Will July 29, go down in history as airline traveler’s Stonewall? 120 passengers staged a protest aboard Continental Flight 1669 after waiting on the runway for over five hours.
So passengers began drumming in unison on the overhead bins. The crew freaked out, one steward admonished them “for destroying airline property,” and eventually the police were called, who boarded the plane and disembarked the passengers Continental had said were “becoming violent.”
70 of the passengers later signed a petition which said:
We did not have water, food, toilet paper.. The toilets were clogged and completely unsanitary. Moreover, there were a number of children and older and special-needs passengers, including a diabetic and a pregnant woman, who desperately needed attention.
So…how’s that Passenger’s Bill of Rights coming?
Right There on the Tarmac, the Inmates Revolt [NYT] (Thanks to Melinda!)
(Photo: FlyGuy92586)
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This reminds me of that story of the guy with the mini camcorder. Just do something that freaks out the crew, get the police called, and everyone has to get taken off of the plane. It just has to be something that doesnt actually get you fined (or arrested!).
Good. It’s about time that the airlines and the airports realise that keeping people for this length of time in these conditions is just completely wrong. If more passengers were willing to make a stand and say calmly, but insistently, “this is unreasonable. let us off this plane.” they would have to fix the underlying causes of these problems. I said in another thread – a law is needed stating that once a plane is boarded and the doors closed, it must take off in 2 hours, return to the gate, or get the passengers off in some other way. Any passenger held longer is entitled to a FULL refund of their fare, and the airline and airport share a HEFTY fine – ie, enough to make sure that they will not let situations like this occur.
“It just has to be something that doesnt actually get you fined (or arrested)”
…wish it was that simple. these days it seems that society as a whole is oversensitive to the slightest “disruptive” situations.
things will never change if people dont stand up and fight back.
sadly getting arrested/sued/fined seems to be a common result of standing up for one’s rights as a human being.
The airlines have this notion that they’re doing us all a favor by being in business. Snarly employees and a ridiculous notion that even though we paid to sit in that nasty tube for hours, it’s something we do not enjoy.
Eventually, someone is going to die from deep vein thrombosis from sitting so long in cramped seats, and then the changes will happen after lengthy lawsuits. But not until then.
Sue them.
File a small claims court, subpœna a senior executive.
Not for the money, but just for the annoyance factor. When enough senior executives are quagmired in small claims court or they get enough summary judgment against them, they will stand at a better attention.
I was quietly hoping that this might become the norm.
Consumerist, you failed to mention how the passengers were treated when they were taken off the plane… they had to file out single file and under watch of a police with dogs:
‘As passengers described it, once the police ordered the plane emptied, they filed out into the secure area, where some said they felt as if they were being treated like suspects.
“As we walked down the hallway, we were yelled at like we were scary criminals by this female cop who had a dog. She kept yelling: ‘Stay against the wall!’ ” Mr. Niezen said.’
So far the airlines have gotten lucky. Sooner or later there is actually going to be real violence in one of these situations. At this point the fear of a huge lawsuit should be enough to scary any airline straight.
It is time for a rich, lawyer type to file a class action naming all the airlines.
Who wants to sit in a cylindrical prison for 5 hours?
These flights get hot, they refuse to serve beverages, the toilets always clog and *surprise* people don’t like it.
Love that NYT headline. Its a shame that it has to come to this but it has. WTG passengers, I’d probably do the same thing. This really should be a basic human rights issue. I’m baffled at how they can do that but its more disturbing to me that society puts up with it. We used to stand up and fight for our rights, now we just roll over and hand them all back.
BTW, chips and pretzels do NOT constitute food.
@JohnOB1: Also, there was another report, Continental said something like, “we had 300 successful landings that day…blah blah blah.” As if that’s supposed to offset the nightmare.
This is a good thing if it was indeed not destructive, but disruptive. We don’t sign away our rights just because we purchase a service or enter a store. Standing up for basic rights as a group sends the best message to the country and to the industry.
Why I don’t fly, reason 4,156.
sounds a lot like being held hostage, except the “hostage-takers” have nothing to gain. haven’t people tried to use the emergency exits in any of these situations? this qualifies as an emergency in my book.
also, you could totally *drive* from baltimore to newark in less than 5 hours. it’s pretty sad when cars can do the job faster than planes.
Not to take the side of the airlines, because god knows I’ve been stuck on a plane for 3 hours on the tarmac and was thisclose to staging my own revolt, but playing Devil’s Advocate, I really don’t assume that airlines have a vested interest in detaining anyone on a plane for an exorbitant amount of time. The pilots and the crew don’t want to be stuck on there just as much as the passengers don’t want to be there. I firmly believe that if they had their druthers, they’d be letting passengers off ASAP if they could. I think there are very good reasons for keeping a plane on tarmac with passengers inside. I don’t know those reasons, so maybe an airline could enlighten us — possibly things like insurance, liability, etc. — but I just think there are reasons they do this. It’s not because they feel like making 200+ people miserable for sh*ts and giggles…
The answer is to allow more foreign airlines into the US. They seem to know how to do things- look at Virgin America. Now I just want to see Singapore Airlines or ANA set up shop in America.
