ASAP Van Lines Dispute Resolved In Favor Of Consumer

The results of a reweigh yesterday showed that ASAP Van Lines mistakenly overcharged Candace for her shipment.

In a reweigh conducted under the supervision of the Colorado Department of Weights and Measures, Bailey’s Public Scales found the weight to be 980 lbs. ASAP Van Lines had billed her for 2100 pounds. Initially, based on her item list, ASAP quoted Candace for 1800 lbs.

The inaccurate weight seems to have sprung from a computer error at the original weigh station, says ASAP Van Lines.

Colorado Department of Weights and Measures is conducting an investigation into the incident.

Candace says she plans on filing a complaint with the State’s Attorney.

In an email, Tiffany from ASAP Van Line wrote, “If a customer has any questions on a move, all they have to do is request a reweigh… the best way to close a matter is to just simply follow procedure and remain calm.” — BEN POPKEN

PREVIOUSLY:
Update On That ASAP Van Lines Dispute
ASAP Van Lines Responds To Complaint Alleging $400 Bilking
Watch Out For Scammy Movers

Comments

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  1. tinychicken says:

    Oooh look! Tare! We know what that means!

  2. SOhp101 says:

    wow, so if she didn’t contest the change they would have charged her over twice the cost?!

    erase my previous comments on the older posts, moving companies are all scum.

  3. tonkyhonk says:

    Looks like ASAP should have just kept their mouths shut! This incident will likely end up consuming more money and man hours than they would have earned on the 300 pound fraudulent overcharge attempt.

  4. homerjay says:

    Ahh yes… If the world is against you and you start appearing guilty, just blame the computer.

  5. tvh2k says:

    I have to admit, after Tiffany’s response, I was beginning to doubt Candace. My how I was wrong!

    U-haul is a scam, movers are a scam, I guess we should just never move!

  6. Moosehawk says:

    Wow a 1120 pound difference? That’s one hell of a computer glitch.

  7. tinychicken says:

    @tvh2k: After just having moved last weekend (though not finished unpacking), I swear that I will never move again.

    Again.

  8. tinychicken says:

    @tinychicken:

    Holy weird grammar there. Sorry.

  9. Spider Jerusalem says:

    *laugh* “Gawwwd. All she had to do was ASK. She didn’t have to go tattling to the State. GAWD!”

    That’s how that last quote sounded to me.

  10. tvh2k says:

    @tinychicken: And here I was thinking that you swore for a second time that you would never move again.

    Again.

    :-P

  11. acambras says:

    The results of a reweigh yesterday showed that ASAP Van Lines mistakenly overcharged Candace for her shipment. [Bold text mine.]

    “Mistakenly” implies that there was a good faith error — an honest mistake. Maybe it was — I don’t know. Maybe their “mistake” was that they got caught?

  12. BritBoy says:

    oooo oooo, and Tiffany was sounding so reasonable, but “sprung from a computer error” ??

    Starting to sound like passing the buck. The customer had the contract with ASAP; me-thinks you and or the weigh station need to take the rap now. Given the magnitude of the ‘error’, ASAP should eat the whole cost here out of contrition……..otherwise it starts to look like, ‘we will overcharge & use weigh stations with ‘errors’ where-ever possible, most customers won’t notice or complain to the state’.

    You promise not to have another ‘error’ in your favor ?

  13. Skeptic says:

    “mistakenly”??? overcharged Candace for her shipment??

    One of the notable points of this dispute before the weight in was that it was beyond reasonable to believe that the customer had 2000 pounds of goods. The Van Line has fought them on this and agreed to the re-weigh because they have to, not out of the goodness of their hart. Now they act like they were honestly mistaken. Yeah, right…

    If the customer hadn’t gone to extreme lengths to protect her rights, like refusing delivery, the van line would have taken her money and there would never have been any way to contest the fees.

  14. Hawkeye1659 says:

    Hey, move all you want. Just take the money that you would have spent, buy a bunch of beer and steaks (or tofu for the vegans) and offer your friends a great drinking feast if they help you out. And always be prepared to help when they need it as well.

  15. ShadowFalls says:

    Their explanation of the problem is not much different than another company. They will just shift the blame to someone else, that someone else will naturally shift the blame in a never ending cycle. It is quite clear, asking for a reweigh wouldn’t have been enough in this manner, as this would get refused as it would show their gross incompetence.

  16. doodbugboodles says:

    Friends of mine just bought a moving van to use for their move from MO to CA and they will just resell it once they get there. I honestly thought they were nuts until I read about this.

  17. chrisgoh says:

    I guess I have to eat my words too. I thought Tiffany sounded more reasonable. I’d love to see the Weights and Measures report. Either the scales are really out of whack or ASAP just got busted.

  18. Uriel says:

    Hear your own procedures there Tiff? Remain calm, don’t leave screaming voice-messages that can be used against you in a court of law.

  19. crayonshinobi says:

    “If a customer has any questions on a move, all they have to do is request a reweigh… the best way to close a matter is to just simply follow procedure and remain calm.”

    Yeah…follow procedure by signing their non-dispute form to prevent you from disputing the charges later. Then, remain calm while they scream at you to accept delivery and accept the “fact” that your shipment weighs twice what it actually does. As for the reweigh, you’ll have to contact the Department of Weights and Measures to force them to submit to one, and only after they have delayed for 2 weeks.

    The inaccurate weight seems to have sprung from a computer error at the original weigh station, says ASAP Van Lines.

    I guess we’ll never know if it’s true because after three and a half weeks, we still haven’t been given the original weigh docs from ASAP. This might also explain why their story kept changing, 1800lbs->2100lbs->2300lbs…apparently the scale malfunctioned at a quantum level…the results themselves changing every time they were examined.

  20. Falconfire says:

    If it had simply been the original 1800 pounds I could have seen it, thats almost double the real weight and could have easily been caused by a glitch.

    But then they added another 200 lb to it, that screams scam.

  21. BritBoy says:

    @crayonshinobi: “malfunctioned at the quantum level” !!!!

    The act of measuring the weight causes the weight to change ! We should really be talking about ‘mass’, perhaps the gravitational field changed between loading and unloading ? We cant hold ASAP to account for the laws of physics :-)

    Oh boy, ASAP are looking soooo bad. Does the dept. of weights/measures take it upon themselves to follow thr’ with this ‘error’ ?

  22. pronell says:

    Now hold on here… wasn’t the original complaint that she had been told she would be charged for volume, and not weight?

    I understand that she was still overcharged by a hefty sum, but it still has nothing to do with the original complaint.

  23. jeffislouie says:

    I think this boils down to a mistake.
    ASAP didn’t seem to put up much of a fight to me, and the only person who claimed that there was a screaming voicemail was the customer, who the ASAP employee shed a little light on.
    Was ASAP in the wrong? Sure.
    But they agreed to rectify the situation and actually did it.
    Not that Candace ended up being wrong, but it seems to me that she could have handled it a bit better. Having worked directly with customers for over 10 years, I can tell you a few things:
    -customers often lie to get what they want
    -customer often exaggerate to get what they want
    -usually, the customer is right but their approach is wrong.

