First I will admit that this is a degrade of service. But I have to point out that on the Telco side of things what Comcast is suggesting is no different. Phone companies have not been responsible for inside wiring since the Judge Green ruling of some 20+ years ago. A phone company today is not responsible for your inside wiring unless you have an agreement for them to do so.

But lets have some fun. Looking at the last slide, if I can believe what I am seeing this was done by some contraced 'think tank' (eg http://www.academynet.org/) in concert with some Comcast higherups. Envision a room filled with charts and large posters with scribbles all over it. Then look at that last slide. What does it convey:

[] Willingness to abandon the customer to their fates.
[] An assumption that a miracle occurs that in their stupidity that the customer base does not abandon Comcast for a competitor. (That's what all those scratching head stick figures signify.)
[] That somehow Comcast in the end holds out and garners the increased revenue from the customer base. (The climb the mountain metaphor on the right.)
[] Finally it means that the Suits could not come up with something better. So they would just rather the customer base flounder. Clear evidence of a management team with no future.

What amazes me is that Comcast management would consider this plan viable. A homeowner on first install could rack up at least $100 in install charges. Assumes it takes 2hrs to install 3 drops in the house with a $25 trouble call thrown in there in the first 30 days. Pretty steep entry cost.

Sounds like its time to buy some Direct TV stock.

You mean, it's up to the tech to decide whether to finish a job in under 10 minutes or take longer and make more money?

Well surely they'll behave in an honest and straightforward fashion!

Is that "New Beginnings" mountain in the last picture the mountain of money they hope to obtain from these new policies?

I hate Comcast so much...

What on Earth is that chasm meant to represent?

Wow, this is some kind of wonderful. Underinvest in install and support. Pay too little to attract competent personnel. Pay too little so that there are multi-week waits for personnel to show. Have lackidaisical system engineers so installs are, by definition, a nightmare for even technically savvy customers. Result: installing a cluster-f*ck.

This all done under a quasi-monopoly system that should be regulated and beaten with a stick in exchange for their quasi-protected status.

Once the enevitable problems erupt, turn around and CHARGE consumers for poor decisions made by Comcast.

JohnMc: one of the problems is that, even if cable is so piss poor in this regard, by the time that average consumers realize how badly they're being screwed by Comcast (e.g., the tech is in their living room), switching to an alternative is unlikely. That's the particularly evil part of this.

I personally never want those moron techs wiring my house anyway.

Exactly why I have DirectTV. No more getting screwed by cable companies, getting screwed by DirectTV is way better.

Wow. This makes me so ... happy. It's ... wonderful ... that I'm forcibly being switched from Insight to Comcast in December.

Yuck.

On the plus side, the previous owners of my home had DirectTV and the dish is already installed... That's looking like a better and better option right now, let me tell you...

How much will they be charging for napping on customers' couches? If the nap is over 10 minutes long, is it a "Custom" nap?

I was a technician (not an installer) for a large cable company. Many customers complain that their bills are high and one thing they forget is the astronomical costs to maintain a cable network, especially with the free in-house support that has been given away. I would often wonder why we were replacing wiring that we did not install, and that in many cases would be damaged because of tampering by the customer.

This is not unfair at all and should be viewed as a sound business decision and nothing more. Those who would have to pay are those with wiring that they damaged, or a line that they wanted installed, which both situations require additional labor, materials and other resources that Comcast would have to expend.

The problem with many consumerist posts and comments is that they are inherently anti-corporation with no regard that sometimes the corporation isn't acting in a sinister manner towards the customer, and may simply be attempting to control costs in an increasingly competitive environment.

Expecting a cable company to perform inside work for free is the same as expecting Ford, Honda or Chevy to work on your car for free. And that doesn't make any sense either.

All I am saying is that instead of attacking the corporation apply a little bit of reason. As for Ben's snide comment at the end of the post...I for one was NEVER late and NEVER missed an appointment. The comment added nothing to the post except the extension of an unfair stereotype.

Good day.