I will instigate this kind of disruption if I’m ever stuck for more than one hour with the door closed. We need to make these corporations afraid to hold us hostage.
If we had a passenger’s bill of rights, wouldn’t your president just veto it anyway?
I don’t like to solve customer service problems with legislation. If more people simply said that this was unacceptable and started drumming on bins
, this might get resolved sooner.
WHEN is someone going to put a stop to this kind of nonsense!?
God.. I’m flying from Chicago to Florida tomorrow… I hope hope hope it doesn’t come down to this. O’Hare is notorious for delays… Reading this post gets me so wound up.. I’ve literally been pacing in my office.
I wonder if the depature and arrival times printed on tickets can be held as an expectation of service. any unreasonable difference from the these times would then constitute breach of contract, and entitle the purchaser to a refund.
i don’t know how the air industry got away with providing such bad service, and has the right to screw people over for being mildly disruptive. i once saw a (black) guy get pulled out of a plane by police because he went to use the bathroom while the plane was on the tarmac, and responded to the stewardess’ bitchy instructions with a similarly lippy comment.
PINKBUNNYSLIPPERS: The airlines do have an incentive to keep people trapped in a plane on the tarmac as opposed to in the terminal. If the doors are closed and the plane is on the tarmac, it still counts as having left the gate. Therefore, the airline can still count the flight as an on-time departure. I know air traffic controllers that complain about this all the time — they tell the plane that they will not be able to take off for hours and to stay at the gate, but they close the doors and pull back the jetway anyway, and then blame air traffic control for the delay.
It’s not the passengers, it’s the airlines that are revolting.
@ PINKBUNNYSLIPPERS
You asked why they would leave people in the plane on the tarmac. The reason is the flight attendents get paid only after the plane leaves the gates. The pilots know this and help them get more money. If you want this to end then the airlines should probably pay the staff the whole time even when they are at the gates.
It really is a shame that there hasn’t been any video footage of these situations yet. I think it would do wonders to have video of the clogged toilets and useless crew.
@jitrobug:
record it twice using two different tapes(but conceal the tape swap). hide one and have one ready to hand over with the footage if asked by police, etc.
post 2nd tape to you tube…consumers win!
@jitrobug
boy oh boy, I cant wait till video calling on cell phones starts happening!
@gibsonic: reasonable idea. I can see the airlines getting mighty unhappy with this and pulling a ban of all photography on board a plane (national securty reasons of course). YouTube wouldnt want to host videos that compromise national security.
I like the part of the article where they walk past the shouting police woman with the dog. As if going through an airport doesn’t make you feel like enough of a criminal these days.
With a diabetic and pregnant woman ‘needing attention’, what would it take for this to warrant a passenger to call 911 and request medical help ?
I can see that in this situation (an international flight being diverted); there are immigration and security complications. But surely there are reasonable plans to deal with this eventuality ? What happens with regard to immigration/in the event of an international flight diverting due to a serious mechanical problem ?
@BritBoy:
if they don’t, then cnn or some other news outlet will…
I used to be a Continental Elite frequent flyer but haven’t flown with them in 7 years. Their customer service agent provided horrible service back then so I’m not surprise it’s worse now. Their seats are so narrow and cramped you can’t even bend your knee. Their ffb miles is basically worthless because you can’t find a domestic seat without blowing 60,000 miles. shame on Continental and good riddance.
Delays are inevitable and we all know that, of course 5 hours is totally unreasonable, and I’m willing to accept a shorter delay (2…maybe 3 hours). I’ve heard the excuse before that they can’t go back to the gate b/c it’s no longer available or they don’t want to lose their place in line should planes be allowed to take off. I don’t know if those excuses are BS but in some cases I’m willing to accept them. There are plenty of things though that can be done to keep people happy:
1. Have the airport (someone from your airline) bring out food and water (real food)…why does this sound like a bank heist with hostages now
2. Let people walk around a bit
3. Try to give updates and at least let people know wtf is going on.
4. Don’t get attitudes (this goes for both sides, passengers and crew)
5. Lastly and my personal pet peeve…LEAVE THE F*CKING AC ON! No one wants to sit in a hot, humid, @ss-smelling cigar tube.
From the article:
“One of the officers “told us the report they got was that passengers were violent and out of control,” Ms. Murray said.”
Isn’t that libel? Isn’t that why the passengers were treated like this:
“As passengers described it, once the police ordered the plane emptied, they filed out into the secure area, where some said they felt as if they were being treated like suspects.
“As we walked down the hallway, we were yelled at like we were scary criminals by this female cop who had a dog. She kept yelling: ‘Stay against the wall!’ ” Mr. Niezen said.”