    I once had a woman screaming at me at the top of her lungs over cheese on a sandwich.
    She ordered cheese on her turkey sub and she didn’t see it.
    I was managing the sub shop at the time and working the line, so I asked to see the sandwich. When I opened it up, there it was – CHEESE! I apologized and offered to make her a new sandwich, with extra cheese, at no cost and tried to explain to her that we didn’t use a lot of cheese and to ask for me next time. I promised to give her extra cheese at no cost (extra cheese cost a dime at the time).
    She continued to scream at me for pointing out the cheese, saying “The customer is always right.”
    I looked at her and said: “Absolutely. And I am happy to fix the problem. But, it seems, in this case what you were upset about was that there wasn’t enough cheese.”
    She continued to berate me, my staff, my company etc.
    So after I made her a free sandwich, gave her extra cheese for free, and gave her a coupon for a free sub (I even wrote extra cheese free! on the coupon), she continued to tell me how the customer was always right.
    So, frustrated and a little tired of her yelling at me over a $4 sandwich, I said:
    “Ma’am, the customer is always right, even when they are wrong. There was cheese on the sub. Had you been nice about it, you still would have gotten a new one and I still would have comped your next one. Now all you’ve done is ruin my day over a $4 sub. Turn around and walk away or I’m going to take your picture and instruct my entire staff to never again serve you.”
    It made me feel good, but wasn’t right.
    My point? There are always two sides to a story. In this case, Candace likely could have gotten the same result if she managed to keep calm.
    I know that’s not going to be popular around here, but it’s the truth. I will always go out of my way for a customer if they are reasonable and calm with me. When they blow up and scream at me, I just want them to stop. Sometimes that means losing a customer and sometimes that can be a good thing too.

  24. Smashville says:

    Hmm…looks like the crow here is mine. Sounds like ASAP bluffed and got called on it…

  25. leggs says:

    ASAP got caught with their hands in the cookie jar this time. Wonder how many other people were cheated. Looks to me that the customer knew a fraud when she saw it. Good going Candace.

  26. Nickelking says:

    @jeffislouie:
    Seriously, when I worked at a hotel we’d constantly get customers continuing to complain about something as we were in the process of fixing it. You’ve made your displeasure known, now would like the problem resolved, or would you like me to soothe you?

  27. Hawk07 says:

    Bailey?

    Bailey was the “wabbit” that had the first succesfull reattachment of a foot stolen for use as a luck charm.


    Thank you Bailey!

  28. Venarain says:

    @jeffislouie:
    i agree completely. loosing your shit at someone never does anyone any good. after waiting tables and working retail for my entire professional career, i always err on the side of politeness. most often the person you are face to face with is NOT the person responsible for the problem, so freaking out just means they are less likely to help you figure out who IS responsible. i can’t tell you how many times i’ve decided to be unreasonably inflexible about a return policy or passing something on to my boss just cause the person was a complete dick about expressing their displeasure.

  29. Uriel says:

    @jeffislouie:
    Are you thick or do you simply need to grow a brain? She wasn’t in the wrong with anything she did. She refused to pay for something she did not agree upon. What makes you think that Tiffany didn’t do anything that had been said about her? This is how people ALWAYS go about collecting money they “feel” is owed to them, even when it’s through a scam. Tiffany tried to get her to accept the package, so that she would then be held accountable for the charges that she had NOT agreed upon. Big surprise. Its possible that this moving company doesn’t employ the same scam tactics every other one uses, but its really not likely…OH WAIT!! They do employ the same scam tactics that every other moving company uses…the weigh-in proved that…silly me…

  30. doodbugboodles says:

    @pronell: The drive tried to charge her an extra $400 for volume, if memory serves, but the original contract was based on weight.

  31. FinanceGuru says:

    @jeffislouie

    I started to read this post and thought, “Gee. I wonder when jeffislouie will post in his role as the Chief Apologist?”

    Lo and behold there you are. You’re nothing if not consistent.

  32. GameMasterZer0 says:

    @jeffislouie:
    hhmmm seems someone is for ASAP…. we deem to shed a little light, how did she ask for a re-weigh cause the people her emailed her totip her off about it. Saying a computer simple “mistaking” mde an error by double the weight is hardly believe-able. It’s is like saying “ALL” the weights in Colorado didn’t work. Did they just measure it with one? So it weighed like 980 ilbs… isnt below a minium job for ASAP. sO THEY CHARGED HER MORE PER POUND PER ITEM SO IT WOULD OF BEEN CHEAPER! and ASAP doesn’t lower it’s prices (ON the website:P ) My conspiracy theory is you work at ASAP with tiff and is throwing out commits to make the consumer look like an idiot or a hot head cause you made a simple post on a website and it makes ASAP look made, yet you defend Tiff when SHE attacks her on this page when probably never knew of the site till she searched ASAP on google. It’s funny that is on the first page… maybe thats why she asked for it to be removed.

  33. wakamole says:

    It seems to me that the problem is that ASAP doesn’t seem to have someone competent enough to estimate weight by items and quickly note that the billed weight was wrong. Not unexpected in Colorado. So the customer is stuck waiting for the reweigh. That’s why the initial charges should be binding – when I ask for that, the movers generally send someone who just knows what things weigh.

  34. jeffislouie says:

    @nerodiavolo:
    “Are you thick or do you simply need to grow a brain?”

    How unusual – someone from the consumerists’ elite readership flexing their intellectual muscle by calling someone else stupid.

    “She wasn’t in the wrong with anything she did. She refused to pay for something she did not agree upon. What makes you think that Tiffany didn’t do anything that had been said about her? “

    Someone needs to read the whole story.
    ASAP tried to discuss the matter with her and she screamed at her, according to the ASAP rep. The ASAP rep wrote in to the consumerist to give her side of the story – you must have missed it.

    What makes me think Tiffany didn’t do anything that had been said about her? Well, for one thing I never said that, but I tend to give the benefit of the doubt to BOTH sides of the story rather than just accept one side.
    What makes you think that Candace didn’t exaggerate her side of the story and leave out big chunks that might have made her look less than saintly?
    It seems to me that both sides made mistakes.
    But once again, this boils down to my experience with customers weighing in to the situation (excuse the pun).
    Go back and read BOTH sides of the story. Then think what you want.
    In my experience (over ten years in direct contact with customers in various industries), customers think that if they handle things politely and accurately describe the event, they won’t get help and won’t be able to resolve the issue. So they exaggerate and leave out parts of the story they feel might weaken their point.
    Go read what Tiffany had to say about all of this – she claims that she tried to deal with it properly and was screamed at, hung up on, and, if I recall, threatened with a lawsuit – all before she could attempt to resolve the issue. Then Tiffany volunteered to have the shipment weighed and agreed to change the deal if the weights were different. Sounds pretty reasonable to me.
    It seems to me that much of this could have been avoided if Candace had been polite and patient and tried to deal with this rationally.
    By the way, the estimate was based on volume, not weight.

  35. jeffislouie says:

    @FinanceGuru:
    “I started to read this post and thought, “Gee. I wonder when jeffislouie will post in his role as the Chief Apologist?”

    Lo and behold there you are. You’re nothing if not consistent.”

    And I was wondering how long it would take you to stalk me over to this thread to post negative nonsense about me.
    I am not an apologist.
    But I believe that people here tend to take sides prematurely and rarely are open to alternatives.
    Like the sheep you are, you fell into the same trap.
    I know, it’s all my fault. I’m a bad person for saying that Candace likely exaggerated her story and left out parts of her behavior that might have explained why this became such a huge issue.
    I guess this is just another example of businesses screwing individuals.
    Of course, being a professional like you are, you understand that repeat business is what keeps businesses alive and that no business, especially the moving business, really profits from the one time customer.
    Hey, here’s a wacky idea – instead of attacking me, why not discuss my opinion or try to tell me how wrong I am?
    I’ve moved at least half a dozen times and used movers each time.
    I’ve never been ‘screwed’ even though there have been issues.
    I’ve managed to resolve the issues by remaining calm and explaining myself without yelling, screaming, hanging up on people, or making threats. Funny how that works.
    What’s next, are you going to advocate punching the cashier at McDonalds when he puts too much mayo on your Big N Tasty? Even better, call the CEO at home! That’ll solve the problem!
    The consumerist is good site that genuinely tries to help people out.
    Some of the people who post comments don’t take the time that the consumerist does to do research and use common sense.
    The best part of the consumerist is the writers – the worst part is that there are far too many people who comment without using common sense.
    So direct your anger and stalkerish behavior elsewhere – your ad hominem is neither interesting, nor is it an indication that I am incorrect.
    Will you be posting wherever I do and attacking me every time I post or can we call an end to this?