@Pelagius:
An internet cookie for you, for providing me my morning laugh.

@Pelagius: They will need to do an onsite inspection, as specified in the power point documents.

New fees for technical services?

How can they charge for something they never provide anyway??

;)

Comcast technicians are lazy and sloppy. They don't care about planning or aesthetics. They'll poke a hole wherever it needs to go to get signal to your TV using the least amount of time and materials. If they're going to start charging for something they do so poorly, it only confirms what we already know: they're total bastards.

I don't mind being responsible for my inside wiring. That would make it easier for me, actually. Once I rule out inside wiring (by plugging the device directly into the feed), they have no need for access to my home. Therefore, I don't need to take the afternoon off of work to wait for some idiot tech to tell me there's a signal problem or a service outage.

... if only it worked that way ...

Does the ten minute window include naptime and unsolicited come ons, or is that free to Comcast's valued customers?

trai_dep,

In the beginning of this process I would agree with you. But go back and take a look at that third slide -- "Our responsibility stops at the point of entry...". Now given a period of time customers will get wise to this. If an enterprising tech who had his act together, bolted from the Comcast conlogermate he could clean up. It would be surprisingly easy:

[] Show up in the time interval they told the customer.
[] Do the job right the first time and in an orderly fashion.
[] Charge a flat rate even if it was steeper than a hourly rate.

People would DIE for that kind of service.

After moving to an apartment building that Comcast didn't service, I was forced to go with RCN (Chicago). I wasn't expecting anything different, but the tech that came to setup service not only showed up within the time window (gasp!), but he did all the wiring and actually asked me for perferences in how I wanted holes to be made. At the end he was in a slight hurry, but he gave me his number and said to call before I called RCN if anything were to need servicing.

Unfortunately my HD channels never came in and the channel guide would never load, so I gave him a call the next day still not expecting much, though I was impressed the night before. To my surprise, he picked up, and was able to come by same day with a replacement box, since he figured it was a bad box.

Hands down the best tech I've ever had and/or heard about. I called the next day once everything was up and running to talk to his supervisor and compliment his service, because I was completely shocked that anyone remotely that competent was working as a cable technician.

I really hope this does not catch on industry wide. As a TWC Tech (Not a contractor) i try and take pride in the job i do, and i always do my best to make the customer happy, and most are happy we still do free inside work (Might vary by division).

I can see why they would want to do this though from a business aspect. Depending on how a house is wired and how much equipment it has, a service call locally runs from 15 min to 3+ hours. If all i had to do was check the tap and the drop, i could easly get twice as many jobs done, or more.

"I was a technician (not an installer) for a large cable company. Many customers complain that their bills are high and one thing they forget is the astronomical costs to maintain a cable network, especially with the free in-house support that has been given away. I would often wonder why we were replacing wiring that we did not install, and that in many cases would be damaged because of tampering by the customer.

This is not unfair at all and should be viewed as a sound business decision and nothing more. Those who would have to pay are those with wiring that they damaged, or a line that they wanted installed, which both situations require additional labor, materials and other resources that Comcast would have to expend."

I would agree with your post if I thought that subscription fees would come down. Instead what will happen is Comcast will charge for installataion and continue charging the same high or higher rates for subscription fees.

@brw3245: Consumerist is not specifically anti-corporation, is it pro-consumer. Unfortunately, consumers and corporations are often at stark odds with each other. So yes, it comes across as anti-corporation. However there are posts that highlight good examples of customer services, too. It's just that these are, by and large, the exception to the rule.

I'm sure that you were never ever late to an appointment. Yes, we all believe that. Sadly, many of your brethren in the cable industry are not as diligent as you, and are OFTEN late for appointments, and sometimes "late" translates to "never show up at all". I have personally had cable employees show up 30-60 minutes late for appointments.

In addition, I think if Comcast provided better and more reliable overall service and products, people wouldn't be as ticked about stuff like this. But we have heard many stories from people about not getting channels they paid for, repeatedly getting faulty equipment, and who can forget the video of the Comcast employee sacked out on a customer's couch? I am perfectly happy to pay for good service and products. Paying the same amount OR MORE for crappy service and unreliable products, though? Yeah, we're gonna bitch about it.

