I absolutely hate these kind of situations. I'm sorry, but if your religious beliefs prohibit you from doing your job, perhaps you should find another one. In my opinion, I think the employer should be allowed to punish or terminate the employee for insubordination. I think it completely appropriate to not allow employers to hire or fire based solely on religion, but when those "beliefs" interfere with their ability to do business, it goes beyond religion. If I were trying to purchase something at such a store, and they refused to ring me up, that would be the last time I EVER did business there. How is that not a potential undue hardship for the employer? I understand reasonable accommodation, such as allowing people to wear limited religious regalia (turbines, etc), and to allow them time to pray, but to allow them to flat out refuse to do their job? I'm amazed Walgreens allows the Pharmacists to refuse to fill Birth Control. Leave your personal beliefs at the door, and do your damn job. If you don't like parts of it, find a different job. It's amazing how religion runs not only the lives of those who practice a particular one, but those around them who get others beliefs forced upon them.

So the Muslim cashiers get reassigned even though all they had to do was call over another cashier but nothing happens to the pharmacists.

Yeah, that's fair.

Another situation that happened in Minnesota is that many Muslim cab drivers refused to pick up passengers at the airport that had bought alcohol at duty free shops. The issue was so big that it came down to a lot of firing threats at the time I read the article. I'm not sure how it panned out, but it was a big deal apparently.

OK, so there are "reasonable accommodations" made as long as they don't create undue hardship for the employer or co-workers. But what about customers?

I get a little worked up when I think about how a business' accommodation of someone else's religion could affect me directly. Whether it's antiquated blue laws forbidding the sale of alcohol on the sabbath (although it's not the sabbath for everyone), a Muslim cab driver refusing to drive me from the Minneapolis airport because I have alcohol with me, or a drugstore employee refusing to sell me a legal drug that their store carries. And now I might have trouble buying some types of food? What next?

Man, I sure hope I don't get a Christian Scientist next time I got to buy some cold and flu medicine.

@bradg33:

I completely agree. Being PC and having to "accomidate" everyone can become, and already is getting out of control. If you can not do your job for any reason, that should be grounds to fire them. If you have a disability, and "forget" to tell your employee prior to being hired that you can't lift heavy packages, and your job entails that, the employer should have the right to fire you. The same goes for religion. If you fail to disclose anything that you can not, will not, or must do because of religion before being hired, then that should be grounds for dismissal. If you do disclose it, they should require a signed form stating this so neither party can change their claim afterwards.

Pork-based birth control. Yummo.

Call me crazy, but reasonable accomodations should not include employees refusing to fill prescriptions for birth control/RU486, refusing to ring up pork products, or refusing to carry passengers who are carrying alcohol.

Reasonable accomodations ARE (my company does all of these):
Providing a quiet, solemn room for Muslim prayer.
Providing facilities to cleanse the feet, etc., for prayer.
Providing an arrow pointing in the proper direction for prayer.
Ensuring non-meat products are available in the cafeteria daily.
Ensuring non-pork products are not prepared with pork products in the cafeteria.
Ensuring pre-packed sandwiches do not have cheese already made into the sandwich (it is in a seperate compartment).

None of these accomodations prevent you from doing your job, while still allowing you to maintain the customs of your religion.

@esqdork: Well in High School we called sex Porking.....LOL

But seriously none of thier jobs require them to either ingest pork or Alcohol or use birth control. So touching a wrapper that contains said products should not be offlimits. Either do your job or go work somewhere else stop whining.

An interesting point in the Muslim-don't-ring-up-pork vs Christians-don't-give-birth-control

Muslims cannot even TOUCH pork as it is almost blasphemy - yes, to even touch it!

On the other hand, Christians can touch and be in the presence of birth-control pills. (Right? I know more about Islam than I do about Christianity, even though I am neither)

In either case, as someone suggested earlier, a simple "Excuse me, let me get someone else to help you with this purchase" would dictate common sense.

A while ago, at a Subway sandwich shop, my strictly vegetarian Hindu friend (by religious belief) gently requested the server to change gloves before making his sandwich, as the server had been handling some meat before tending to him. Though the server was a *little* taken aback, he nonetheless complied without any show of defiance or such.
Easy come, easy go. Everybody happy :)

@bradg33:

It's always great to see people willing to tolerate religious garb such as turbines. Does your tolerance extend to compressors as well?