  36. ingridc says:

    @GameMasterZer0: @nerodiavolo: First let me clarify that I completely agree that ASAP was entirely in the wrong for the whole situation, and really could have screwed over the customer had the customer not been so diligent about getting things right. Candace and crew deserve many kudos for sticking to their guns, AND I will never go with ASAP now that we know the whole story. However, I have to agree with jeffislouie on this one. There’s definitely a reason that some people (myself included) were beginning to doubt the customers’ story (see other posts above).

    jeffislouie could have used a better example of a horrid customer experience, but in my experience waiting tables and in customer service, when the customer is calm and not angry, I’ve ALWAYS been more inclined to a) believe the customer, and b) go out of my way to make things right. I think in the ASAP case, Tiffany’s language was calm and professional, whereas (don’t hate me here!) Candace’s language was accusatory and typical of the kind of customer that can never be pleased no matter what you do. That’s why I was starting to sway towards Tiffany’s side.

    Like I said, the customer was ABSOLUTELY right in this case, and they had every right to be upset, but keeping the accusatory and vitriolic language to a minimum ALWAYS works in your favor. I think this was jeffislouie’s point, and I think many people I know who have ever waited tables or worked as a CSR would agree.

    I think of it this way: Of all of the customer complaint letters we’ve seen here on Consumerist, I’m always the most impressed by the ones who lay out the facts in a clear and even polite manner, and without implied anger. In my experience, I and my co-workers want to right the wrongs of a reasonable customer before duking it out with an angry one.

  37. ingridc says:

    p.s. – I also don’t condone calling people sheep. *ahemjeffislouieahem*.

  38. jeffislouie says:

    @ingridc:
    “p.s. – I also don’t condone calling people sheep. *ahemjeffislouieahem*.”

    Sorry.
    Is lemming better?
    Lamb?

    Is there a better way to say: “As per usual, you are blindly following the crowd and jumping on the bandwagon without giving the other side of the story any thought?

    My apologies.

  39. ingridc says:

    @jeffislouie: Hahaha, perfect!

  40. jeffislouie says:

    @ingridc:
    Glad to see your sense of humor is intact!
    people take this way too seriously.

  41. dwneylonsr says:

    Just because Candace was vindicated doesn’t mean that she was a innocent being downtrodden by the Man.

  42. FinanceGuru says:

    @jeffislouie:

    “And I was wondering how long it would take you to stalk me….”

    Don’t flatter yourself. Calling you out on stupidity twice does not constitute stalking. I don’t care enough about you.

    “I am not an apologist.”

    And I’m the King of France. Look, merely making declarations makes them true.

    “I’ve moved at least half a dozen times and used movers each time.”

    I’ve moved three times and haven’t been screwed. What exactly does that prove?

    “What’s next, are you going to advocate punching the cashier at McDonalds when he puts too much mayo on your Big N Tasty? Even better, call the CEO at home! That’ll solve the problem!”

    Lame strawmen. But par for your course. That said, sometimes calling the CEO at home works. Since the fact that you’ve moved and haven’t been screwed proves something, the fact I’ve called execs at home to get something does worked, then aren’t we even?

    Oh right, anecdotal evidence isn’t all that worthwhile.

    “So direct your anger and stalkerish behavior elsewhere – your ad hominem is neither interesting, nor is it an indication that I am incorrect.”

    Do you even have any idea what ad hominem means? (That was a rhetorical question. Clearly, based on your improper use of the term, you don’t.) Calling you a knucklehead isn’t ad hominem. It may be a personal attack, but it’s not ad hominem. Also, I’m not angry. Again, I’d have to care what you think to get angry. I posted in response to your blather because you’re full of it.

    “Will you be posting wherever I do and attacking me every time I post or can we call an end to this?”

    I don’t care enough about you to post every time you do. Get over yourself.

  43. MommaShenobi says:

    It would help if procedures were followed voluntarily instead of being forced.

    I had to call Colorado Weights and Measures and with the dilgence of that department (Jonathan Handy)is why this weigh even took place.

    Because of the on going investigation I am not able to discuss more than this information.

    I am committed to keeping the Consumerist/Ben informed and hope my experience will help the next person.

  44. jeffislouie says:

    @FinanceGuru:
    You sure made your point.
    You aren’t a stalker who posts whenever I do to make yourself seem smart.
    My bad!
    Here I was wondering why you are attacking me, repeatedly on two different threads.
    It turns out it is because you *don’t* care about what I have to say.
    here I thought it was because you do. It just goes to prove that people like to post (and get into mindless arguments) when they DON’T care, not when they do.
    I’ll ‘get over’ myself.
    And the term ‘ad hominem’ means, roughly, attacking the person, not the argument.
    as in:
    “I started to read this post and thought, “Gee. I wonder when jeffislouie will post in his role as the Chief Apologist?””

    http://www.tmsdebate.org/main/forensics/glossary.htm
    “Ad hominem – attacking your opponent personally rather than her/his argument. Ad hominem is fallacious argumentation. “

    And here’s a question for you: if you don’t care about me or what I have to say, why do you keep responding to me?
    For example, I posted my opinion here and you chose to post that I play the role of ‘cheif apologist’. That’s a personal attack.
    Then you go on to completely ignore every word of what I said.
    Kudos, chief. You da man!

    “Calling you a knucklehead isn’t ad hominem.”
    But you didn’t call me a knucklehead. You called me the ‘Chief Apologist’. Then ignored what I had to say. Hence, ad hominem. You attacked the man in such a way as to raise questions about the validity of what I said.
    Try to follow me here (I know it’s difficult)-
    I made a point.
    Instead of refuting my point or providing a counterpoint, you attempted to diminish my point by attempting to diminish the perception of who and what others think I am.
    Classic ad hominem.
    Do I need to continue to argue with you or can you try to get on with your life?

    “I posted in response to your blather because you’re full of it.”
    Ah yes. You sure did that. You responded to my ‘blather’ and made your point.
    Here is your post, for all to see (in case they missed your pointless and admittedly unnecessary post):


    @jeffislouie

    I started to read this post and thought, “Gee. I wonder when jeffislouie will post in his role as the Chief Apologist?”

    Lo and behold there you are. You’re nothing if not consistent.”

    Well, you certainly won that little debate!
    Your response clearly countered mine.
    And without *any* ad hominem.
    You utilized your skills to counter each point I made and argued each one with a level of skill clearly superior to mine, all while staying on topic and utilizing well developed debating skills.
    Hooray for you!
    Face it – you didn’t like it when I objected to calling a ceo at 5 in the morning and just couldn’t help but transfer that silly dispute over here.
    I wish there was a way to ignore posts from a certain user, but until that functionality is added, I’ll just ignore you as best I can.