@SadSam:

Fees that subscribers pay have come down. You simply have to be in a bundled package to see the savings. Getting High speed internet, unlimited long distance telephone and a couple hundred channels for around 100 is a pretty substantial savings. Al a cart TV services will never go down not because cable companies are raising rates above that of inflation, but because each local municipality has its own taxation for these services that they arbritarily raise whenever they see fit. Additionally, the content providers tend to demand more and more. I use Fox News as an example, I believe they were giving away the channel to providers for quite a while just to get on the systems...then they demanded 1.00 per subscriber. ESPN by far is the most expensive. If you think that offering a menu where customers could choose only the channels they want would work think again. Content providers only provide those channels in groups. IN the case of ESPN, if systems didn't supply that channel to those who don't watch sports, all other Disney owned channels would be pulled as well. And Cable companies don't like it anymore than you do. It is a media ownership issue.

I don't work in cable anymore, and actually I have Verizon Fios (which I have mixed feelings about) but many consumers have opinions on cable companies that are generally supported by heresy and the mythical always late "cable guy" sure sometimes that happens like with anyone else, but when I showed up, or any of my other proficient, dedicated tech's showed up to troubleshoot a problem, 90% of the customers were blown away by the level of service received. I actually don't understand the animosity towards this industry.

Corporate management often forgets the basics of a successful business:

Happy, satisfied customers = best course of action for business, as long as it's not bleeding you dry.

Word-of-mouth is the most effective form of advertising, and one's reputation depends highly upon how satisfied your customers are, *NOT* how well you do your job! You can actually do a rather terrible job, keep your customers happy, and have a good reputation. (I'm finding this out as I research air con contractors)

@brw3245: That makes no sense at all. Local municipalities are raising taxes on a la carte services, but not on bundled services?

And $100 (more like $140 here) a month for all three services is not a substantial savings if I don't need one or two of them.

@AndyMan1

"You mean, it's up to the tech to decide whether to finish a job in under 10 minutes or take longer and make more money?"

AFAIK, Techs are not getting any commission whatsoever from this. And to be honest, the decision on whether or not to charge for a trouble call was always in the tech's hands. What happened before was that care was telling customers "Oh yeah, we won't charge you because your watered a potted plant that was on top of your cable box and you spilled" and causing unnecessary grief for the techs.

The media outlets like viacom are raising rate because tv channels that nobody watches like qvc make little revenue.

I mean, who is gonna stay at home and watch infomercial and then order it for a bloated price, while you can get a sweet deal. Die QVC, and HSN, just die, the internet killed you.

Also, CSPAN, nobody really watches CSPAN and some people watch ESPN since you can buy better total access packages.

The only reason to have a satellite is to get international channels, and the only provider that does that efficiently is DISH network, since their equipment is standardized, not bloated with drm, and you can hook up a second reciever to get free-to-air international channels.

For internet, definetely cable, or fios.

For phone, yeah, sorry, the telco is still the best in that market, since cable goes out, especially when your on the phone with a service tech and they remotely reset your modem...so you loose the call.
Yeah, i would probably use vonage, but skype is way better for international calls, since you can videophone too.

brw3245:

I've had a Comcast tech show up late and miss an appointment. Another I asked to run the cable from one side of the house to the other across our first floor roof outside. When I came back upstairs he had run it inside the house, and through a wall. Now I have to run it under my rug (where it is visible and ugly) to get it to my computer on the opposite side of the room.

Speaking for myself, the reason why there is so much animosity towards cable companies is the constant barrage of deals I see offered to new subscribers, while as a loyal subscriber for a dozen years, my rates go up and up and up.

Wow, I wonder what local governments that have franchising agreements with Comcast would think about this...

@brw3245: "I actually don't understand the animosity towards this industry."

