Wow. This woman doesn't seem interested in customer service and/or selling beer. I wouldn't shop there. Now my First Amendment Sense is all offended.

(Also, she seems kinda big on the interrupting.)

From here on, I'll be letting my girlfriend speak directly. The Wine Press makes a fair point that this story is currently being passed along by parties several times removed.

To be fair, however, my girlfriend called back as soon as she got home and was told that the person she dealt with was unavailable.

She can't call Shannon during the day because she's at work, but she'll try to call this evening.

By the way, since Shannon asked, my girlfriend is a graduate student.

I like how she uses almost every ounce of knowledge she has gained from her business 101 class from the community college.

Shannon that is... not keith-ma's girlfriend.

From here on, I'll be letting my girlfriend speak directly. The Wine Press makes a fair point that this story is currently being passed along by parties several times removed.

To be fair, however, my girlfriend called back as soon as she got home and was told that the person she dealt with was unavailable.

My girlfriend can't call Shannon during the day because she's at work, but she'll try to call this evening.

By the way, since Shannon asked, my girlfriend is a graduate student.

Newsflash: People from MAAAHSSachusetts can be brash and obnoxious.

Boy, as soon as she hears that one of her customers has been wronged, she is just overwhelmed with concern, isn't she?

I don't understand the world of morality that managers like this exist in. Why is it that when a customer is treated like dog shit, it's the customer's obligation to let the store try to "resolve" it before any other action is taken? It's generally responsible and productive to let management know, but that doesn't preclude other courses of action. The guy has every right to tell his story to whoever will listen.

At least Shannon mentioned an owner, so if her feistiness continues, there's one more layer to pursue here. It's hard to tell how she is going to handle the call from an actual customer. On the one hand, she mostly seemed indignant that she was talking to a journalist (even worse, a blogger), but then at times she seemed to be preparing to undermine the customers story—like when she asked, "Is she a B.U. student?!" with barely-contained disdain. There was definitely a sense that if the offended customer was a young college student, she couldn't give a flying fuck about the quality of service, or lack thereof.

One last side note: My favorite moment was when Shannon expressed great dismay at all the deeply "personal" questions she was being asked. As far as I could tell, the only remotely personal question Ben asked was her name.

I thought Shannon was going to go into specifics on the doctor's appointment thing! I hope everything works out for her.

Wow. That really leaves a bad taste in the mouth, eh? (the phone call, not the beer - although I'm not a fan o' Guinness).

I gotta say, this feels to me like there's some sort of karmic smackdown due these people, and because the universe is probably a bit busy with some of the other karmic atrocities going on in other parts of the world, perhaps 'we' should take it upon ourselves to teach these folks a lesson in manners.

('we' is in quotes because I live on the other side of the continent and across a border)

[heh. I just realised that the 'eh?' in the post above probably tipped you off to the 'across a border' part]

[heh. I just realised that the 'eh?' in the previous post probably made the 'across a border' comment unnecessary]

How about a transcript?

Working on transcript right now, few more minutes....

This seals it.
I now urge everybody who reads this to call the store and express how they feel about this.
Tell them you read about it in the Consumerist blog. They will quickly realize that bloggers are ten times more effective than "journalists" when it comes to garnering quick community response.

" The Wine Press makes a fair point that this story is currently being passed along by parties several times removed."

Lol aint that a bitch, word of mouth about bad service spreading all over like that. Kinda makes you wish you had treated a customer with respect doesnt it...

As a kinda funny aside from this whole thing, as I said I was a Extra Stout drinker, and there is a reason for it. In NJ for a long time it was impossible to find either the bottles or the cans of the regular stout. So my mom used to buy me the extra by accident because she thought that was the only one they had (this was right when the special device was created and they had started advertising the regular stuff)

After a few goofs on getting the wrong beer I got to the point of actually liking the extra to today where its the bottle beer of choice for me. Personally I find lauger too watery which is why I like my beer with some meat to it.

Wow, I hate you say it, but you got your butt handed to you.

You can't win them all. A+ for the effort!

"Newsflash: People from MAAAHSSachusetts can be brash and obnoxious."