Strange coincidence (or is it Deus ex Machina?). Anyway, Daily Variety has a similar article about religion on film sets today "Beliefs Raise Special On-Set Considerations," DV, p. A4, 4/4/07). It says in its third and fourth graphs:

"According to guilds and studios, few, if any, conflicts arise over working on the Sabbath, observing religious holidays, keeping kosher and so forth. Virtually all studios allow prayer groups and other affinity gatherings, and disruptions for daily prayer are minimal..."

Of course, this does not explain Tom Cruise.

In my mind it all comes down to whether you believe that your faith is for you or for other people.

Imposing your beliefs on someone else by refusing to sell them something is the sign of someone who thinks that they are right and everyone else is wrong.

If they don't like pork or birth control then they need to work somewhere that doesn't sell those products.

I should point out that I draw a distinction between imposing your beliefs on someone and allowing them to practice their religion.

From Minneapolis: Target also allows pharmacists to refuse to fill certain prescriptions on religious grounds. Poo.

The Muslim cab drivers here were also refusing to take fares with dogs (service dogs, pets, it didn't matter), as their saliva considered "unclean". No resolution yet...

@velocipenguin: Yeah, I noticed that after I posted it. Thats what I get for quickly clicking through the spell check....

Havok, religion is not something that should be discussed in the interview process. Period. Even over a decade ago, when I was doing retail sales jobs, the discussion of Sunday availability was usually routinely couched in terms that would have allowed someone to be hired regardless of any weekly religious practices. That said, I worked with a lot of Catholics, who generally can attend Mass Saturday evening or Sunday morning, and so would have fewer conflicts than I did attending church every Sunday morning.

That said, one shouldn't put himself in a position to impose the restrictions of your beliefs on others.

@velocipenguin: Perhaps turbines are accepted as religious garb, but when I try to wear my nacelle, people oppress me.

If these religious people were truly doing God's work (in their minds) why would they even work at a place that sold these unholy items? Do these people thrive on conflict? Is this their way to force their religion down everyone else's throat? I mean when I want my pork-based birth control I want it now.

@wreckingcru: If they can't touch it, and the plastic covering of the product itself is not distance enough, may I suggest a couple layers of latex gloves (or nitrile, for those who are allergic) or perhaps some tongs? I'm pretty sure they were in no danger of their flesh touching that of the pig, so where's the problem?@ptkdude: I wish my employer would do these things. They put cheese on nearly everything, they don't segregate meat cooking surfaces from vegetarian cooking surfaces, and almost everything probably secretly has meat in it. My coworkers have found ham in their "vegetarian" soups before. It's not like I work for some podunk craphole, either, I work at a large (6000 employee) hospital. A coworker of mine keeps halal and simply doesn't eat in our cafeteria, because every item is suspect. That's no good. I can't comprehend how someone would keep kosher or vegan while trying to eat here. Oh, and let's not forget that, since it's a hospital, guests and patients eat in the cafeteria, too. I complain to Mitch (the manager of the catering services) frequently about this kind of stuff, but he can only do so much.

@number13: And that's why I avoid shopping at Target. I went a few weeks ago for the first time in years, I hope I won't ever need to go back.

wreckingcru: "I know more about Islam than I do about Christianity"

I would conclude that you haven't heard of Jesus, then, because what you "know" about Islam is incorrect. Handling, being around, touching, all but consuming pork or alcohol is fine. That said, I would understand a Muslim not wanting to be a pig farmer or a short order cook. When he or she refuses to carry a passenger with alcohol (in a taxi with a gas tank 10% filled with ethanol, i.e. drinking alcohol) or refuses to ring up a frozen pepperoni pizza packaged in plastic and a box, he or she is not trying to avoid sin, he or she is trying to impose on you.

I think the best solution to this whole thing is for everyone to take a deep breath, stop getting indignant about what other people try to do, and try to have some compassion for other view points. If a cashier finds that they cannot in all conscience sell or touch a product, they should call their manager and have him or her finish the transaction for the customer. If a customer is in such a situation, he or she should have a little common curtesy, and not make a mountain out of a mole hill. Seriously, is this dude gonna starve because he didn't get his pork ribs?