First, people can't get the services they want (unbundled channels), which isn't the cable companies' fault, but they're the delivery mechanism so the messenger gets shot.

Second, their customer service lines are notoriously bad or have ridiculously long waits.

Third, I have never in my life actually had a cable technician show up in the FOUR-HOUR WINDOW assigned. One didn't show up until the next day! (Although the company did credit me for the work because of it. But not for the DAY I TOOK OFF to sit on my ass and have him never show up.)

Fourth, many companies have unreliable service. When I was with TWC, we only got TV or internet like half the time. It was absurd. We'd call to say it was out and they'd say "we're not showing any outages in your area." We'd explain how, like, the TV didn't work and they'd say, "No, we show that your TV is working." Um ... because you can tell from there?

We finally dumped cable entirely. We didn't replace with sattelite. We went plain old broadcast antenna. It's stupid to pay $50/month for a service that doesn't work.

I'm not jumping-out-of-my-skin happy with my DSL customer service, but at least it WORKS 99% of the time, so I hardly ever have to call them.

I'd like to say that I'm a comcast customer and have been for at least 5 years and I've NEVER been a happy customer. They have the biggest monopoly in the Seattle area and it's frustrating. There is no one else for cheaper than gives anywhere close to the speeds they offer and aparently Qwest doesn't think FIOS is the wave of the future and it's going to take the state years before they build up the network for it. Everywhere else in the state is going to get FIOS before Seattle...what happened to us being so...tech like? Other countries for years have had 5+ companies for all TV, internet and phone...how is the country that's supposed to be the most capitalistic have only 2 choices...and with one beyond better than the other in speed. I'm just so sick of comcast, this makes me feel even more horrible that today is the day I get to pay their bill.

When I had Comcast cable phone installed years ago, the tech came over on time and when he had finished installing the phone in the living room asked if we wanted an extension in the bedroom. In his words: "But to do that I will need to get a ladder and climb out on the building to get to your connection and then I would have to disconnect the free cable you are receiving as of right now." Needless to say I declined the extra phone in my bedroom and have been enjoying free extended cable for a number of years. (Is it theft when the cable tech gives it to you without asking as a gift?)

Comcast is disgusting and deluded. In all my 47 years, I have never witnessed worse customer service. And now they want us to pay extra for it? Everyone there has a different story: "You have to [procedure]." / "It's impossible to [same procedure]." / "I don't know what [same procedure] is." Moreover, at home and at work I have seen technicians flat-out lie about what was done and/or said. Also, for a while, their billing was so jacked-up, payments were posting as negative-amounts, and auto-payments were being doubled; they unabashedly admitted this to me. I never sit at home and wait for them anymore, because there is no reason to believe a tech will show until he/she actually shows. So all of these astounding frustrations will cost extra now--they are now features? Since calls to Comcast are necessary so very often, here's a trick for you all: After you dial their number, avoid the extension tree by pressing zero-pound (0-#) about four times in a row, and you'll quickly be connected with a real, live, albeit incompetent, human being. Tell 'em I say hi; they all know me by now.

I ditched Comcast for DirectTV and DSL several years ago and couldn't be happier. I was tired of them turning off my set-top box because it wasn't responding to their signals. This happened 3 times in a 6 month period and they refused to turn it back on without requiring an appointment with a tech (as if I was doing something to the damn thing). Then for some unexplained reason the Internet connection kept getting slower and slower. They'd send a tech out, and that person would never find anything wrong, yet the connection just crawled along anyway.

I got ticked and ordered the dish. Imagine my surprise when they showed up on time and actually listed to me about where and how I wanted my outlets installed. When we moved a couple of years later, DTV sent a tech out to install our new place for free, including the dish and 7 outlets. My DSL is at 5 MB and it is always fast. Comcast advertises 6 MB, but that's only if nobody else on your node is using the internet.

I never understand why so many people continue to use cable when satellite is cheaper and at least for me provides better service. The only way Comcast will ever learn that satisfying customers is really the best way to long-term success is by losing a bunch to the competition. Why complain about their monopoly when Dish and DTV offer more for less?