People from aaaaaaaaanywhere can be brash and obnoxioius. Let's refrain from casting aspersions on an entire state/completely misunderstanding the accent.

Like a ferocious schnauzer.

You know, at first I almost agreed with VentMan, but after the convo finished, I realized that she was just really antagonistic and defensive right from the start. She made some interesting points, but overall you could certainly tell she was not someone used to not getting her way. She was certainly more interested in the store's reputation than she was in resolving the issue.

And the hunt for her age/generation was very strange- I agree she was hoping it would be a younger person so she could write it off or assume they were the ones causing trouble.

And then the "emergency doctor's appointment" comment was extremely odd. Drawing sympathy? I don't know. Maybe she was so preoccupied with it and that's why she was so edgy.

...Really? You folks think she's being unreasonable?

I think she made some very valid points and I'm pretty sure I would react in a similar manner. Its one thing to get called up by an angry customer; its a whole nother thing to get called up by an online blog that's essentially flamebaiting me. I believe she was (for the most part) quite professional, albeit defensive.

And yeah, I have to agree, you got your ass handed to you. Always fun to listen to your calls, though :)

In "Pwning" me in the call, Shannon only proved The Wine Press needs an attitude adjustment.

Yeah, it's weird and offensive that she kept asking so many pointed questions about Ben's role in the whole thing, and about the girlfriend's age group. I think Shannon just wanted to be able to compartmentalize/marginalize people and thus discount what they have to say -- if Ben's "just a blogger" and the girlfriend is "just a college student." And all of her interruptions are annoying.

Maybe she had to have an emergency doctor's appointment to get that stick removed from her ass.

Wow. Personally, the original story didn't move me much, and I'm someone who's reduced to tears by mean people on a daily basis.

But after hearing the call. Ugly. Ugly, ugly, ugly. Shannon actually did herself the disservice of taking a he-said-she-said story and exposing herself as the kind of person I don't want to deal with. Ever. Even for beer, and I loves me some beer.

To her credit, she did finally pull herself together toward the end of the call.

That lady sounds like an incredible bitch. I live in MA and I feel like going to this store just to talk with them myself.

You would think she would be a little friendlier considering your talking to her about customer service..I mean giving someone a rude tone right off the bat is just crazy and only solidifies the claims of the person who was harrassed.

I don't think any of the "third party" defense is relevant.

Say I see a news story that states a former employee of a liquor store came to the police with allegations that the store's owner was running a prostitution ring out of the back room.

If I call the liquor store to confirm and instead of denying the allegations or respectfully denying to comment on the situation they're antagonistic about my "third party information", then I'm going to think there is something up which is fishy.

Perfect customer service would have been to say:

"I'm not aware of this situation. I sincerely apologize if that is in fact true. Would it be possible for this customer to contact me so I can discuss it with her directly and maybe get some more information?"

Is that so difficult?

I thought she handled it very well. She gets a call asking about beer, that quickly morphs into an amateurish "ambush" stunt ("do you have a policy against humiliating your customers?"), then turns into an interview from some random dude, from some website she's never heard of. I think she handled it pretty well. You can't read her tone, and she might've been rude, but on paper, she did great (except for the "is she a college student" stuff).

I'm not letting Ben off the hook for that juvenile Carl-Monday-crossed-with-the-Jerky-Boys opening. This is the thing - we want to be treated like professionals and not dismissed as "just bloggers," then we have to act accordingly. Look at this from her persepctive, put yourself in her shoes when she answers the phone, and I think she acted pretty professionally. "Please have the person involved call me" is the right response.

Was it "bad customer service" to NOT handle the issue through a mostly-informed media guy following up on an email from the victim's boyfriend?

Although she was a bitch, her reaction is understandable.

Imagine 60 Minutes calling you up and informing you that a friend of a friend told them that you molest small woodland creatures, and they already ran a story repeating these allegations. You'd be a little upset that they didn't call you first to get your side of the story.

Yes, different medium, more extreme situation, but you get the drift. Her reaction is understandable. That's not to say that she shouldn't have handled it better.

Hmmm, just me having problems with posting this morning?

She lost my sympathy at this: "SHANNON: I doubt we would have said that she was an idiot for asking."

