CBC Marketplace did a kickass hidden camera investigation into computer repair companies and found only 30% were able to correctly diagnose their problem.
One guy tells them they need to send their computer to a special dust-free room to retrieve the data, which would cost about $2,000. He even copies pictures from the customer’s hard drive to his computer, promising he’ll delete them later. Geek Squad makes an appearance and they don’t do a very good job either, although the Geek’s hair is admirably coiffed.
Marketplace’s advice is to search online for tech help and fix it yourself, backup your data, keep virus and spyware up to date, and if you do go with a tech repair outfit, get referrals from friends and get multiple quotes from different vendors.
And if you like their video, you should check out ours from when we actually caught a Geek Squad tech on-camera stealing porn from our computer.
Getting Gouged By Geeks [CBC Marketplace] (Thanks to The Savvy Boomer!)
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fuckin BUSTED!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Wow, this was kind of an annoying show.
They listed arbitrary prices for what a fix “should” cost, even though some of them were barely more than the basic “bring the computer in” fee at some places.
Next, they did something else to the in home computer than simply the bad RAM. If a computer doesn’t turn on, it’s not because of the RAM.
Finally, they totally glossed over the one company that they brought in the computer too and didn’t even charge them for it, even after telling them how to fix it.
weak clip…obviously biased and if you think people don’t price gouge, then you might as well pull your head out of your butt..if you look at it, this clip pokes fun of the idiocy of the general public, not just the inept abilities of the technician
It’s not unreasonable to charge $120 for 1GB of ram that is delivered and installed on site. There’s administrative costs, travelling costs (gas, etc.), plus of course the cost of the part itself. it may be twice as much if you bought it online….but you’d also have to pay shipping, wait for it to be delivered, and then install it yourself. If you want those benefits then you better learn about computers, or else you gotta pay.
I’m not denying that many companies rip you off but I think it’s a shame they exploited that one guy who correctly diagnosed the issue and offered to upgrade the RAM for a reasonable cost considering the house call. It’s understandable he didn’t have any 256 chips on him….those are obsolete.
This was a very bad news expose. ~25 for a 256MB stick of RAM? Sheesh thats cheap considering s/h. $60 for windows reinstall or repair? Its a sensationalist piece, not a journalistic piece. It could have been done so much better.
You mean those guys at Geek Squad aren’t computer experts!?!?!
In related news, the sky – what color is it? We’ll tell you tonight at 11.
I worked in on-call repair for a very short period of time, and the guy who ran the place /barely/ know what he was doing, even though he charged $90/hr for his ‘services’. I had to charge the same rate – three times what I charged as an independent – even though I only got $30/hr from it, and could finish the jobs in less than half the time he did. He also pushed shit subscription software that did nothing for the consumer but cost.
That job ended after I was asked to install Vista onto a small home business network, which took foooooreeeeveeeer, which was of course blamed on me, and once I was finished, half their software didn’t work and they wanted to go back to XP. Yes, of course all these problems were my fault, even though I told them from the start it was all a bad idea.
The best way to get this done is to have a friend who’s knowledgeable do it, and PAY THEM FAIRLY so they are willing to keep providing good service.
Tip for the public: $30/hr is a fair price. If it takes more than 2-3 hours to fix, it’s cheaper to just replace the HD and copy over your data to the new one.
Tip for repairers: It’s not fair to charge them unless you actually fix their problem. It’s not fair to take more than a few hours to fix their problem. Don’t fight the hardware, equipment is cheaper than labor!
I feel a need to make several points.
1) The memory issue should have been diagnosed by a decent tech within minutes by running Memtest 86+ off of a UBCD, or in a memory tester. I don’t care if you’re on a house call, you bring equipment needed to get the job done right. Pulling the stick of RAM would have told you quite a bit, as most boards will post w/out any, If they have dedicated video and can’t bring along a spare pci vga card. They’re cheap and should be part of any repair kit.
2) Prices are what they are, people have said it already but when I worked for a repair shop, min charge was 30, parts were our cost +25%, and labor went at 60/hr in house, 75/hr on site. You knew upfront, and that was that.
3) I find no fault with the gentleman who tried to upsell a 1gb RAM module that he DID have on hand. It’s a quick, effective fix, and was reasonably priced for the market he is in. If you can buy your RAM online and know how to install it safely, then chances are you can diagnose it being bad on your own.