  45. jeffislouie says:

    and for the record, here’s ASAPs version:
    http://consumerist.com/consumer/followups/asap-van-lines-r

    In it, we see a different consumer than Candace let on:
    Including such gems as:
    “She was given a quote in weight (lbs) through the moving software based on her items list. She had a few extra items we picked up. Her weight was over the original estimate. We called both her and her niece to confirm the balance and delivery information. She did not call back but her niece responded via phone. Agreed to her balance and said to send her shipment as we had a truck leaving that day and she was already in colorado. She apparently talked to her aunt before the aunt called us. she was very mad, yelled, told us she was refuting her card and to keep the items. I offered her a reweigh upon delivery to see the accuracy and we have weight scale tickets. We can easily fax or mail copies and she can have a reweight. The last word she gave me was that we should keep the items and she would be doing a chargeback. I asked her if she could send me something over saying that she was relinquishing items because I didnt want to be accused of theft “

    “Monday I came to work to find an email linking me to your site and also some harassing emails. I went to the site and found a completely different version of events.
    tiffany: We do not and will not work by cubic feet. Also she said she was awaiting a response but her last word to us was to keep the items and she was charging her car back. Then she accuses me of making up my name and I still dont see why if I was or was not hispanic would matter in terms of her move.
    tiffany: So i called her and asked her what she wanted to do, again offered a reweigh, she called me a liar said I wasnt who I said, she was recording everything which I said was fine as I wasnt hiding anything.
    tiffany: We readily agree to a reweigh and she has copies of her paperwork
    tiffany: all the things she sign have carbon copies for the customer
    tiffany: all bill of ladings talk about weight, reweighs, etc
    benpopken: Did you ever leave a screaming message?
    tiffany: no I did not
    tiffany: what i said was
    tiffany: very specific
    benpopken: Did Aaron ever call her and say the scales were broken and you would now work by cubic feet?
    tiffany: From what I was told by Aaron, the only thing mentioned about CF was that we dont work by it, plus he was not trained and does not know about CF, he only knows lbs based on our moving system
    tiffany: Plus
    tiffany: I am the office manager and I was the one that confirmed with her the job closing giving her the weight
    tiffany: The sales rep does not close the job or give the final balance
    benpopken: Did the driver assert that they would have to pay $400 more for the cubic feet?
    tiffany: no
    tiffany: The driver only told her the balance which I had told her and when he would deliver
    tiffany: No one will ever work by cubic feet plus her weight which was 2300 is not even 400cf”

    “She sent us an email saying either we delivery her with no extra charges, and she had $150 in packing which she signed for and she only wants to pay her weight. Or she continues her chargeback and abandons the items

    “They will also verify my name
    tiffany: Because as silly as it may be
    tiffany: It is my birth name and to be told I am a poser and lying, is very unfair
    tiffany: The only reason I will not give her my last name is I don’t feel safe for my personal privacy
    tiffany: Considering the emails I have received

    How NOT to get a fair deal:
    -scream at the person on the other end of the phone.
    -call them a liar
    -threaten to stop payment
    - make up a story about cubic feet

    Two sides to every story, folks.
    According to ASASP, they offered a reweigh and seemed to handle an irate customer as professionally as possible.

  46. coloradogem says:

    Two sides two a story; so here. Just in case you forgot about the other side of the story posted here on the consumerist (btw: ASAP is in Illinois not Colorado):

    Watch Out For Scammy Movers

    Using freight shipping can be a great way to move stuff for cheap, but scams abound, as this letter from the mother of longtime reader Crayonshinobi shows.

    ASAP Vanlines did a whole buncha switcharoos on Crayonshinobi’s mom, the worst of which was tacking on $400 more. The agreement had been for cost based on weight, but after the shipment left, said “the scales were broken” and were now going to charge by cubic foot. When the family refused shipment at the other end, the company left a series of screaming and scathing messages.

    Crayonshinobi’s mom is filing a chargeback and is even going to cancel the credit card she paid with because she’s worried about this company messing with your account even after all is (seemingly) said and done. Her tale, inside…


    ——————————————————————————–

    Crayonshinobi’s mom writes:

    It started with a simple quote for a dining room set. Hutch, table, six chairs. Move from Illinois to Colorado. First quote was 100.00 lower than 2nd quote, which I did accept (thinking gas prices had gone up). In our discussion and written quote, the weight we were billed for was 1800 #s. Less than a truckload (LTL). Aaron explained that his computer could calculate the dining room set and he agreed we would definitely not meet(exceed) the 1800 pounds. I then asked if we could put the table saw on and he stated yes, it shouldn’t be a problem. I know for a fact the saw weighs in at 140 pounds.

    They arrived at the house on Monday, began packing the hutch and at that point we were told $140.00 for packing material. I called the office speaking with Aaron who assured me he would do something. They took 35.00 off.

    Next the driver tells us that we have to pay almost 400.00 dollars more for the cubic feet we are taking up. Once again, I call Aaron and state to him that we are not paying for cubic feet, we are paying for weight. He states he will get back to me after talking to the owner. He leaves me a voice mail and said that the “scales were broken” and that it is correct to charge by the cubic feet.

    I call him back and leave a voice mail stating it is not acceptable and I will not pay for cubic feet. Never heard back from him again. Tried emailing and no response.

    Tuesday (the next day) the truck is in Colorado!!! I receive a phone call from my niece who states she heard from the trucker and he wants to deliver immediately. I was shocked -as they had just left the day before. They must have drove all night. I immediately call the office and get voice mail. I left a message that there is a discrepency with the billing and that until this is cleared up we will not accept delivery. I also wrote an email with the same information to Aaron.

    Aaron calls me and states that I should personally speak with the owner…named Dorri. I call Dorri and a Tiffany answers the phone and states that “he is not available and could she help me”. I then explain to her that the agreed upon amount of $1200.00 has turned into 1600.00 and I asked why. She states that we are paying for 2100#’s. My reply was “WHAT COULD WEIGH A TON?”” “YOU ARE TELLING ME A DINING ROOM SET WEIGHS A TON??” She immediately goes into a rampage about how they did nothing wrong and that is exactly what it weighs.
    I related to her the exact words from her salesperson Aaron and how it was determined that we would not be even close to their minimum. She didn’t care and that is that. She then states that my daughter (she is referring to my niece) has accepted shipment.

    I told Tiffany, no she didn’t and no she won’t. That really angered her and she started yelling at me and I hung up. I called my niece and warned her NOT to accept shipment. She had 2 phone calls from this Tiffany and she left a SCREAMING message at one point for my niece to call her immediately. My niece did not call her and at 5pm Tiffany called her again and yelled at her that she MUST take shipment and pay the money. My niece declined and stated that she must take this up with me since I am the person who contracted and there is a dispute. Tiffany hung up on my niece.

    I refuse to pay the additional charges and frankly, they can have the dining room set. I have called my credit card company and put a dispute on the card as well. I will also cancel the credit card after reading the horror stories about this company.

    The dining room set was really not worth the 1200.00 to move and certainly not 1600.00 they are charging. We did for sentimental reasons and honestly this is now an issue of ethics and I fully intend not to give in. They can have the set and the table saw (it wasn’t a good one anyway).

    Should be interesting to see what their next move will be.

  47. jeffislouie says:

    That sure is the customers story.
    And the company has a different series of events.
    As you can see from the story, the customer told them they can have the set and table saw and they were letting it go.
    But that’s not what happened, as it appears that the customer is apparently working with an attorney? THAT doesn’t sound like something the person in the original story intended to do, now does it? All of a sudden, its gone from ‘just keep it’ to ‘Because of the on going investigation I am not able to discuss more than this information.’

    mmmhmmm. Sounds like ASAP offered *again* to rectify the situation and our consumerist reader here is trying to prosecute a good faith deal gone sour.

    Two sides. Sometimes the truth is in the middle.
    On the one hand, you have a consumer (as I already posted, consumers lie all the time and often exaggerate events to get what they want. They also almost always try to paint themselves as saints, which is what the original post sounded like to me) and on the other, you have the business – who has the most to lose (piss off a customer and they’ll tell 10 people – or in this case, the entire interwebs), trying to explain that they did what they could and tried to rectify the situation but had to face an irate and unreasonable customer.
    Choose to believe whomever you want, but I doubt that either side is being comletely forthright.

