Best Buy calls 911 after Consumerist reader RJH asks for a refund on a nonworking Tony Bennet CD.
Sooooo RJH buys the CD and goes to his car to play it. He gets “Disk read error” three times. RJH walks back in with his three minute old album and receipt and asks for a refund.
The clerk tells him there’s state and federal laws against refunding money. Our guy calls him a fool.
Manager comes and says the guy can have a substitute disk or leave, or else the manager will have him arrested for trespassing.
Guy laughs.
Manager calls 911…
UPDATE: RJH wrote in again to clarify some issues. Posted inside. Highlights:
• The Best Buy was in Altanta, GA, in the North Metro area.
• He paid cash, not with gift card.
• RJH says he got so incensed at Best Buy because of, “…[T]he countless times they steamroll other customers who do not have the wherewithal I do to fight ludicrous charges like this. The bottom line is that I could care less about the fifteen bucks, it was the idea that a major retailer can just sit there and make it up as they go.”
RJH writes:
- “I was out shopping with my daughter, Z and her brother yesterday, trying to use those dreaded gift cards, the one of interest was from Best Buy.
While they are looking for music, I see the new Tony Bennett CD, kind of a Duets and I decide to spring for the fifteen bucks.
We get to the car and I pop it in and see “Bad Disk” on my player. I tried unsuccessfully three times to get it to work, but alas, it must have been a bad disk. So I walk back into the store with my three minute old receipt and show it to the door guard who shows me to the return line. Now I have owned this thing for three minutes and I just want to swap it out. It is three days after xmas and I really do not want to go through the entire return process so when I finally get to the front of the line; the customer service trainer is waiting on me. I tell him, forget it, just give me my money back, it is a bad disk.
He tells me there are state and federal laws against them refunding my money at which I literally laugh out loud. I said there are no such laws. He claimed there were and I said, if you believe that you are a fool. Then I asked to see a copy of the law at which point the “manager” showed up. He said that he would show me the law it was right out the front door and If I did not leave, they would have me arrested for trespassing. At this point the manager says I can have another disk or be arrested for trespassing. I asked again to check the CD, it was a bad CD.
I am thinking this is a riot, let’s just see where this goes.
Sure enough, he calls 911 for a trespasser in his store.
I am literally laughing out loud. I go back to the car where the kids are and explain that I will be a few more minutes. I get my phone and call my wife and tell her what is going on.
Then I call corporate in MN. I explain what is going on and the “senior customer consultant” tell me to please hold after he agrees that it is an out of control situation. The first question that corporate asked me was if they actually checked the CD to see if it was bad. I told him that they did not check it in spite of my requests.
About this time the manager comes to me and says that it looks like the cops ain’t coming so he will give me the money back.
Now the cops show up, (three officers in two cars!) I have the customer service people refunding my money, the three cops looking for me, and me on hold with corporate.
I get my money then approach the cops and explain my side of the story. They just shake their head. I apologize for the store manager wasting their resources. I was kind of hoping that they would arrest me.
I finally get the guy from corporate back on the line and he commits to calling me tomorrow with resolution.
Turns out it wasn’t a call from him I got today, the store manager called. I went over the details with her and after what seems like a thirty minute discussion she admitted there is not a federal or state law against a store refunding a customer for a defective product. She then asked what it would take to make it right, I told her to think about it and call me back. She did call back later today and offered me a twenty five dollar gift card. I asked her to donate it to Salvation Army and guess what, they can’t do that either.”
Pathetic. Kudos to RJH for standing up to these Best Buy mendicants. They didn’t count on a customer calling their bluff. Doubt RJH will be purchasing many Tony Bennet CDs from them again.
What this means for your weekend: If you believe a store is wrong, stand up for yourself.
Meet their threats with complete confidence.
Be like Violent Acres, who, on the advice of her Marine father, kicked a bully in the nuts with her Cabbage Patch rollerskates and yelled while standing over his body, “I’LL EAT YOUR EYES! I’LL EAT ALL OF YOUR EYES!”
See you in 2007.
— BEN POPKEN
UPDATE: RJH writes in again to clarify some issues.