4) The laptop issue is quirky. Yes, a simple fix is to repair install windows. If it had been brought in to my old shop, we would have done a Hard drive diagnostic, found no bad sectors, no corruption, been willing to call it either user stupidity or the more polite “could be viral” cause, and have repair installed. I know timewise it can often be better to full install, especially if you make a point of reinstalling all the latest drivers and patching windows up to current.
5) The biggest issue I have is none of them seemed to have a set diagnostic pattern they went through. If I went onsite, I came prepared to test – in order. 1) POWER / Connectors / No Shorts 2) Ram, because faulty RAM will give false positives elsewhere. 3) Hard Drive Diagnostic. 4) Any hardware that in particular was an issue in the service tag (IE – can’t get online, check the modem, can’t see anything on screen, check the video card) Most frequently the check for me was to use a known-working card in those slots. 5) Software related issues. these were rare at this point, and generally I would recommend to people that they allow me to backup their Documents that they want to keep and fully reinstall, If I do a repair install I’m charging you for 45 minutes of my time, whether or not it fixes your issue.
A few things:
Virus? Dead HDD, mobo, or CPU? What are these guys smoking (it’s CA, eh?)…
Dead HDD usually generates an error and is easily diagnosed with a USB bridge-board & a laptop which should be part of their kit among other tools. You know, to backup the data before you screw with the system and no charge for the backups other than media cost since it’s automated.
Why are these guys onsite without a POST card? Never would have been an issue, even for a monkey, to diagnose this problem using numeric POST codes. Beeps are much more obscure but still should have be heeded & interpreted.
Since when should a home visit be free? Why would I charge less than $50-70, even if I can’t fix it after all I drove out to your site. You want free diags, come into the store.
Claims of virus detection should be accompanied by detailed reports of what files (and quaranteened copies them) & virus, not just human assumption that odd behaviour is a “phantom” virus. Backups done and a full format/reinstall SHOULD follow since “cleaning” is less than reliable IMHO.
Is anyone actually surprised at the results here? I mean every A+ tech that’s worked under me has been a dolt or a genuine danger to the public. GeekSquad has even lower standard: HS diploma, no certs needed. If you work for them & competent, then you are part of the problem & wasting your time & reputation.
Files accessed during a repair are a non-issue. If you are worried ANYONE might view your sensitive files, then employ encryption on your data as STOP for you storing of sensitive data. Sounds like at least one guy got nailed for what may or may not have been illegal pr0n because he left it in plain sight.
Lastly, what qualifies these CBC journalists to make the crazy claims they make? I mean, great job pointing out the known fact that most repair places & techs are incompetent or crooked but second-guessing prices?
@Iron_Dragon_2.0: A computer with a bad stick of RAM will not necessarily show a display. Occasionally, a RAM error can cause a completely blank screen to be displayed instead of POST.
Does not surprise me at all. I know a few shady techs and it makes us good legitimate techs look bad and have to work harder to fix their screw ups.
As a PC/IT pro of 15 years, and I have to say the article wasn’t entirely fair. I will admit that procedurally, there were indeed some seriously heinous misdiagnoses made by most of those techs. And I’m sure many were motivated by company sales policy or inexperience.
However regarding the pricing perspective, I have to disagree with the conclusions that were drawn. The fair range of prices for parts and services is much wider than the article was willing to allow. You get what you pay for. Sure you can get the cheapest parts you can find on the internet, but then how well they will work and how reliable they are is more or less a roll of the dice. I do not use dirt cheap parts precisely for that reason.
And in-home/on-site service is generally not always as easy to perform as in-store or lab service, and also introduces much greater overhead costs. That is why it costs so much more. So, IMHO the “price gouging” label were uncalled for. Nobody tells a lawyer they are price gouging, in spite of some of the ludicrous prices some of them charge. If the lawyer is too expensive, you look for a cheaper one. If they are all expensive, there is a reason. No profession is any different.
As less tech savvy folks start having computer problems, if they don’t have in-house tech support (i.e., kids living at home) they tend to call or visit one of the growing number of computer fixit services — many of which advertise the fact that they’ll come to your home and fix your computer.