  48. MommaShenobi says:

    jeffislouie – you are certainly entitled to your opinion. Obviously as a person in customer service I am sure you have seen it all.

    I’m also sure that you have never ever been cheated, lied to or all the above. I wish you continued good luck in your life and hope you aren’t a victim in a scam situation. You can enjoy life from your myopic viewpoint and indeed
    a true credit to your profession.

  49. Uriel says:

    @jeffislouie:

    Thats not much of an argument there jeff, seeing as Candace WAS vindicated, since it turned out that she was correct, and ASAP was overcharging her, and guilty of their OBVIOUSLY SHADY(and fairly common) PRACTICES. If you’re saying that they NOW want to correct their fraudulent treatment of Candace, since their dirty laundry has been aired, then you’d probably be correct. Other than that, once someone has been caught in a lie, and no, I dont think they billed her for for an extra 1120 lb by accident, Old “Tiff the spinster”‘s credibility pretty much went out the window. I think you need to go back and read both sides of the story yourself bud, and this time look at the end result(re-weigh) as well.

  50. chrisgoh says:

    MommaShenobi’s continued insults of anyone who questions her story (as they did in the other threads) still leave me questioning the actual validity of her story. It is pretty clear at this point that she was wrongfully overcharged, but it still seems like at the very least she is selectively presenting facts such as to cast herself in the most favorable possible light. Note that they STILL have not provided the screaming voice mail message. That would be a positive confirmation of a lie.

  51. jeffislouie says:

    @MommaShenobi:
    “jeffislouie – you are certainly entitled to your opinion. Obviously as a person in customer service I am sure you have seen it all. “

    technically, I’m in sales. But i deal with customers on a day to day basis. While I haven’t seen it all, I have seen enough to know when something smells fishy.
    No offense, but the first time I read what you had to say, my bullshit detector went off big time. I’ve been screamed at, harrassed, and almost punched in the face too many times, only to have the customer lie to others about how I did the screaming, harrassing, and almost punched them to simply buy your story.

    “I’m also sure that you have never ever been cheated, lied to or all the above. “

    Oh no, I have. But I ALWAYS managed to resolve the issue without presenting myself as a saint. I’ve come out and admitted it when I had handled things innapropriately, lost my cool, etc.

    “I wish you continued good luck in your life and hope you aren’t a victim in a scam situation.”

    Thanks. You too. But is this a scam? It seems to have been resolved, with the shipper offering to charge you a fair price. They claim to have offered to resolve this amicably, only to be met with shouting, accusations and nasty emails.

    “You can enjoy life from your myopic viewpoint “

    myopic: short: lacking foresight or scope; “a short view of the problem”; “shortsighted policies”; “shortsighted critics derided the plan”; “myopic thinking”

    hmmmm. Interesting. Why would anyone think YOU were anything but perfectly polite and courteous to ASAP’s representatives?

    “and indeed a true credit to your profession. “

    That’s clever.
    You don’t even know what my profession is.
    It’s sales.
    Used to be a bartender. People would follow me from place to place because of the great service I gave them.
    Before that, I ran multi-million dollar restaurants, turning a few around from near bankruptcy.
    Wait a minute – I didn’t submit a request for help to a website – YOU DID. Why am I on trial here?
    And how am I not a credit to customer service? I made the following points:
    -if you have an issue, be nice
    -give the other person an opportunity to rectify the situation
    -don’t exaggerate
    -don’t try to pass yourself off as an innocent little doe eyed angel who would never do anything rude
    Guess that makes me evil. and bad at my job.
    All i’ve ever said was that this could have been handled better.
    Sorry that makes you mad.
    Because it’s pretty clear that you are perfect and never lose your temper or insult anyone for any reason.
    Best of luck resolving this.

  52. jeffislouie says:

    @nerodiavolo:
    what the hell are you talking about?
    Candace WAS vindicated. My guess is that had she been a little nicer, she would have been vindicated a long time ago and without so much drama.
    Yes. They overcharged her.
    It is entirely possible that this was an honest mistake.

    ” If you’re saying that they NOW want to correct their fraudulent treatment of Candace, since their dirty laundry has been aired, then you’d probably be correct.”

    That’s not what I’m saying.
    I’m saying they wanted to correct the problem but Candace wouldn’t let them. Instead, she yelled at them, hung up on them, sent them nasty emails, told them to keep her stuff, then changed her mind. They wanted to set up a reweigh right away, Candace fought them.
    Now that the reweigh has happened (did you notice that ASAP didn’t object at all?), she wants to file charges against them.
    Guess that whole “just keep it” stuff was an example of Candace ‘joking’, right?
    “I dont think they billed her for for an extra 1120 lb by accident”

    That wasn’t what happened. Go back and read what happened. it turned out they overcharged her, but not by that much. the estimate candace agreed to was to pay for 1800 pounds. After getting more stuff than they estimated for, they said she should pay for 2100 pounds. They overcharged her 400 pounds. It turns out they were both wrong. It was likely a mistake. Either way, they wanted to correct it and Candace was too pissed off to deal.

    “Old “Tiff the spinster”‘s credibility pretty much went out the window.”

    Who is that?
    Oh. Right. When people get judged around here, we call them names.
    Cool.
    Tiff is a spinster.

    “I think you need to go back and read both sides of the story yourself bud, and this time look at the end result(re-weigh) as well. “

    Done and done.
    I still smell bullshit.

  53. jeffislouie says:

    @chrisgoh:
    DING DING DING
    At least a few people get it.
    Fact: it turns out, she was overcharged
    other than that, we don’t know squat.
    leave it to some consumerist members to make up their mind after only hearing one side of the story.
    thanks Chris – I thought I might have taken crazy pills this morning.

  54. chrisgoh says:

    No problem.

    Of course maybe we take the same crazy pills…

    Seriously though, I’m a big fan of consumer activism, but there is a line that a lot of people cross between being a consumer activist and a consumer terrorist. I’m not saying MommaShenobi went to that level, but I’m willing to bet a request for a reweigh would have been honored if presented properly.

    Hypothetically, if ASAP knew they were scamming her, do you think they would have publicly come to this site and offer to do the reweigh and share the results?

    Sure somebody screwed up, but don’t chalk up to conspiracy what could be explained by incompetence.

  55. MommaShenobi says:

    I just can’t bring myself to reply to these 2 posters. Just too sad. Enough said.

  56. chrisgoh says:

    But you could bring yourself to post another insult? Again thanks for CONTINUING to reinforce the point that you just don’t seem to get.

  57. MommaShenobi says:

    No
    and
    No

  58. chrisgoh says:

    It is a pity that you can’t fathom that some people might disagree with you. Like I said in one of the other threads, you are hardly objective when it comes to this situation. Your refusal to have a mature discussion regarding this difference of opinion is what continues to have me believe that you are not being 100% forthright regarding what happened. If you would discuss the issue rather than providing responses such as you have above, perhaps you could convince the skeptics of your point.

  59. MommaShenobi says:

    Sorry, I don’t understand your comments.

  60. chrisgoh says:

    Don’t know how to make it much clearer, but I’ll try to help you out.

    In each of the threads on this topic, whenever someone has disagreed with you based on their opinion of the facts presented, you resort to an insult rather than actually addressing the concern. To me, this give you a lack of credibility.