Honey, the correct response for a manager who just heard an accusation about their employee being a dick is:

(Mentally): "Who the hell does this guy think he is, how dare he accuse us, etc." Go to town thinking the caller's an idiot. I know I probably would, in automatic self-defense.
(Verbally): "Oh no, sir, I'm sorry to hear that. I wasn't aware of any such incident - do you have the name of the employee and/or the complainant so I can pursue this further and get it straightened out?"

'Cause see, Shannon, I hear managers are supposed to, at least out loud, render *customer service,* not customer interference. Who knew?!

Was it 'bad customer service' to NOT handle the issue through a mostly-informed media guy following up on an email from the victim's boyfriend?

This is a bit of a strawman. I don't think anyone is arguing that she should have handled the issue through Ben. He was calling up to get information as a consumer advocate. Jaboobie absolutely nailed it with what would have been the "perfect" response. In fact, she didn't have to be polite. It would have been fine if she had just said, "Look, if there was a customer service issue, I want to address it, but I have to speak to the customer in question in order to handle it properly. Tell her to call me. Thank you and goodbye"

I agree that Ben could have been more professional, and I also think that Ben got his ass handed to him. But that doesn't mean Shannon was right. From the outset she was dismissive of the complaint and then defensive. Her concern focused almost entirely on the website rather than the potential problem with her store. On the few occasions that she did get back to the actual issue, it was mostly to discredit and cast doubt. She did not handle it well.

By the way, the transcript is helpful, but it does miss a lot of the tone you can pick up in the audio.

Oooh, I HATE it when the clerks try to turn it around and make it your fault. My mother and I were in CVS the other day, and the clerk just completely ignored my mom who was standing right in front of her for a good 5 minutes, then started talking to the customer behind her (apparently she'd just picked up some meds or something and had to come back for something else). I said to the clerk, "I know you had to help that lady, but you could have said "I'll be right with you" to my mom." She's like, "I help the customers in the order they come to me..." Wrong answer - that lady was BEHIND my mom...

How was she combative?

By the way, since Shannon asked, my girlfriend is a graduate student.

Shannon had no business asking the question, in my opinion. You girlfriends age (at my school saying you're a grad student doesn't really narrow it down enough) and education level are irrelevant to the conversation and the original incident, unless this guy has a habit of hasseling college students.

Though it costs us getting our ass totally kicked in the conversation

If by 'getting our ass totally kicked' you mean 'treated with disrespect and an unwarrented amount of snobbery', I agree.

Actually, she behaves just like the guy from the original complaint. The conversation should have ended with, "Shannon, okay. Alright, I will do so. Thank you." But, like the guy who called the customer an idiot, she has to keep it going. She has to 'prove' she's right about it not happening, just like the employee had to 'prove' that beer didn't exist.

She gets mad when Ben asks for her name but Shannon is the one who tells him to have the customer call her. How is he supposed to do that without a name?

If I were Keith's girlfriend and I listened to that call, I don't think I'd feel much like calling up Shannon to get this issue resolved. I mean, would you want to talk to that lady? The male employee who did the original humilating obviously takes his cues from his boss.

Yeah, I have an appointment...yeah, an EMERGENCY appointment. That's the ticket.

In the original post Keith mentioned that a female employee rang up his girlfriend's purchase, and shot her a sympathetic glance. Any chance this female employee was Shannon?
I also agree that questioning the girlfriend's occupation/education level was insane and totally irrelevant. As long as she's over 21 it doesn't really matter, does it?
She's got a point about not wanting to go into detail with a third party about an incident she claims she was unaware of, but any reporter should be able to call a business to confirm their story without being treated like crap. Just give whatever stock reporter response her business has, if any, and ask that the consumer call her directly if she'd like to get the problem resolved.

Sorry if I missed this, Ben, but did you get consent to record this phone call? Massachusetts is one of those states that requires all party consent for telephone recording.

http://www.pimall.com/nais/n.recordlaw.html

First she says:

"Okay, why don't you have your friend come in to talk to me or give me call, okay? I'm here all day."

But then she says this later in the conversation:

"I mean, I'm going to be here for a while, I'm not sure how long I'll be here just because I have a doctor's appointment, uhm uhm I'm waiting to find out about a doctor's appointment, emergency doctor's appointment..."