- “Ben it was in the North Metro Atlanta Area, I’d rather not share their names….
to refute some of the bullshit claims…. (and the temperature that day was in the 60′s) I originally talked to a male manager then the store manager called me later (the she).
I paid for my purchase with cash, not my daughters gift card.
As soon as I walked in the store, I told the door guard that I just needed to swap it out it was a bad disk. He referred me to the exchange line. I mentioned the “customer service trainer” moniker because if anyone should know how not to lie to a customer, it should have been him. Had he simply said that is against store policy, I would have asked for the manager. As soon as he lied, all bets were off with him. The first thing the store manager said was leave and if you don’t I’ll call 911 and have you arrested.
One of the real reasons I get so upset in these situations is the countless times they steamroll other customers who do not have the wherewithal I do to fight ludicrous charges like this. The bottom line is that I could care less about the fifteen bucks, it was the idea that a major retailer can just sit there and make it up as they go.”
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Wait a minute… Didn’t they, in fact, offer to replace the defective disk? That’s a reasonable offer. Why wasn’t it accepted? It seems to me that refusing to accept this reasonable offer is the unreasonable action that set the rest in motion.
Sure, they could have — and maybe should have — just resigned themselves to the idea that they were dealing with an unreasonable customer, and handed over the money before spending so much time and resources fighting over it. But if it’s a virtue for us, as consumers, to stand-up for what’s right no matter what the cost, why shouldn’t it be right for them to stand up for what’s right, and not let someone take advantage of them?
A fair resolution was offered when the store offered to follow their (industry standard) policy, and replace the disk. The fair resolution was refused by an unreasonable customer. Spinning the story to make the jerk who wouldn’t accept a fair resolution into some kind of a hero is wrong.
If more business would have a backbone and refuse to let unreasonable customers take advantage of them, the returns counter wouldn’t have lines of scammers there driving up costs for the rest of us who are willing to play by the rules.
The customer didn’t accept the reasonable offer of a replacement disk, and instead decided to stand his ground to the point of absurity. What a fine example he set for his children: Throw a tantrum if you want more than your fair share.
OK, industry standard doesn’t mean good, it just means everybody does it. People toss industry standard out in the comments like it’s some golden stamp of approval. “Gasp! How dare they disagree, it’s the industry standard.” It is a rare occasion that the industry standard works in favor of the consumer.
If you’re going to defend something, tell us why and leave the “everybody does it” out of it.
wholzem, it may be that the disk was defective by design, rather than as a result of a manufacturing error. That is, it may not be a compliant audio CD, meaning the replacement wouldn’t work, either.
I just looked it up, and Tony Bennett’s label is Columbia, which is owned by Sony, famous for malevolent “copy protection” schemes.
That falls mostly on Sony, but if Best Buy is selling intentionally crippled media, they should be doing a better job informing their customers.
As others have mentioned the cause of the disc read errors may have actually been the result of over-zealous copy protection. Odds are, this Tony Bennet CD didn’t conform to CD standards. In such cases a replacement disc will do the consumer no good.
In either case, it is certainly not too much to ask to get a refund…
The Sony settlement over root kits and other DRM protection does not include any Tony Bennet albums, so bad software probably isn’t the reason. Still stuff like this puts Columbia and Best Buy in a bad light. IANAL, but the implied warranty of merchantibility means that a CD should play in a CD player, any CD player, no ands, ifs, or buts.
I got burned by a Foo Fighters album where the music was unrippable and only available in pre-compressed WMA format. Never again will I buy music that is not Red Book compatible. Dual Discs are slightly different because the disc thickness is out of spec, but the music files are still untampered CDA.
RJH writes:
“”Ben it was in the North Metro Atlanta Area, I’d rather not share their names….
to refute some of the bullshit claims…. (and the temperature that day was in the 60′s) I originally talked to a male manager then the store manager called me later (the she).
I paid for my purchase with cash, not my daughters gift card.