    I agree that you were ripped off based on the facts provided. Very little actual evidence has be presented to the readers here, so each of our judgments (which I agree could vary widely) is based on little actual facts, leading us to have to rely on what is said by each of the parties. Your story paints yourself as an angel while painting Tiffany as being extremely rude. You’ve never provided the message of her being rude and she seemed polite here, whereas you have not. Therefore, this leads me to the conclusion (correct or not) that if you are not being very polite to the people here who are questioning your story, why should we believe that you were not rude to Tiffany or for that matter why should we believe your claims that Tiffany was rude.

    In conclusion, all I think we’ve been saying is that this possibly could have been resolved easily with a little calm discussion between the two parties.

  61. MommaShenobi says:

    Sorry, still cannot understand your comments nor your reasoning.

  62. chrisgoh says:

    Well, can’t make it any clear, sorry you are having trouble understanding clearly written comments, perhaps someone would be willing to help you out.

  63. chrisgoh says:

    Since you are having trouble understanding these comments, perhaps Tiffany was also trying to help you resolve this situation and you were just not able to understand that either.

  64. MommaShenobi says:

    Sorry, still cannot understand your reasoning nor your comments.

  65. EnderVR46 says:

    Haha, wow. I was on the fence as to who to believe, but the moving company was at fault.

    Sadly, reading the way the consumer responds to commentators here, I can see how Tiffany and anyone else at the moving company could have problems. If the consumer was half as rude to the company as they are to folks here, I’m not sure I can blame them.

    Not for trying to rip them off (or making a simple mistake), but for being on the defense and possibly rude.

    Reading the consumers original posts and subsequent comments are maddening. They sound like the type of consumer that a more reputable company would decline to do business with.

    That is, if they behaved in the same manner to the company, of which I have no reason to think differently.

  66. jeffislouie says:

    It looks like mommashenobi has gone and blown her cover.
    Allow me to lay it out for you, momma – you know, in a way even a stubborn child couldn’t possibly claim not to understand…
    You gave the consumerist a story about how ASAP was rude and mean to you. In that story, you painted yourself as an angel – that is to say you portrayed your actions as calm, reasoned, relaxed, and courteous.
    You also painted ASAP as a bunch of lunatics who were rude without provocation (mean to you for no good reason).
    Anytime any person has questioned or challenged your story, you have responded with name calling or by insulting them in some way.
    this makes your version of the story difficult to believe.
    After all, YOU brought this to the consumerist. Why YOU can’t accept that people might question your story is odd. Why YOU can’t accept it and then ignore it is also a little weird. Why you are quick to make snide comments about them, their opinions, and/or make the claim that they are speaking in tongues proves one thing and one thing only: you have the capability and inclination to be rude when anyone challenges you, no matter how gently or how forcefully they do so. Because of this obvious character trait, some of us either question your innocence or simply cannot believe you.
    If you are willing to blast into people on a website that have no effect on the outcome of your story, why should anyone believe that you were anything but hostile towards ASAP from the moment you thought something was wrong with your bill?
    Why would anyone who took the time to read your version and ASAP’s response believe that you were polite and innocent?
    It’s clear to me that you are an abrasive person by nature. Someone with a little perspective might be okay with simply ignoring people’s criticism. There is simply no reason to insult people here and your responses show your personality might have been the very reason that this ordeal wasn’t resolved within a few easy calls.
    It wouldn’t surprise me one bit to find out that you did, in fact, create this issue unnecessarily. It is clear that a mistake was made and that your were overcharged. Did this have to come through this site? Of course not.
    The only reason this became such a difficult situation was likely due to your abrasive nature.
    You already won. You got what you wanted. So why respond with anger over what anyone else thinks? The answer? Because that is your nature.
    I’m glad you got things straightened out. Now, instead of responding with more insults towards peoples comments, try to learn a lesson from the ordeal. Next time you have a problem, try to not blow it up into a huge deal. You might just find that you get what you want without having to rope in the consumerist with your tales of innocence being taken advantage of by a business that is clear of BBB issues.
    And you might also consider NOT threatening the person who appears to have been trying to help you out from the beginning.

  67. MommaShenobi says:

    Sorry, I do not understand your comments or reasoning.

  68. chrisgoh says:

    It is like arguing with a child who answers every question with “I don’t know.” Given the previous in depth analysis she was able to provide when it suited her, I doubt reading comprehension is the problem here. It is pretty clear she is just playing games at this point. She knows she’s busted and is just doing her best to get a rise out of everyone to try and make the issue go away.

  69. MommaShenobi says:

    Sorry, I don’t understand your comments nor do I understand your reasoning. Sorry.

  70. chrisgoh says:

    Like trying to talk to an Interactive Voice Response system. Time to press 0 to reach an operator.

    :)

  71. MommaShenobi says:

    Ok

  72. MusicMom says:

    Hmm, there’s a lot of personal bickering going on here, each making the real topic go further and further out of sight. Let’s try to stay focused here.

    What’s really at issue here is a contract dispute between a customer and a moving company. What makes this a little different than the typical contract dispute between a customer and a mover is that two government agencies have seen enough flaws in the performance of the mover that they have stepped in to make sure the customer isn’t getting screwed. They don’t do this if everyting is going right.

    The typical moving scam starts like this: A customer goes online to find a mover, just like they go online ot find anything else in this day and age. A mover from anywhere in the country responds and says “Yes, we can move you, and we can promise you this, this, and this, for this price. Just fill out this inventory sheet and you’re signed up.”. This is the first problem.

    The reason so many professional moving companies spend money and man-hours training professional estimators is because it takes a good eye to look at a piece of furniture, estimate how much space it takes up, then convert that volume into an estimated weight. These professional esimators travel to their potential customers’ houses to look at everything to be moved, get an estimated volume, then convert that volume into weight. In this customer’s case, ASAP Van Lines asked their untrained, unprofessional customer to do this job for herself. The customer filled out the sheet to the best of her knowledge, but as hard as an unprofessional tries, it rarely is right. This is the fault of the mover for putting this responsibility on the customer.

    So it is no surprise that when the mover shows up, the estimated weight may be off from the actual weight. The mover may now blame the customer for giving them a wrong inventory, which is all they need to do to justify charging more.

    cont’d…

  73. MusicMom says:

    Once the shipment has been loaded onto the truck and the customer has been told their price has gone up because the customer did a crappy job estimating, so “boo-hoo” to them, the custoemr is predictably unhappy. Many yell, some threaten, some cry, all understandable reactions by someone who has just realized a major promise to them has been broken, and it’s going to cost them thousands of dollars more.

    Interstate shipments such as Shenobi’s must be verified with Certified Weight Tickets (and we all know there’s been plenty of discussion of these, so I won’t elaborate). If the customer is not provided with these tickets by the time the shipment is delivered, the mover is in violation of Federal Law. End of story.

    In Shenobi’s move, she had the guts to turn away the shipment in order for the movers to prove how much her load actually weighed, and therefore how much she actually owed. The two states where ASAP claims the shipment was originally weighed have gotten invovled to make sure THEY haven’t been complicit in the possible fleecing of a customer. Illinois is involved because this is where the mover is located. Colorado is involved because that’s where the move ended. Again, government agencies like these will get involved to protect the consumer. If the weight turns out to be correct, the customer loses the argument and has to pay.

    We’ve read how ASAP keeps changing the weight of the shipment. If they had a true reading of the weight right there in their files, the number would stay constant.

    cont’d…

  74. MusicMom says:

    Regarding Tiffany’s response with Ben from this website:

    I believe that Young Shenobi probably did yell at her, and I don’t blame her one bit. Tiffany did do the right thing in requesting the conversation be over if a calm tone couldn’t be kept. That’s as far as I go in being on T’s side.