Did she somehow make a doctor's appointment while on the phone with Ben?

"SHANNON: Okay, why don't you have your friend come in to talk to me or give me call, okay? I'm here all day.

CONSUMERIST: Okay, can I have your name?

SHANNON: Shannon.

CONSUMERIST: Shannon, okay. Alright, I will do so. Thank you."

Shannon should have ended it right there...

You know... when I read the transcript first I thought she had good points. I can hear her voice and there's an attitude but I'm trying to be objective.

I suppose I would say that neither side handled it perfectly. Ben would have better served by clearly identifying himself when she answered the phone. I think it might have put her off when he simply asked about them having Guinness and then questioning her on the store policy (which is unrelated to the issue at hand).

By not clearly identifying himself he creates the image that he might be trying to mislead her (you know media people never do that right?). So she's bound to get defensive. If you run that up to the next point that this is all hearsay then of course she's going to get more skeptical.

She's bound to question the ethics of posting the story on the Internet without giving her a chance to respond. At that point in time she hadn't even had a chance to see what was posted and I would guess she was thinking that it was pretty bad. I'd be more curious what her opinion is after reading it and seeing that Consumerists part of the article was really inconsequential and merely reprinted a letter they received.

Another point to consider is the sheer amount of idiots who want to make crank phone calls these days and get themselves on the web I would think people will just naturally be more defensive when things aren't clearly stated up front.

I guess the point is that we shouldn't just take shots at Shannon here. While she could have handled the conversation better, I don't think she handled it poorly.

One other item of note, many many many people don't know what Guinness Extra Stout is. I'm curious why Shannon said her store sold it when the employee supposedly doesn't even have it in the order book. I wouldn't be surprised if they did NOT sell it and Shannon even got it confused with Guinness Draft which is a different style stout entirely.

@Spr1dle: Well, as mentioned in that link, a multi-state call where the law differs in each state is a grey area. Personally, I would argue that the call originated in a state where one-party consent applies, so no law was broken.

I still like the idea of internets people calling them and asking if they have it in stock.

Kerry may be right- you know, when listening to Shannon question *when* she actually fell into tears, it sounded fishy-- maybe that was Shannon that rang her up? I guess the girlfriend can confirm. And then the weird doctor's appointment thing...

What a constructive question Ben asks: "Do you have a policy against humiliating customers?" So, was the goal of this call to gather information, or simply to provoke and antagonize? Calling someone to ask berating, rhetorical questions seems like borderline harassment. (Although that still compares favorably to the behavior Keith's girlfriend described, which was borderline psychotic.)

Also: I think it's a stretch to call Consumerist "professional" unless your conduct follows journalistic rules like asking fair questions, identifying yourself as a reporter at the start of the call, disclosing that you're recording even if you're not legally required to do so (except if you're conducting an undercover sting, you sneaky things), and qualifying unverified claims with the word "alleged" such as in your sentences like "the employee's actions are absolutely rephrensible and unwarranted."

Call yourself a blog, call yourself a consumer advocate, call yourself an independent contractor ... but "professional" isn't a word I'd use to describe Consumerist.

I'm thinking the woman Ben talked too may be one of the owners, judging by how defensive she got and her reaction to the story being posted on here. This is probalby why she was more concerned about the bad press than the bad service.

wow, what a bitch. haven't listened to the recording, haven't heard the tone of voice, don't need to. the simple fact that the conversation went on for as long as it did is proof enough that the lady has a severe problem.

it doesn't matter who's calling, it doesn't matter what the chain of information is, all of that is irrelevant to her problem. her problem is that a customer got bad service, and she needs more information. the only thing she needs to convey is the need to talk to the customer directly to find out what happened. she established that early on, but everything that followed afterwards was unnecessary garbage. that she pushed the issue any further is proof that she handled the call badly.

if ben had been the one pushing the issue, she should have politely insisted on needing to hear from the customer, and ended the call. but she was the one who dragged things out, so the fault for the call having turned into a confrontation is entirely hers.

i hope the girl that was offended gets some form of payback, and i hope the store loses some sales over this.