(I understand there are more serious cases, like the withholding of birth control)

I might, might, respect some of these "I'm religious so I can't sell you birth control but I decided to work at a pharmacy" if they actually followed all the 'rules' of their religion. Instead, they pick and choose which 'rules' to follow in a sad misguided attempt to impose their wacky beliefs on me and other innocent customers. You know these pharmacists who won't hand out birth control all had premarital sex and take the lord's name in vain, etc., etc., etc. If you are going to be a crazy religious nut please be consistent.

@SadSam: Don't forget that they'll still give out Viagra to unmarried men.

@SadSam: For Real!!! I can't stand that kind of crap I have a friend who won't take Birth Control becuse she's Catholic but doesen't mind having pre-marital ses with a married guy and having 2 kids out of wedlock. But it's a "sin" to take precautions so she won't get knocked up again....

@faust1200: That is EXACTLY why they're doing it. They want to try to show these prescription bearing baby-killers and heathens the TRUE light of Jesus, or something.

I'm in a heavily religious community. Anything different is met with disgust and distrust. I don't like it at all, I cannot go anywhere without being prayed at. Technically, the stores have a right not to sell you things, but it's not in their interest, so you'd assume things like denying perscriptions would be a big no-no.

@Nemesis_Enforcer: d'oh Sex not ses...lol too busy thinking to type correctly.

I agree that if you cant ethically sell pork products you shouldn't work in a store that does.

Store owners should be free to not sell pork.
Workers should only work in a store that already fits their beliefs.

The problem is when the government gets involved.
If the taxis are a concession, or the pharmacy is required by law to sell certain drugs the you have a case where the government is ordering you to act immorally.

Leave the government out and let the workers negotiate with the employers direct.

This sort of thing enrages me. If the drug is legal and I have a legal prescription for it and have gone to a public, non-denominational business to buy it, I expect to be sold it immediately. Not sent somewhere else, not made to wait while someone is found to do the job they're paid to do, not one damn thing but to be given my prescription or my pork or my cab ride. I'm sorry that people find it difficult to observe their religious beliefs in their workplaces, but I'm noticing that while they squawk about accommodation, they aren't acknowledging that when they have a service job in a non-denominational business, their job is to serve according to the needs of the business, i.e. to accommodate customers. Not the other way around.

I'm also noticing that none of these complaints seem to be coming from the Jewish community. I used to live in a majority-Jewish neighborhood, and there were kosher bakeries and delis, and Jewish bookstores, and kosher cases in chain grocery stores, and businesses closed Saturdays and open on Christian holidays, and everyone seemed to know how to get along with their own religious practices without all this whining and passive-aggressive proselytization.

I should have taken a picture of it, but while in the drive through at a Taco Bell in Torrance, CA,I saw a sign posted explaining Taco Bell would be closed on Easter Sunday.

"We will be closed, Sunday April 8th so that we may celebrate with our families the ressurection of our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ"

Clip art of a bunny and Easter egg were shown next to the text.

Sweet Jesus, here is how to win any and all conflicts in the Middle East: pork-tipped bullets.

How long would the battle in Fallujah lasted if we just carpet-bombed them with Lil' Smokies?

The cab driver issue in Minneapolis is still not settled, just sort of on hold for further discussion.

This is a philosophical question of when does your personal rights overwrite everyone else's. Not touching pork is a minor issue in my eyes and fairly easy to work around as long as the employer knows before it is an issue.

Refusing to sell emergency contraception due to religious issues is a severe issue however. Can a pharmacist refuse to sell an anti-epileptic? I don't believe they can on religious grounds, but there are religions which do not believe it is caused by a medical issue. What is the difference? Refusing either even though they are legal could severly alter someone's life even though they have the right to get the items.

What is interesting is that birth control has many uses. It has been prescribed to young women (and adults) to regulate menstrual cycles and acne. Even menopausal women will get low dose forms of it, it is just called horome replacement therapy. I find it funny that a pharmacist would automatically judge such a person holding a prescription for birth control without knowing the exact reason why they are getting it.

@Jmarsh04:
Actually, my husband saw a video where a soldier in Iraq was doing that very thing. He was dipping bullets in some pork product, then reloading them into his magazine.

@Jmarsh04: That was actually one of the factors that touched off the Indian Rebellion of 1857 -- rumors went around the Bengal Army that the new rifle cartridges issued by the British were greased with lard and beef tallow, so that both Hindus and Muslims were insulted. Of course, they were already pissed off and ready to kick some East India Company ass, but the rumors really didn't help.