As soon as I walked in the store, I told the door guard that I just needed to swap it out it was a bad disk. He referred me to the exchange line. I mentioned the “customer service trainer” moniker because if anyone should know how not to lie to a customer, it should have been him. Had he simply said that is against store policy, I would have asked for the manager. As soon as he lied, all bets were off with him. The first thing the store manager said was leave and if you don’t I’ll call 911 and have you arrested.
One of the real reasons I get so upset in these situations is the countless times they steamroll other customers who do not have the wherewithal I do to fight ludicrous charges like this. The bottom line is that I could care less about the fifteen bucks, it was the idea that a major retailer can just sit there and make it up as they go.”
yellojkt, the Sony rootkit settlement only affected specific types of DRM that included the rootkit.
Sony still uses DRM, just not that specific type, XCP. So the CD would not install a rootkit on his computer, but it is entirely possible that it still wouldn’t play on his car CD player because of another DRM technique.
@TheConsumeriste
My last paragraph wasn’t designed to hold water molecules of any sort; my apologies if I said anything that gave that impression. Also, since it engendered such confusion, I’ll offer a word of clarification regarding my second paragraph. It was addressed to the unnamed Best Buy manager. “You” referred to the manager; “he” and the first occurrence of “this” referred to the customer. Fair warning: In what follows I will make free use of personal pronouns–first, second, and third person might make an appearance. If you find yourself confused, simply ask a native English speaker for help.
I don’t think, and never said, that the customer was doing anything criminal which might lead to his arrest. That he wasn’t arrested does nothing to vitiate my suggestion that he was doing more than he lets on in his tale. I was simply stating the obvious-that this is his account of what happened, and therefore shouldn’t be taken as an objective view of the events. The story seems carefully calculated to make the situation maximally outrageous and absurd. (Does anyone else think it somewhat unbelievable that the manager abruptly decides to call the police for no apparent reason?). It’s certainly possible that things were just as he described them, and that the manager wildly overreacted. I just doubt it.
If this is precisely what happened, if the manager really did handle the situation just as described, then it doesn’t justify all the hand-wringing going on. Perhaps the manger was poorly trained, or perhaps he was just overwhelmed at that moment, or perhaps he just isn’t very good at his job. Whatever the case, this seems like a peculiar incident and it certainly doesn’t seem indicative of corporate malfeasance. It was simply a stupid and rash decision by a harried manager in response to what was clearly an abrasive and rude customer.
Having worked in retail, my sympathies and loyalty tend to extend to the manager. But whatever actually happened, it doesn’t seem worthy of praise. The customer was demeaning and condescending and the manager, while likely abrupt and bumbling, was just a single individual, not the head of some massive corporate organ. This isn’t as a glorious triumph of the little guy over corporate “mendicants.” It’s just a depressing tale of meanness and stupidity.
Seems the request for a cash refund was pretty darned reasonable. The dolts at the store could’ve at least checked originally if the disc was playable.
Whats up with the supposed Best-Buy Employee responding here, and saying that the RJH was yelling racist slurs all over the place and being a liar?
I just read this thread and decided to add a little something, Location Best Buy in Valdosta Georgia, I know this is true because I witnessed it, my coworker bought a digital camera and purchased the extended warranty. after 6 weeks the camera stopped working, she took the camera back to best buy and requested a replacement, now you have to understand she is a not very assertive blonde, the maager proceeds to tell her that sorry the camera is discontinued, it was pointed out to the manager that thats fime the extended warranty said comparable replacement and a comparable camera was pointed out that was on sale for 350.00 the price was not the issue comparable product was. she was bullied into accepting a 200.00 dollar 3.1 megapixal camera to replace the 500.00 dollar 5 megapixal camera with docking port.
Our small company used to spend $4-6 thousand annually in the Hickory, N.C.
store on computers, software, cameras, etc. We unfortuately received the same shitty “arrest”
threat over defective on-site repair work…result: total purchases made by our company since 2001..$-0-..screw them, hope they piss off more people, so they suffer a bigger $$$
loss..we will actually pay more $$$
just to avoid Best-Buy..
When will WE learn? DO NOT SHOP AT BEST BUY!!! as a former employee I tell you truth when I say that the employees are trained to LIE and CHEAT you out of your money!!! NO LIE….