The airline staff pull this kind of crap on every incident. It’s time for people to start suing.
I did some looking to see what the situation in Canada is. The only stories or complaining about long flight delays had to do mostly with weather and there seemed to be far fewer incidents than here.
They do seem to engage in the same security theater that we have here. Liquids in small bottles in a zip lock bag. Requiring you be there 3 hours ahead of an international flight.
We have been planning to take a trip to Europe, driving a bit further to catch the flight in Canada is sounding like a better idea.
@startertan:
#3 is right on the money.
I’m kind of sympathetic to the airlines on a lot of this, but not on the communication issue. For god’s sake, TELL US WHAT’S GOING ON! Tell us what you know, what you don’t know, and when you’re going to know more. Don’t leave passengers in the dark.
What they did is called civil disobedience and I applaud them. Sometimes the only way to change an intolerable situation is to be willing to go to jail.
I just can’t believe it hasn’t happened sooner.
it’s kind of like at work here. We use to be able to get out of the building by about 5 or 6 doors on this end of the building. (flights use to be more on time without all this BS)
however due to the thievery of some of my fellow employees (9/11, Dept Homeland security, shitty airlines, etc) we now have to go in and out of one entrance for the building with security searches coming and going (TSA, no water bottles, check shoes, no visitors to gates, etc).
We have often half-joking/half-serious talked about as a group to all just go out one of the side doors to show how stupid this is. The doors aren’t locked for fire code reasons and we were told if we used them for anything but an emergency we would be fired, no questions asked. What would they do, fire everybody? Hardly. Civil disobedience as a group is the most powerful tool we have to protect our rights.
Cheers to the passengers of the civil disobedience on that plane and double cheers to the man or woman with the stones (metaphorically of course) to stand up and rally others in the cause.
It’s about time that people figured out there’s strength in numbers. Now if only they’d apply it to politics.
I hope that if I were in that situation (and I’m flying to Europe next week), I would have the presence of mind to turn on the audio recording function of my mp3 player. Most non-iPod players seem to have ‘em. You have to ask first in some states, though.
Has this ever happened on a Southwest flight?
God bless America, and God bless Bush! Thanks to the Patriot Act if anything that remotely “threatens” the well being of a flight attendant is done even if passengers are being treated like crap, the “safety” of the flight attendant will always be held in high esteem.
@jamar0303: See the problem is actually half airlines half airports. The airports just cant accomodate that many planes. The pilot and the airline company want to take off but are stuck in the never ending cue.
@AlteredBeast said, “Just do something that freaks out the …: Like get on the floor, face Mecca and start praying in pseudo-arabic. That should work!
oh PLEASE! Bunch of whiney passengers! No, I wouldn’t be happy either, but getting pissed at Continental isn’t going to solve anything here – the reason they couldn’t get off was because it was an international flight, and they weren’t supposed to get out of the plane without going through customs, etc. Yes, they probably could have taken care of the diabetic lady situation a bit better, but Continental said they had provided assistance (sandwich) to the diabetic passenger. It’s their word against a DIFFERENT passenger (the article doesn’t have anything from the diabetic passenger) who is pissed off because of a 5-hour weather delay.
What the hell were they thinking when they started banging on stuff like a bunch of 10, no 5-year olds? “Oh, maybe they’ll start treating us better?” If anything, doing that probably cost them more time stalling at the airport while the police were called over and such.
On a different note, this is like the third time I’m defending Continental, maybe I’ll get banned for being a crony. Disclosure: I don’t work for Continental, I don’t own any stock, I don’t know anyone at Continental.
the only problem with civil disobedience is that bored, excitable, and corrupt police/security people are armed to the teeth, just dying to deploy their various weapons, and completely off the hook even if they kill someone.
Even if the airline took some of their customers to court over it, you’d just have to make sure the case goes before a jury. Imagine them trying to explain that case in font of a jury, with the testimony of other passengers backing you up.
Hell, you could probably get away with pulling the emergency hatch if you were stuck for 10+ hours.
A much better tact would have been:
* Each passenger rings a stew and says “I want off this plane now!” politely of course.
* When the answer comes back no. You simply state “I am being held against my will. That is a federal offense.”
* Each passenger does that in turn.
* Then somebody picks up the cell phone to the FBI and requests agents be dispatched.
Now I don’t know what the outcome will be because as far as I know it has never been tried. But I do know of a case where a stupid car dealer did the equivalent (eg was ‘inspecting the trade’ hence holding the keys). The FBI did show up and advised the dealership that either the customer has their car or we have the floor manager.
If this kind of thing ever happens to me I plan on sending the airline a bill for my wasted time.
once again, I wonder if the “no fly list” is really just a way to make the airlines more money. If you are refused boarding after you have paid your ticket in good faith, have they not just stolen money from you? Why can’t we know if we’re “on” the list before buying a ticket in the first place?