It was great being the friendly, atheistic heathen-type salesperson at my retail job in a small town here in the Bible Belt - it was the customers trying to lay their wacko doctrine on me that sucked.

I guess Scientologists would be well-suited to working at GNC, right?

I never eat at Chick-Fil-A, despite their nuggets being so yummy, because they used to (not sure if they still do) put signs up in their stores explaining that their stores are closed on Sundays so they can be at church praising God, which is where all people should be on Sunday.

Now, if the owners of Chick-Fil-A are so deeply religious that they want to lose a full day of business, fine. But when you throw that crap in my face, I lose my appetite for good.

there is nothing in islam prohibiting the sales or handling of pork - you're just not supposed to EAT it.

Hi! I lived in Egypt for a while, and I never had a problem with taxi drivers or people on the street when I carried around clearly visible pork products or alcohol. They'd just laugh or sneer (depending on their personal views) and ignore it. Taxi drivers never refused my fare when I was carrying alcohol/drunk. They'd either ignore it, ask me if I had any alcohol to share, or they'd lecture me in a fatherly manner on the evils of alcohol. The people working in stores and restaurants that sold pork or alcohol were happy to have the jobs, so dealt with the proximity of the 'haram' items however they personally, internally had to (though I'm sure many were Coptic).
All (reasonable) muslims with whom I spoke told me that it was 'haram' to _consume_ pork and alcohol (and to allow dogs into the home). Nothing, ever, about handling it or being in proximity to it, unless it was a _personal_ choice. Not a religious one. Which is why pork and alcohol were freely available to anyone non-muslim or non-egyptian.
My point being: the attitude of the cashier (and the taxi drivers in Minn.) is ridiculous. If he/she refuses to handle 'haram' items, then he/she should not be working in an environment that entails handling them at some point. He/she is being extremist and push-ily judgemental in an inappropriate environment.

So I guess if a person working in the pharmacy is a Scientologist, they could refuse to dispense antidepressants or other psychotropic drugs (since Scientologists seem to believe that the whole field of psychiatry is bogus).

Speaking more generally...
I don't go to a kosher deli and request cheese on my pastrami sandwich. I don't go to evangelical Christian bookstores looking for a copy of the Koran (ok, I don't frequent Christian bookstores at all, really).

But at a place that doesn't have anything to do with religion (WalMart, Walgreen's, Target, etc.), I am the customer, dammit. I want to know about such a policy so I can take my business elsewhere. And if I'm at a store buying something that the cashier finds objectionable for whatever reason, then they'd better get a replacement cashier right up there posthaste. If I as a customer am subjected to long waits or significant inconvenience, I will stop patronizing that store. And if somebody starts proselytizing or scolding me for something I'm buying from that store, I will raise holy hell with the store manager and/or owner.

Oh, and the cab drivers who won't allow service dogs in their cabs? Effing ridiculous. I'm allergic to dogs, but I recognize that the LAW requires accommodations to be made for service dogs. If you cannot follow the LAW, then you should not be doing that kind of work.

@raybury:
You can't discuss religion, but you can ask if there is anything that would prevent them from performing the job duties that are outlined in the job description that you then hand them. And if they tell you "no", and you have them sign the description, then they have just lied to you during the interview which would then become grounds for termination.

bradg33 & acambras:

I agree that it would probably prove a good point to stop doing business that refuse to sell you something on grounds you don't support.

However, as far as the business is concerned, they have to pick their battles: is it likely that they'll lose more business from you (and others) when you get indignant about having to change lines when buying pork at a grocery store, or from (say) an entire subsection of society who might get slightly more indignant knowing that an employer fired one of their own for reasons they hold dear?

Rights conflicts are not win-win situations.

What would be the problem of having a non-Muslim ring up the pork products in an order? In Illinois, cashiers under the age of 21 are not allowed to ring up liquor purchases (beer, wine, and liquor are sold in supermakets in IL). The cashier would simply call for a "21 on Register 6" and the nearest of-age cashier would come over and scan the six-pack. Literally - that is all they had to do - drag it over the scanner. So, apply the same thing to pork products. Now, the refusing to dispense an RX because of religious beliefs, well that just is totally wrong.