@WraithSama: nevermind all of those silly registry entries required for said programs to actually…i dunno…FUNCTION.
Belittling someone only works when you actually know what you’re talking about.
I feel like this story is completely bogus. Computer repair people are paid for their knowledge, granted that a majority of the people misdiagnosed the RAM issue. However with the software bug if I am doing a computer repair where Windows will boot and have issues (missing system files etc), it seems rather standard to go ahead and run a virus scan, etc to check and see if that is a problem. Granted different virus software use different definitions, there is a chance that they repair person could find something that may have gone unnoticed by the consumers current virus protection. From a tech perspective, we have no idea what the user did, and granted most problems are caused by viruses and the users lack of taking care of the system properly. My next complaint about this piece that when you go to a specialist, you expect to pay more for parts etc. When you go to a mechanic do you not think they add additional costs onto their own? Of course they do, even though labor is their true money maker, products are another way to make a little bit more, which is expected! If you have the know how and computer knowledge, why are you taking your computer to a repair shop in the first place?? If you know that a piece of hardware may be bad, you dont take it in to a shop, you troubleshoot it yourself and order what ever parts you need online to your house and within a few days you are good to go! Hearing news like this really frustrates me when you have an “educated” individual saying products are over priced as well as service. It is only overpriced to THEM because they “know” what to do and how to fix it. The average person doesn’t know what type of RAM they have, is it DDR or DDR2, whats the clock speed? So for the average person, they should expect to pay more to have their computer fixed simply because they don’t know what needs to be done. For a computer nerd, you go to newegg.com or whatever your favorite site is and handle your business yourself.
@almondwine
“They should have blurred his face to keep him from being identified. Aside from the fact that they’re plainly libeling the guy (remember libel doesn’t have to be untrue – in the US anyway, I guess I don’t know Canadian libel law)”
Libel doesn’t have to untrue? I am not a lawyer but from what I understood, defamation is making false statements about a person that causes that person harm, and libel is making defamatory statements in a “fixed” or printed medium (i.e. tv, newspaper, etc.).
Hence, truth is an “absolute defense” for defamation (libel, slander). In legal terms, an absolute defense is one that, if proven true, “automatically” ends the litigation.
@Starfury
I just wanted to second the idea that people are really cheap when it comes to paying their local geek.
Although I wasn’t working in a computer-type job, my friends and family would all depend on me to fix their stuff. At first, I could care less because I was more or less curious and they didn’t expect me to fix it fully. More like a practice run.
Now, my friends try to use me to fix their bricked computers now that they know I can fix a computer fully. My aunts and uncles have begged me to come over and show them how to use computers. It’s not too big a deal, but when you’re sitting there for the third hour in a row repeating everything you’ve said; or you’re at someone’s house for the umpteenth time after they clicked an ad they shouldn’t have and turned off the anti-virus software… it gets old.
As a computer tech myself with my own company here in Phoenix I found this story to be both interesting and disturbing on both ends. The college kids that they used as experts made some mistakes in regards that RAM shouldn’t cost more than $25. If you go into a retail shop it usually costs anywhere from $45-75 depending on the store or if you shop for online. Also, when they installed a bad memory stick for this story they neglected to say how other PC’s might react. I’ve seen some where nothing really happened and others that would beep continuosly.
Also, they didn’t say whether or not they were removing the original RAM or not. I’ve seen on a lot of computers that when that is removed and replaced with a different one then you get a beeping noise and are unable to reach Windows. Yes, the video card when taken out of the computer or if it isn’t seated properly will beep and if integrated to the board will sometimes lead to misdiagnosis but when there is a problem with it installing a new video card in the PCI slot can usually be the quick fix to that issue. Also, not seeing anything on the monitor is your first clue to a video problem.
In regards to the Windows error, I’m surprised that the woman they used as an expert in that part of the story would suggest that by re-installing Windows and not having to back up data that everything is fine. I always recommend that my customers back up their data. Even using the repair portion to Windows is no guarantee that no data will be lost.