    As T goes through the problems with the price increase, she stipulates that they only base the price on weight, but she is describing “extra items” by number as the cause for the price increase. This could be something as simple as Candace calling something One Stereo, and Tiffany calling the same stereo On CD Player, One Tuner, One Tape Deck, Two Speakers, etc. The weight of the item has not changed. In the same paragraph, her comparing an IKEA table to a solid wood table is exactly the problem I outlined above in which a trained estimator would have gotten the table’s dimensions and weight correct, but Candace got it wrong because she marked it as One Table, with no room on ASAP’s inventory sheet for adjusting.

    cont’d…

  75. jeffislouie says:

    mommashenobi – you act like a child and expect anyone to respect you? You insult people who question your story? You display your unreasonable disposition and think people still want to take you seriously? Wow.
    Let me do it for you:

    Sorry – I don’t understand your comments or your reasoning. sorry.

    I should have written that in when you first begged the consumerist to help you.

  76. jeffislouie says:

    @MusicMom:
    hey music mom?
    The issue here is that the customer was overcharged.
    Those of us who are discussing it all readily admit and acknowledge that fact.
    But we also believe that this could have been resolved faster and more amicably if mommashinobi hadn’t been abusive and unreasonable to deal with.
    I’ve had similar problems in the past, and I’ve never had to have the consumerist get involved, nor have I needed to involve state agencies.
    Matter of fact, I’ve resolved the issues by discussing them calmly. The worst I’ve ever had to do was THREATEN to contact state agencies.
    Things get done faster if you start by being reasonable and nice.
    Which is the point.
    Yes, ASAP was wrong. But according to them, they tried to work it out with mommashinobi with no luck. Mommashinobi told them to just keep the stuff, then reneged, and is currently trying to not only recover the stuff she gave up, but making a federal case over it (sort of).
    Absolutely a trained estimator would have helped, but I still don’t think ASAP was out to get mommashinobi.
    I think this is more likely the result of a few mistakes followed by a screaming customer confusing the issue and creating more problems.

  77. chrisgoh says:

    @MusicMom: “Hmm, there’s a lot of personal bickering going on here, each making the real topic go further and further out of sight. Let’s try to stay focused here.”

    Every time we try to discuss the real topic, MommaShenobi either insults the person that disagrees with her or provides the response that she can’t understand the comment. Does this sound like a reasonable person to you?

  78. MusicMom says:

    I have the feeling that the upcoming re-weigh will show the weight to be possibly higher than estimated, but not as high as ASAP tried to charge Candace for. Whatever happens, the truth is what’s important. I do think ASAP is going along with this because they really don’t have another choice, not because they are a legit company.

    Now, as a volunteer on MmovingScam.com, the site with the Blacklist you note ASAP is not on, I have to point out that there are many companies with many complaints that have not yet met the strict requirements to be on the Blacklist. ASAP is one of these. Just because a mover is not Listed does not make them OK to use. I would highly recommend against using this company, partly because of issues like these, but mostly because there are hundreds of movers out there that do NOT have complaints like these and are more deserving of a customer’s business.

    There are complaints about ASAP on other consumer websites, and articles in which ASAP is named as causing problems for customers. They may not have as many complaints as other movers, but they are there. The FMCSA’s website http://www.protectyourmove.gov which has the best information for a potential customer, shows ASAP’s 8 complaints filed in 2007 so far as ranging the categories: Shipping Documents, 2 problems – Estimating/Final Charges, 1 problem – Weighing, 4 problems – Hostage Loads (refusing to deliver until a larger amount is paid in full), 2 problems – Pickup & Delivery, 2 problems – Loss and Damage, 6 problems – Other Commercial Complaints, 3 problems. Considering the low ratio of people who’ve had problems to people who actually file the complaints, consider these numbers to truly be much higher.

  79. MusicMom says:

    I’m not condoning Shenobi’s comments to ASAP or to anyone on this site. If she insulted you, that’s between you and her, don’t drag me into it and don’t tell me I’m wrong for ignoring those comments. Grow a thicker skin if you’re going to converse with people who are very upset and may lash out at whomever is percived at not being on their side.

    Speaking as a scam victim, Jeff, there is no such thing as calmly talking through a contract dispute with a company in any industry who has been out to defraud from the getgo. Know the phrase “Got you by the short & curlies”? Makes you yell. I’ll admit I did the same thing for my move, and you know what? It worked.

  80. jeffislouie says:

    @MusicMom:
    And you are assuming that the company is out to scam from the get go!
    :-)

    Listen, I hear you. I understand what you are saying.
    All I am and have been saying is that had things been handled a little more calmly, they may have been taken care of faster and with little or no drama. For instance, according to ASAP, THEY offered the reweigh and were met with shouting, threats, nasty emails, racial slurs and ultimately a ‘just keep it’ response.
    I think the bigger issue here, which few are willing to even consider, is that some people face things like this by assuming that the company is out to scam instead of operating from the assumption that the company is out to do business legitimately. If you start by assuming that ASAP was out to scam, you are certainly behaving reasonably (i guess) when you yell. However, i would wager that ASAP is a reputable company.
    Why?
    For one, they are in good standing with the BBB.
    They were also chosen as “best mover” and “best company” by the New Times readers poll – this usually isn’t a mistake and although it isn’t terribly prestigious, it is a readers choice awards meaning more poeple had good things than bad to say.
    So I hear you about being scammed, but I also don’t think that a company like ASAP would try to intentionally scam someone over. If you go back and read what Tiffany had to say, you see something that makes sense – she tried to talk to mommashinobi and resolve the issue, only to be screamed at and interrupted. Everytime she tried to suggest a reweigh, she was shot down. If you read mommashinobi’s original post, she works awfully hard to portray herself as having been polite and courteous – a proverbial lamb to a slaughter.
    And I didn’t bring up the insults to prove anything, save that she is capable of reacting rudely to anyone who might challenge her in anyway. If she is willing to insult people and then behave like a child (see her famous ‘sorry. I don’t understand your comments or your reasoning’ posts) on a message board, is it really so hard to believe that she may have made the situation worse by doing likewise when interacting with Tiffany from ASAP?
    I know you hear what I’m saying, because you advised me to:

    “Grow a thicker skin”

    That advice is excellent and should be heeded, especially by those who come here to air their grievances and try to get help from the consumerist, don’t you think?
    I’m not insulted by mommashinobi’s insults either – I don’t really care if she thinks I am a credit to my profession or not. But they are indicitive of the type of person she is, don’t you think?
    To your credit, the advice you give has been excellent – always have a final estimate done on site, before the move starts.
    :-)

  81. MusicMom says:

    Can you give me the link to that NY Times poll? I’m not seeing it in Google searches.

    As long as a dues-paying company responds to a complaints, the BBB keeps them in their flock. I can point out one moving company that is, as of today, up to 553 complaints, 225 of which are from the past 12 months alone, and this company never even touches the goods. BBB is only one measurement.

    I would not call ASAP a scammer in the typical sense, but as I said before, why use them with a tainted reputation when there are so many other companies with untainted reputations that you could use? Plenty of them in Illinois alone.

    I see on one section of this drama that the final weight, after the agency stepped in, was less than a thousand dollars, instead of the 2100 that ASAP tried to charge from the get-go. That’s a HUGE difference, and the professional driver should have raised his eyebrows in surpise at the higher number.

    I don’t think you’re ever going to get the screaming voicemail delivered to your doorstep, but that’s really a small issue in the grand scheme of things in this case. You keep going back to it like it’s an excuse for everything that happened before and after. Why do you think this?

  82. MusicMom says:

    Oops, hit Send too soon.