@acambras:

Actually, a Christian bookstore is a very good place to pick up a copy of the Koran (even at a Southern Baptist store). I have experience inventorying these stores and they have lots of stuff that you might not think (even **Catholic** stuff).

A lot of people are claiming that all they need to do is get a non-Muslim cashier to ring up the pork, or a non-Christian to fill the prescription. That's not the point. They should do the same job everyone else is doing and leave their religious beliefs out of it. What's next? "Working for 30 consecutive minutes is against my religion so I need break every half hour?"

It poses a huge inconvenience to the customer. I'd be pretty pissed if I needed birth control and found out that my prescription wasn't ready for me to pick up because a fundamentalist Christian happened to be on duty that day, or if I had to wait 5 minutes for an available cashier to ring up my pork.

Despite my personal thoughts on religion, I'm all for reasonable accommodations. Given time to pray and all the other examples that have been mentioned. But the second your beliefs start affecting your fellow employees and customers, there's a problem. If you can't do your job because of your religion, either get a new religion or get a new job.

One more thing...I used to work at a Target, and I'm atheist. I somehow get the feeling that if I ever refused to scan a bible for a customer because it goes against my beliefs, I'd be fired. Target didn't sell a lot of religious stuff, but they sold enough that I'd come across it every now and then during the rare times I was pulled off the sales floor to help check people out when the store got busy, and I never, ever refused to scan any of it. I just bit my tongue, scanned it, and bagged it.

After my last comment I showed a mentor this post. She was my boss when I was a teen at an office supply store and a very devout muslim. She is a highly educated woman who decided to be a stay at home mother until her children hit full day school, which is when she started working for the office supply company.

She mentioned that she applied to manage at such a store because it had no religious conflict with her at all, which was once an issue when she managed a previous store. She also mentioned a large percent of muslim emplpyees locally in the Minneapolis area are refugees who have to take the first good job they can get, which I fully understand.

If you are forced into a job you haveto make concessions and so does your employer. Sometimes it is simply like calling a temp cashier, but sometimes it is harder such as scheduling breaks for prayer.

She did say one thing though which struck me. To sum up if there was a problem which she couldn't reasonably work around in the work place there are options. If you need to follow rules of a religious community then seek employment advice from that community. She being muslim had an entire list of religious organizations she could send employees to that didn't work out and could give a good recommendation (for muslims and any other religious grup you can think of). Which I think is great advice. Seek out help from those like you if you have an issue.

To quote her (she is an amazing woman):
"If your faith is so guiding in your life then you have to put in effort to keep it how you want it. A good paying job might cost more than you are willing to give up. Sometimes that means giving up something you like for somethign you want more, but that is the choice you have to make."

Sadly, she didn't want her name left on a blog so I can't directly credit her.

If you really want to witness some religious hypocrisy in action, just go eat at any restaurant that has a good-sized "after church" crowd. I've worked too many Sundays and heard too many complaints from waitresses about the tiny (or no tip at all!) left by a good portion of them. The way some of these same church-goers treat the staff is downright rude as well.

By professing to be a follower of a certain faith does not automatically make a person better or "more holy" than another.

I live in MPLS, and I have so much I want to say here, and I can't even make a post... Its just retarded. If you can't do the job you were hired for, then get out of it.

Religin, thoughts, cares, etc.. ANYTHING you can think of that would make it so you can't do your job.......... STFU and get out... I don't care!

I'm atheist, and I think its time I start pushing what I think is right and wrong on others... I'm going to run around and make fun of Jesus, the koran, what ever you believe in... I'm going to laugh and point and call you a "dumb head".

I actually had a woman sing to me in the middle of a wal-mart asking if I believe in jesus... Who the fuck are you?

It somehow brightens my heart to know that so many of us Consumerists are atheistic heathen-types. I suppose I'm not surprised--advocating for worker and customer rights is certainly a very humanitarian, equality, fair-play based concept that I've found a lot of atheists tend to endorse and practice.

If you can't do the job, then don't do it. A lot of people taking these jobs--especially things like the supermarket work, which is minimum/just above and unskilled (though hard!)--are taking them because they're the only jobs they can get. I understand and sympathize with that, but it doesn't mean you get to be a dickhead. What is more important to you: keeping a (possibly not even legit according to your holy text) belief against pork or keeping your job? Work from there.