all Macs.
@timkline: It is easier at first if it’s what you’re used to. I now have a mac and a pc and for the first few days it was VERY frustrating not being able to do what I could do in a second on my PC, simply because the keys are different and the interface is different, and I didn’t have everything memorized. It’s easier to stick with what you know, than learn something new, even if that something new is easier to use in the long run.
Now after days of using my mac, I had to do some work on the PC and kept trying to hit the apple key.
@SoCalGNX: Even Microsoft’s been known to slip up and use macs (I assume they’re just stock photos or something) in some pics on their website
@jesirose: I’m not sure that’s the case. I’m probably not the average user, but it only takes a day or two to get used to a new interface. Sure I won’t know all the little quirks (“that weird key combo does what?!”) but enough to get the idea that I’m getting fairly comfortable using it. Given all the people I know who’ve switched from Mac OS to Windows and vice versa, none of them are having major interface usability issues (I mean how different is cmd+c as opposed to ctrl+c for copying text?). It’s just the little quirks that are left for you to learn over a longer period of time (i.e. on a Mac apps don’t always quit when you close the last window).
@Xkeeper: Depends on what you’re talking about. Sometimes the terminal commands are a bit more flexible than a setup wizard type thing which ideally is supposed to prevent the end user from fucking up too much but to give them enough power to get the job done. I’m much better at troubleshooting connectivity issues with command line tools than I am with Apple’s connection utility, etc.
@sonichghog: That’s a pretty retarded statement about the similarities of operating systems..or should I say dissimilarities, according to you. Networking basics are something all these operating systems supposedly different all have in common. It’s just a matter of knowing how to go about doing that one common thing across multiple OSs, and that’s something easily changed to fit your needs. Yes, each has its quirks and bugs and incompatibilities and hardware issues, but for basic setup and troubleshooting it usually won’t be a big issue.
Frankly I’m not even sure why Macs are playing such a prominent part in this discussion or why this is titled as though it’s the entire story. So Qwest sucks and they fucked up, but I would imagine the bigger problem here is the bigger picture and the hassle involved with everything else more than the Mac itself..or that’s what you’d think after reading that long email that talks more about the twisted business practices of Qwest than it does about the MacBook.
@crazylady: You’re not sure that something you’re familiar with is easier to use at first than something you’re not, but you agree that it takes a few days to get used to a new system. Okay…
As a former employee of this company I have head stories such as this more times than I care to remember. But I would like to point out one thing to you. The SALES rep is required to ask what operating system you run. If you have a mac they are obligated to inform you that they do not support it in any fashion. It is “try at your own risk”. The MSN ISP services they offer have almost a zero chance of working with your mac but the QWEST.Net with a basic modem should be plug and play. If you want wireless you are best off to buy your own third party wireless router and attach it to the basic modem. While in all likelihood the rep did not inform you of this for whatever reason. Many customers are told and simply do not care until it bites them. Its not Qwest’s responsibility to make all their service or any of them for that mater compatible with anything. But some responsibility does rest on the shoulders of the consumer. ASK, its that simple. and if you would like to be treated well, treat the rep well. If you call in yelling, screaming, making threats or unreasonable demands, thats your choice, and all choices have consequences. Just like your choice to use your cell phone. Quest did not make the choice for you. You did. You chose to pay by the minute. Calls to any company, for tech support especially, are time consuming. EXPECT IT. As for the modem fiasco LISTEN TO YOUR ORDER RECAP. It’s their for a reason. So are the order conformations they mail you. If there was a mistake be cordial about it, and if NEEDED ask for a manager. Mistakes do happen. And most of all remember this about Qwest: THEY ARE FEDERALLY REGULATED! Simply put, they have special restrictions and processes REQUIRED BY LAW. They are not optional.
@ CALIFORNIACAJUN
“Qwest went with the lowest bidder on outsourced phone support, and the user got what Qwest paid for – rude and stupid phone support.”
Actually, that’s not how it works. I used to work in aforementioned “outsourced phone support” company. I worked right next to the Loyalty Department. It’s not the outsourced companies fault. They trained us the best they could, but Qwest provides virtually nothing to train with. You have to follow EVERY step, jump through EVERY hoop laid out by Qwest for fear of losing your job. We never got trained on any other OS but Windows. If you tried to help a customer, and didn’t follow their best practices steps to the T, you risked being fired.
PYLON83 said it right. If anything, blame Qwest for this.
If the answer was no the first time why the hell would it be yes the next 500 times?
Assigned responsibilities 101:
Your ISP has minimal responsibility in trouble shooting a stubborn system. They only know the most basic and rudimentary hook ups.
Your PC tech has more.
They should know the basics on both a MAC and PC, unless their disclaimer details that wireless hookups are self installs. In that case it’s all you. Not saying this is the case but people should know how to completely operate something they own. Not just how to turn it on and click the browser icon. Not saying that everyone should learn programming…just saying they should actually read the manual before calling their ISP or cable provider to give them free help. They sure as crap won’t get free help from a computer tech.
Speaking of Charter:
The tec that came to my house said that things were running too slow because, I had too many things running on my PC–there was about 50 shortcuts to apps on the desktop
Thanks for the informative article. I think it is pretty succint and to the point. People with the attention span of a dead mosquito need not read it.
And of course DLS companies have a right not to support any OS they are not comfortable with, but in such case they MUST inform prospective clients BEFOREHAND, instead of wasting people’s time and money. There should be laws in place enforcing that.
Let’s go through those figures again: Macs represent 11% of all new PC sales. Not the total percent of all PCs. So, there may only be about 4 to 5 percent Mac users.
Still, Macs are a growing presence on the PC scene. Remember that’s 11% of all new PC sales. See that ATM by your bank? That’s a PC inside there. See the automatic toll collection system at your local subway/el? That’s a PC in there. About 15% of all PCs are not used for desktop use.
Now, that 11% also represents all PC sales at both home and business. Since businesses buy about 60% of all desktop systems, and are about 100% Windows, that means Macs represents about 20 to 30 percent of all consumer sales. And, it’s growing. This Christmas shopping season, Macs may represent up to 15% of all PC sales.
So, right now, Quest may not be getting a lot of Mac business, but it is the fastest growing segment of the PC market. They better be prepared.
@brodie7838: Actually, since Qwest says they support Macs, they support Macs. That means that it’s up to you to support Macs. Stop blaming someone else for your own inability to do the job right.
I thought macs “just work.”