The 10 techs they used in this story obviously had no clue what they were doing. The red-shirt from Nerds On Site was the worst of them all and when the President of that company said the guy was fired he should have meant it especially after saying it on camera that he would do so. To keep this bad tech employed will only serve to put more customers at risk to getting scammed. It was completely shocking that this tech was also copying the customer’s data to his laptop. Unless there is good reason to do so, you should always get the ok from the customer especially with all the identity theft happening out there.
This was also not the first time I’ve heard about the Geek Squad doing bad work as well. I think a lot of customers never think to question their business practices or their work because Best Buy is such a known name. I often hear from people who said they overcharged for their work and the problem never got fixed.
Another thing that was wrong with this story is that they got heavy handed in regards to having to pay a tech to come out and look at the problem. Most techs get paid for their time so that shouldn’t be a shocker. Of course some of the rates were completely outrageous. I saw one news article that said Geek Squad charges $125 an hour. I don’t know how the average customer can afford that.
Overall, this story does show that consumers should do their research when hiring a tech to fix their computer and that they should always ask questions. Also, if you get gut feeling that a tech might be bad, listen to that inner voice and keep searching for that one tech that will suit your needs and that you get a good feeling about . Also ask family friends who they use to fix their computer. Most of my customers have come from referrals.
Wow these guys got BUSTED! This is really a shock because when you hire someone for help you expect nothing but professionalism and practice that are par with their expertise. It is sad that some people tend to take advantage of people who do not have adequate knowledge to fix computers.. These people can be doctors and lawyers… Would these computer geeks be happy if they went to the doctor or the lawuer’s workplace and they decide to rip off the Geek because he knows nothing about law and medicine.. That’s not the kind of world we want to live in… These guys should be punished…
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After watching this expose’ and reading the comments I have a couple of observations.
First of all, unfortunately, there is no regulation of the computer repair industry and there are lot of incredibly poor techs out there who only care about how much $$ they will make – not how well their clients are treated. Expecting someone at any chain store where they are making $1.00 over minimum wage to be a great tech is unreasonable, anyway.
Most current techs are “kids” of less than 30 years old. Everyone has to learn somewhere, but they shouldn’t be ‘learning’ at the expense of paying customers. I’m always looking for exceptional technicians and they are incredibly hard to find. Most are piss-poor diagnosticians and have no basic electronics knowledge at all – which makes a world of difference when troubleshooting hardware problems. Almost none have the extensive EE background I and a few of my associates have.
Secondly, on the subject of bad RAM, memory is incredibly sensitive to static electricity discharges. Even a small ‘zap’ you never notice can damage the RAM over time. From weeks to months to years, memory will fail after being zapped. I’ve seen it hundreds of times in the 14 years I’ve owned and operated The Computer Wizard in Plano, TX. That’s why our shop is a full anti-static environment. I’ve seen lots of computers come in un-bootable due to an end-user installing his (almost always men) own RAM.
A good shop will always make sure the customer’s data is protected before doing anything that will risk their important files. We routinely recover data destroyed by other sloppy shops. Reinstalling the OS is sometimes the least expensive and fastest way to get a computer turned-around but it’s a major hassle for the end user, as they have to reinstall all their apps, get their email reconfigured and make everything look and feel the way they had it before — and this is incredibly daunting to the casual user. A good shop is going to charge some serious $$ to take good care of the customer and they are entitled to do this — as they have to stay in business so they’ll be around the next time their clients need them.
Our overhead is substantial – rent, advertising, phones, insurance, expensive diagnostic software, even more expensive forensics hardware and software, storage, etc. all cost a bundle and not expecting to pay for this is ludicrous. Any service shop that’s “cheap” won’t be around the next time you need them, as they won’t be able to afford to stay in business — or they’ll cut corners like crazy, risking your data in the process — or they simply won’t do a thorough diagnostic job and you’ll have a dead computer a few weeks or months down the road after paying to have “unrelated” repairs done.
We all pay for bad service. Thinking the cheapest is the best is faulty logic. Basing decisions strictly on price is dangerous. Referrals are key and we receive roughly 25% of our business from referrals. A shop that consistently does a good job and looks out for their customers will be around to solve the next problem that comes up – but they won’t be the cheapest place in town…
The Geek Squad has become notorious for bad service and bad habits. Everyone should know that by now. Smaller, independent shops will always be a better gamble than chain stores or franchises because they can’t afford to do consistently bad work – they’ll go out of business.