My most recent (last September) Comcast experience was when the guy came to turn cable on in my apartment. He basically suggested that if I bribed him, I'd get a bunch more channels.

It took me awhile to figure out what the heck was going on - at first I thought he was just trying to upsell me (I have the cheapest, most basic package I can get - mostly just the local channels).

But, then he directly asked if I wanted more channels, and that he could do that, and my price would stay the same. Which confused the heck out of me... until he followed up with... "Are you going to take care of your cable guy? Cuz if you are, then your cable guy is going to take care of you..."

This happened to *me* - not a friend, not some random other person - and I was just completely *floored*.

So yeah, I'm not so much a fan of the idiots at Comcast. :/

I have Crapcast and was a "3 Product subscriber" i.e. I had TV, internet, and VoIP. I have had problems with every service. Over the course of 2 months I had 3 techs out for a total of around 8 hours. All of them performed the same tasks over and over, one tech showed up with no tools and had to borrow mine, and none of them fixed the issue. Finally I canceled my VoIP because it was unuseable. I was experiencing about 40% packet loss. Just to entertain the Comcastic folks I replaced every component from the NIC to the Co-Ax, including a new cable modem and router, tested with two different PCs, both fresh installs, and each tech that came out replaced all of the cabling, including all splitters and wall jacks. And I am pretty sure one of the bastards cut my phone lines. The cable and phone hookups were in the same box and when I dropped Comcast VoIP for a Qwest line I found that the wires had been cut from the incoming line to the splice.

Oh, aaaaaannd when I signed up I tried to ask for a self install. They told me that wasn't available in my area?!?!? So I had a choice of a $25 install or a $100 install. I opted for the $25 and had to protest a $150 install charge!

Mother F'ers!

I am one failure away from dropping these A-holes.

If you are not a Comcast victim yet and are thinking of giving it a try, think again...

I currently work for Comcast...what this new policy is stating is that we are not coming out there to hookup things like your surround sound system and HD TV when they are still in the box. Our job is to get your CABLE working. We do not have a problem hooking up the box to your tv and hooking up dvd players etc. We are only allotted so much time per job and if your asking us to hook up 4 tv's and only 2 are on the work order you should be responsible for the charges.
If there is a problem within the first 30 days with something we have done or with our equipt (tiling, fuzzy pic, etc) there will be no charge. If we come back out there 2 days later because your tv is not on channel 3 there will be a $24.95 charge.
I hear everyone preaching about direct tv, verizon etc, but when they come out if you don't have their service protection plan you are stuck paying them just to walk thru the door, then pay in 1/2 hour increments.
Here's some advice...for the most part when you call for a new install or upgrade the sales reps will waive install fee's. Make sure you tell the rep how many outlets we are going to be installing for you and have the fees waived. Then when us techs get out to your house we don't have to be the bad guy and hit you up with extra charges...we don't get commissions for installing extra outlets and don't like having to charge you any more than you like having to pay

:( i hate comcast

Personally the demarcation should be where it enters the house. They've screwed up a ton of installations over the years and have been coming back and bringing them to the NEC over time. This document seems to say I'll now be responsible for nearly ~50-75ft of coax that I wasn't responsible for previously. Yikes.

To be fair, you really need the whole picture. Comcast has always had a charge for service calls in the system. The problem is that that charge is not automatically added, it has to be selected at the time the service call is scheduled. Comcast started cracking down on this practice.

Also another reason behind the crackdown, customers call up and demand a truck roll for something they can do themselves with a little help over the phone. One example, customers demanding a truck roll to program a remote, to hook up a vcr (not comcast equipment).

The same goes for the internet side of things, truck rolls to hook up customer owned routers, to setup email (customer had the time to call support to order someone to come out and do something they can be walked through over the phone).

Comcast is offering a choice in the matter. If you sign up for service protection plan for $2.95 a month all your internal wiring is covered no matter how many times a tech is sent to your house. This even covers phone wiring, even if you do not have comcast phone service. If you do not opt to take the service protection plan you may be charged $24.70 per visit (and that is only if the trip was avoidable). If it is a problem in the comcast plant (wiring up to the house) there is no charge for that service call.