    When you say “I also don’t think that a company like ASAP would try to intentionally scam someone over”, what knowledge do you have of the company that would make you say this? Do you know the moving industry? Do you know this company in particular?

  83. chrisgoh says:

    For me, the lack of the screaming voice mail (which could easily be provided to Ben if it actually existed) and the responses that were provided above leave the Shenobi’s with a credibility issue in my book. If produced, it would show Tiffany was lying in her comments to Ben, so would shift the credibility problem to Tiffany. I agree, the message itself is a small thing, but since one of them is lying over that issue, I would think that the same person is probably lying over the bigger issues involved in this case.

  84. jeffislouie says:

    @MusicMom:
    “When you say “I also don’t think that a company like ASAP would try to intentionally scam someone over”, what knowledge do you have of the company that would make you say this?”

    Well, for one, ASAP has a decent rep. I live in Chicago, and have friends that have used them. They aren’t the cheapest, but I haven’t heard any complaints about them. I know, it’s circumstantial (financeguru is chomping at the bit to tell you that), but it counts to me. I have at least 3 friends who have used them and recommend them (I moved less than a year ago and asked my friends who they used).

    ‘Do you know the moving industry? ‘

    Only as a consumer.

    ‘Do you know this company in particular?’

    Only through friends that have used them in the past. No reported problems. For the record, they did quote me on my last move and they were the most expensive of the three companies I called for a quote.

    “Can you give me the link to that NY Times poll?”

    Not NY times, new times.
    And I don’t have a link. Sorry.

    BUT here is a link to the bbb report:
    [www.chicago.bbb.org]

  85. You guys are all losers for arguing about this several days after the story has been posted and done with.

    I’ll save you guys the trouble and remove the hearsay and bullshit from all of the arguments:

    Consumer was right.
    ASAP thought they were right, they turned out to be wrong.

    Who loses overall? ASAP. Were they gracious losers? No. The credibility of a particular consumer is not the main point, particularly after the consumer turned out to be right. If MamaShinobi had said that Santa molests small children it has no bearing to me because overall she was right on her main point: ASAP was overcharging her.

    ASAP needs to make restitution and be done with it, and you all need to move on with your lives.

  86. chrisgoh says:

    I’d like to thank MusicMom for actually having a mature discussion about this.

  87. MusicMom says:

    Oops, I mistakenly thought this screaming voicemail in question was left by Candace to Tiffany. Sorry.

  88. MusicMom says:

    Jeff,

    Any industry profesional, ASAP included, will tell you that local moves usually go well, it’s the long distance ones that have more problems. It’s apples and oranges.

    Remember when I listed ASAP’s complaints at the FMCSA? These were all for interstate moves. Especially note the two complaints for Hostage Loads.

    And I must say, it’s been a long time since anyone’s called my conversations Mature. Feels strange.

  89. chrisgoh says:

    @MusicMom: “And I must say, it’s been a long time since anyone’s called my conversations Mature. Feels strange.”

    Its all relative (although you did call me childish after I posted how mature the discussion was :) ). Compared to some of the other posts, you make your point in an intelligent manner, I may disagree, but then life would be boring if everyone always agreed.

  90. jeffislouie says:

    @something_amazing:
    “You guys are all losers for arguing about this several days after the story has been posted and done with. “

    Sweet!
    I was wondering how long it would take for someone to interject their own brand of childish horse poop into the mix.
    Nothing says ‘winner’ like calling other people losers for having an adult conversation.
    Awesome!
    Thanks for settling our discussion.
    No one – not any of us – argued that ASAP was right. They overcharged the customer.
    The discussion is over how the customer handled it.
    Me, and chris, both think that it is entirely possible that mommashinobi made the situation worse by behaving rudely, shouting, cussing, and sending out nasty emails.
    For me, it boils down to my belief that this could have been handled better by the customer. I think that things could have been settled in a few hours, if not days, and without the help of the consumerist.
    But that’s just the loser in me talking….

  91. blythe79 says:

    I have read this thread, and the others, and have looked into the movingscam website. I am a latecomer to this argument but I figure, Im a consumer with an opinion so here i go.

    First off, we all seem ASAP was in the wrong about the weight but I dont see ASAP disputing that. I agree with jeffislouie and chrisgosh, its the customer service issue.

    mommashenobi seems abrasive and hostile and doesn’t seem willing at all to allow for error or end the matter. she seems to want to kleep it going even though the compnay has seemed to work with her.

    musicmom…well i have read her comments on the movingscam and i don’t understand why her first reply isnt to get both sides of the story or to even attempt to encourage the customer to work with any moving company. it is always

    “Sorry this happened to you. Please file your complaint (see top right corner of this page), then elect to have it forwarded to the DOT.”

    why can’t people have a good experience with a company that someone has had a bad one with? I use cinuglar for my cellphone and love it and I have people with terrible experiences, does that make cingular a compnay people shouldn’t use?

    Have you ever yourself contacted a company to hear both sides to a story? ASAP or any other? Because it seems you imply no matter hopw rude a customer may be, they have the right to abuse the industry and then can accuse whoever they want of bad behavior? If you care about justice, get both sides.

    This thread was about bad service as well as fraud. So mommashenobi’s attitude here is relevant and not to be ignored with thick skin.

    BOTTOM LINE
    It seems that the ASAP weight given was wrong but why hasn’t anyone asked the company to elaborate? If they were ready to work with CWM then obviously they didn’t think they had something to hide.

    There are 2 sides to every story and it seems both mommashenobi and musicmom only want to hear or believe one side. I see that when they are told of a positive experience, not just with ASAP but on the movingscam site of any random company, musicmom says it is a lie.

    Instead of resolving this issue, the customer wants to keep going. Because remember, computers nor people ever make a mistake aparently….

    If Tiffany was under the impression the weight was the weight on the ticket, how can she be trying to scam someone?

  92. MusicMom says:

    I’m sorry you didn’t read enough of the posts on MovingScam to REALLY get an idea of how I work, because you’re way off. But I’m not going to make this thread about me, and if you’d like to talk more, you can contact me there.

    Yes, this thread was about bad service as well as fraud. Shenobi’s attitude seems very understandable, and not an issue to be held against her. If your beloved Cingular sent you a bill for $1000 without a list of calls to prove why your bill is that much, would you be able to calmly talk to them while trying to resolve the issue, or would frustration creep into your voice if you didn’t believe their responses?

    A professional driver, just like a professional estimator, has a lot of experience in looking at the size of a load and later seeing the actual weight of it. With this experience, the average professional moving company driver is very good at looking at the size of a load and making an educated guess as to how much it weighed. This is why sometimes a driver will show up at a customer’s house, see what appears to be more than originally estimated, and if it’s a signifigant difference, will “protest the load”. This requires a re-estimate and a signature from both the mover and the cusotmer before the shipment can be loaded (how reputable movers do it).

    The ASAP driver should have seen the weight on the ticket and realized right away it couldn’t be accurate at over 2000 pounds, it just wan’t that big of a load. But nobody will ever know that, because ASAP has yet to provide ANYONE with both of the original weight tickets as required by law, leading many to believe that there aren’t two weight tickets for this load, and the weight was just made up. If ASAP provides Shenobi, the CWM, and the Consumerist with two legitimate weight tickets that fit the timeframe and route of Shenobi’s load, then I’ll eat my words.

    In order to be legal, weight tickets need to have all 6 criteria stipulated in the Your Rights and Responsibilities When You Move book, required by federal law to be passed out by movers to their cusotmers. If even one item is missing, the tickets are no good and can’t be used to prove they belong to one customer’s load.

    I believe there is going to be more to this story, wrapping things up, so I’ll just wait for that information to come and clear things up.