I work for a cable company. One of Comcast's competitors.

Would you like to know how much it costs us to roll a truck out to a subscriber's home, after all costs are figured in?

300 bucks.

And the most we ever charge a subscriber for an unnecessary service call?

46.95

So service calls requiring a truck rollout is a HUGE money sink for cable companies.

Fortunately, the company I work for doesn't mind (now anyways) if we roll a truck out. We're told "Do what you can on the phone, but in the end, if you think you need to, send the truck out. Make the customer happy."

Now to get off of the damn night shift. I hate this.

Another crappy part of all this is that Comcast is vague, with there techs, on what they are suppose to do.
But they will say that they need to get the job done in ten minutes. Reality says that it going to take more than 10 minutes. but if the techs fast talk enough and pull off some other crap they can do it.

What I'm trying to say is that;

Honest good working people that try to do a good job are going to get looked down on because to do the job is going to take longer than 10 minutes.

While people that talk out of there ass and cheat are going to be rewarded for a good job.

:(

I hate to rant but I worked in a call centre before and the people that got rewarded didn't give a F and people that tried to honestly make things work where told, that they are not working hard enough

It sounds like CableCard activation is going to be custom then. I believe it took my Comcast guy well over 30 minutes to figure out what to do with the "TiVo cards" (as he called them). Sounds shady...

I notice from several people on here that the quality of service has not been that great. What do you folks expect for free? Maybe if they start paying market value to attract quality technicians the service would improve.

Currently I have Comcast for internet and TV. AT&T is offering TV/Internet to compete; I can also go to Dish or DirecTV. We've been discussing changing; more channels for less $ and internet (DSL) that's almost as fast. the one thing stopping me is that I had DSL when it came out and the connection was not reliable. I'd hate to switch and find out they still haven't fixed the wiring on my street.

What?? Why SHOULDN'T Comcast charge for inside wiring..it's YOUR house! I was a tech for 2 years and was pretty peeved that we re-wired customer's homes on our dime. The cable company is only responsible for maintaining the cable from the pole to the outside tap at the residence. Inside wiring is all the telephone wiring inside a residence that is the responsibility of the building owner. Generally, the point that defines where the telephone company's responsibility ends and the building owner's responsibility begins is called the demarcation point or NID. I may state that this also applies to the coaxial cable as well that suplies your HSD and video services...after all, it's YOUR house. I was berated by customers and demanded by them to talk to my supervisor because I am not a Windows Help Desk technician/Network Techinician/electrican/computer hardware and software tech and cable tech all rolled into one.

People, PLEASE take ownership of yourselves and realize that your cable company is just that, and not your home builder and personal help desk.

I must say also that a large proportion of my calls were from customers that don't know how to set up their new Hi Def tvs. When did we become Toshiba technicians? Don't by ma and pa that new TV unless you are prepared to show them how to use it. And don't yell at us because you don't RTFM.

i also work for comcast and let me tell you, they also offer what is called "cable guard" this an insurance for the cables inside your house, is $1.49 a month, but they will only charge the customer if it's a customer's problem, like cables damaged inside your house, if it's comcast problem, they'll fix it for free!

@brw3245: Sorry to be all late to the game and shit, but you're wrong in this case. This new policy is all about charging customers out the ass whenever possible. I know because I've seen the rest of the PowerPoint presentation in question.

@kuipo: If you work for Comcast then you should know that charging for the Service Protection Plan is not really a scam.

Inside wiring is not the responsibility of the provider. All that the provider is responsible for is making sure that the signal coming into the house at the tap is good, and any provided equipment is in good working order.

This means it's not our fucking problem if you live in a shitty house with shitty wires. And this is one place where I will back up my employer; it's not our job to fix your shitty wiring. Think of it this way: If you improperly wire an outlet, do you blame the electric company when you start shit on fire?